--I think I imagined Laketown as closer to the shore and as a medieval village on stilts. In DoS as we the approach the town it appears more solid than that, almost as if it was on an island, but once we are inside that illusion is dispelled. Perhaps its design elements show more of an Eastern influence than the European look that I had imagined. But movie Laketown is great IMO, far superior to anything I ever envisioned. This is one of my favourite sets in all the five movies and more than most looks like a real place where people live and work and do real things, rather than the Renn Fair vibe that I got in some of PJ’s other ME towns.

Same here. I had the stilts in my head, with not nearly as much detail to it all. I didn't imagine it being so populated, either. Definitely looks like a real place, as you said.

3. The Lake-town theme is revealed in this moment. Any thoughts on this motif, or the music in general?

--Everybody, including me, seems to love the Laketown theme, Shore’s “lake shanty”, even those who don’t care for the soundtrack otherwise. For me it evokes a sense of a bustling, busy community based on a “maritime” economy. It is also a bit regal and since it plays over Bard’s entrance into Laketown, it seems applicable to him as well. The music becomes quieter and more ominous for Bard and Alfrid’s confrontation but then the Laketown theme bursts out again triumphantly as Bard sculls away into the town with his barrels of fish and Dwarves.

Well said. I like your like about it being a bustling, busy maritime community. That sums up my thoughts quite well. There's that hint of regality to it, which is neat as well. It really conveys the idea that this town has fallen from what it used to be.

--The customs system is clearly designed to allow the Master complete control over all commerce in the town and to give him a cut of all transactions. However, it’s clear also that the customs officials are not entirely honest and are willing to ignore the regulations because Percy must have seen the fish in Bard’s barrels and was prepared to let him pass without comment. Maybe Bard has an “arrangement” with him.

My best guess is your last sentence being true. The way they talked reminded me of people who know that they're phones are wire-tapped, so they intentionally try to sound normal, as if nothing is out of the ordinary.

--I love Alfrid and have from the beginning. He is similar to Grima on the surface of course but to me is less over-the-top and theatrical; Alfrid seems more real. Ryan Gage’s performance is wonderful IMO. He brings a slimy, sardonic chirpiness to this corrupt character that makes him almost endearing.

I like how conversational he is, particularly with the Master. It just feels natural, and not forced.

11. Any thoughts on the staging of this scene? Cinematography? Editing? Lots of actors moving about on a tiny boat, all of a sudden.

--Of course we have all seen how the guards start dumping fish into the lake and we hear the splashing as Bard talks to Alfrid, but when they stop that barrels are still full. Ah, well.

Good eye. Hadn't noticed that yet!

--Alfrid might be able to have Bard arrested but as he says, Bard has the favour of the people and so Alfrid would need some kind of reason for moving on Bard that they would accept. Rioting is apparently a real possibility. Bard seemingly loses his popular support when he goes up against Thorin and the dreams of wealth that the Dwarf spouts. This leaves him vulnerable.

It's interesting, because I never got the vibe (from what we saw) that anyone in Lake-town was actually on Bard's side. They seemed to respect what he said, but I cannot recall a moment in which anyone other than his children give him much credit.

-- There is also a hint of a threat from Bard, an implication that the tables could be turned on the Master.

Very true.


18. Does this scene remind you of any other films, either in the sets or execution of the scene? Potential nods to other films?

--No, I must have missed that movie. Ah, I had one of the Pirates of the Caribbean films pop into my head. Especially when the dogs appeared; felt like a dock in the tropics for a brief second.

Thanks, Noria! Wonderful thoughts as always.

First of all: Great work with the questions and the images! Thank you! Glad to see you drop by.

It looked like a simpler and more "rustic" version of Venice. It looked very beautiful and atmospheric and all the details and intricacies of the buildings and the structures is a testament to all the thought that is put into envisaging and realising the town. The town looked more worn than I imagined, and also slightly foreboding. This is in keeping with the general approach they've taken with this part of the story and probably also due to the season, where we see the town at the start of winter instead of in late autumn.

Rustic is a good way of describing it. It really feels like there could be a Google Earth view of the place; it's so well designed, and fully realized.

My first impression was that he was a scheming person, liable to abuse his powers. Both Alfrid and the Master were among the great failures of the story for me. The obvious scheming and abuse of power which is attributed to them and the generally slanted characterisation of both made them much less interesting than they could have been.

Interesting thoughts. So you feel that the representation of their abuse of power was too overt, if I'm understanding you correctly? We didn't really get much interaction between them and the people (besides when Thorin arrives), so I suppose it's harder to see the 'public' image that keeps their regime afloat (oh that's a horrible pun, yet I have to be proud of it ).

The suspense of the scene worked for me at least. I didn't find it wholly credible, though, with the dumping of the fish. I think it would have been more likely that Alfrid either would try to strike a deal with Bard, or his cargo would have been put on hold until they worked out a way to circumvent the rules.

It does seem a bit drastic. Although I thought it was more a show of force on Alfrid's part than anything else. It would have sent a clear message. So, I feel like he was going to harass Bard for whatever he could at that moment. I'm sure he was aware of Bard smuggling goods into the town before this, and wanted to intimidate Bard in the act.


Hmmm. It's clearly implied that many people in Lake Town struggle to survive and there's a weak distribution of wealth and power within the population. I really disliked all of these implications and found them needlessly topical and unneccessary, without any basis in the story. It's not neccessary for people to be desperate and poor in order for them to long for a golden age.. The Master and Alfrid would also have been much more interesting if the audience could see them having some popular basis to their power and still be corruptible persons who make wrong priorities..

Mmm, more interesting things to consider. Yeah, that kind of portrayal is very intriguing to think about. I wonder how this might reflect both producer and audience member desire to portray the 'ugly' and 'clearly corrupt' part of society. But, many times, it's the grey bits in the middle that can be addressed just as well. It's much more common to see a story about someone with both feet in the gutter of society than someone who isn't at either extreme, and sort of floats somewhere in the middle. Interesting thoughts there.


Wonderful use of the sunlight and the light in general and how it appears in wintertime. The mix of light and shadow looks very believable.

Completely agreed.

Thanks, elostirion!

(Let's see if I can actually get this to post--I've lost it five times now...) That seems to be a common thread in this...thread.


The initial shot you show there, cats, is amazing. I love the angle of morning light filtering through fog. Unfortunately this is the kind of thing I normally take for granted unless someone points it out to me, say, in a TORn CHOW. It's easy to forget how much we take for granted in each shot. It all looks too easy for them, sometimes.

I had pictured Laketown being rickety wood, but never actually so far out into the Lake. I like the location in terms of interesting design, though.

Same here. I never imagined the lake being so vast.

In this last one, the roof shingles look remarkably like fish scales to me, especially with the shiny ice/water on them.

Oh wow. Nice catch there! Very pretty with that white light bouncing off it it, too. Very fishy, indeed.

My daughter hides her eyes when he's on the screen because his monobrow creeps her out. I don't have any such problem--just looks smarmy, like a used-fish salesman. He seems like a more pedestrian Grima, less sinister and more earthy, perhaps, involving no wizards but mere human machinations. I actually find him more interesting now, because I wonder what schemes he has behind his manipulations of the Master.

Good point. We never really see what he's doing behind the Master's back. Probably some nasty things. Aww, the monobrow is probably more afraid of her than she is of it. Lol, love your used-fish salesman comment.

I would never attempt to place a Dwarf in a barrel, even a respective one, without a small army behind me.



Haha!


The suspense works fine, because even book-firsters don't know what PJ has up his sleeve here. (Although I keep wondering how the Dwarves are breathing in there.)

I think it's a nice nod to the 'floating down the river' book scene. PJ does this often, I think, without much credit from some detractors. It's nice seeing a lot of things, albeit altered to his imagining of it all.


It's also interesting that Bard isn't arrested at this point, but after he loses face in the later confrontation with Thorin before the town, apparently the Master feels it's safe to arrest him finally.

I have to wonder how Lake-town would have benefited from something like Twitter. #FreeBard


On another note, the bridge to land seems to be going off to the left, so we are approaching the Town from the opposite side of the Lake from Erebor. (In some of the last shots of the movie, Smaug is flying toward the town from Erebor, and the bridge goes off to the right from the Town.) So why can't we see Erebor in the distance??

Hadn't seen that before. I'll try to remember to look the next time I watch the movie.

Thanks, R-D! Nice thoughts, even after having to go through it all several times to make it work.

I’ve heard it described as Dickens on water – sounds about right. It feels disheveled, cold and miserable. You can just feel the cold and wet from the lake permeating the whole town.

Yeah, I don't find it hard to imagine a ME-version of Pip running around here in his story.

The town looks run down, kind of lopsided. Quite a contrast to the grand beauty and perfection of Rivendell and the Woodland Realm. But in a way, reminiscent of Bree.

Bree comes to mind for me, too. I guess the world of Men has a certain flare for design.

One thing that caught my eye the last time I watched it: what kind of stamp was that Percy used? Seems kind of modern.

Haven't noticed that one. I'll keep my eye open next time.

Bard has a good relationship with Percy though.

Good point there. Percy seems like a decent fellow. Nice to see those characters who aren't good/bad, just normal folks doing their daily thing.


9. I'll give an imaginary bitcoin to anyone who successfully places each dwarf in their respective barrel.
Left to right: Balin, Dwalin, Fili, Kili, Oin, Gloin, Bifur, Thorin, Ori, Bofur, Bombur, Nori, Dori. How’d I do?

For all I know, you got them all correct.

Yes, I think so. But can you imagine if we had seen the dwarves getting dumped in the lake?

That would have been awkward, haha.

I thought it was a good way to expose us to the claustrophobic, oppressive society, starting with Percy’s cramped office.

Ah, I seem to have missed his office as well. Nice observations!

At this point, Alfrid still realizes that he needs to have some kind of excuse, especially in front Percy ie a witness. It interesting that he doesn’t charge a fine or confiscate the fish though.

Yeah, I would have thought he would have done *something*, still. He does appear to have the legal (although not moral) right to impose some sort of action against him. But public opinion is a heck of a thing, I suppose.

It helps to underscore what we’d seen in the previous scenes where Bard was reluctant to have anything to do with the dwarves, and why he came up with the fish plan. And it helps to establish the upcoming scenes in Lake-town.

My only question: where did he get the fish so quickly? Obviously something happened off screen that allowed for it; but, one would think that he somehow conspired with a fisherman to make it all work out quietly.

Thorin’s hair: even though we can’t actually see it in this scene, we can well imagine the conditioning treatment it’s getting under the pile of fish, silky locks just waiting to be uncovered.

Ah, dang--I thought I was going to be the one to foil the hair observations. Touché. I didn't know that ME also was into 'all natural' supplements.

Thanks cats!

Thanks to you, Kim! Can't believe this train has already arrived in Lake-town.

9. I'll give an imaginary bitcoin to anyone who successfully places each dwarf in their respective barrel.
Left to right: Balin, Dwalin, Fili, Kili, Oin, Gloin, Bifur, Thorin, Ori, Bofur, Bombur, Nori, Dori. How’d I do?

For all I know, you got them all correct.

It helps to underscore what we’d seen in the previous scenes where Bard was reluctant to have anything to do with the dwarves, and why he came up with the fish plan. And it helps to establish the upcoming scenes in Lake-town.

My only question: where did he get the fish so quickly? Obviously something happened off screen that allowed for it; but, one would think that he somehow conspired with a fisherman to make it all work out quietly.

Thorin’s hair: even though we can’t actually see it in this scene, we can well imagine the conditioning treatment it’s getting under the pile of fish, silky locks just waiting to be uncovered.

Ah, dang--I thought I was going to be the one to foil the hair observations. Touché. I didn't know that ME also was into 'all natural' supplements.