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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Lord of the Rings:
** ~ Movie Trivial Pursuit ~ ** Answers to Feb 17 game

Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 3:39pm

Post #1 of 16 (506 views)
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** ~ Movie Trivial Pursuit ~ ** Answers to Feb 17 game Can't Post

okay, folks... I'm going to approach this a little differently. I'm going to answer each question as a reply to the main post. It's difficult for me to work out all the madness I sometimes include in the answer when I keep it all in one post. If you're actually checking in on a Sunday morning (US Central) then the answers will be trickling in as I get to them. If you're checking in later (as the UK/European folks and then later the US folks arrive for work on Monday morning), there will be no waiting involved.







Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 4:06pm

Post #2 of 16 (159 views)
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Q & A 1 : What race of beings does Gandalf believe all hope will lie in once the Elves leave Middle-earth? [In reply to] Can't Post

Men

In Rivendell:
Elrond: This peril belongs to all middle earth. They must decide now how to end it. The time of the Elves is over-- my people are leaving these shores. Who will you look to when we've gone? The Dwarves? They hide in their mountains seeking riches-- they care nothing for the troubles of others.

Gandalf: It is in Men that we must place our hope.



Music comment: The Rivendell Theme - Arpeggios - The Line of Men
I'll be offering music samples in the conversation below.
You can either download each sample - links given below - or you can download the entire pack HERE. 2.4 MB
All files are zipped. They must be downloaded onto your harddrive and unzipped before listening. Let me know if you have problems.



The first time we hear the complete Rivendell Theme is after Frodo wakes up (and has his in bed conversations), we see Rivendell from a distance then cut to the four Hobbits reunited in joy on a Rivendell balcony. Listen to that music HERE (655 KB)



The Rivendell Theme is really comprised of two parts: a melodic line that is sometimes sung (lyrics: A Elbereth) and arpeggios.

When I first starting working on the themes (before official information), any instance of the two parts together or either part separately was labeled the Rivendell Theme. If it sounded 'different' in some way from that classic version (played in the scene shown in the screen cap), I called it a 'variant'.

But in discussion with another soundtrack fan, Curtis, I started to look at this music differently, specifically the 'variants' which were all minor and often incomplete versions of the arpeggios. Curtis identified these as a theme distinct from Rivendell and called it 'The Weakness of Men'. I realized many of these Rivendell 'variants' were heard during conversations about Men, including the scene in this weeks trivia question.

I moved off in a slightly different direction than Curtis' Weakness of Men and considered the concept that the melody of the Rivendell Theme represented the Elves (embodied in Elrond) and the arpeggios represent Men (embodied first by Elros and then by his line). I will tell you my fellow soundtrack fans think we're totally off base with this but if you read my reply in Loresilme's thread, A LOTR Musical Mystery, you'll know I don't always conform to popular thought but one of my rogue theories has since been validated. My 'Line of Men' theory is pretty well developed at my website. Doug has not been asked to comment on my theory but he's said absolutely nothing in the liner notes or annotated scores for the Complete Recordings to support it. As I wrote on my website: Perhaps this theorized connection will be discussed in the future and vindicate we few who believe. Or, perhaps we're full of beans. I happen to like beans and I think this is in an intriguing supposition. It's staying on the site.


Back to this week's trivia question.

The classic Rivendell Arpeggios play over this part of the conversation:
Boromir arrives, then Legolas and other Elves, then Gimli and other dwarves.
Elrond: This peril belongs to all Middle-earth. They must decide now how to end it. The time of the Elves is over. My people are leaving these shores. Who will you look to when we've gone? The Dwarves? They hide in their mountains seeking riches. They care nothing for the troubles of others.
There are a few sustained notes as Gandalf says, “It is in Men that we place our hope.” and Elrond answers, “Men?”

LISTEN : movie audio from this part
(546KB) ---- CD audio from this part (621 KB)

Then a variant of the arpeggios - in a minor key and abbreviated - is heard during this part:
Elrond: Men are weak. The race of Men is failing. The blood of Númenor is all but spent. Its pride and dignity forgotten. It is because of Men the Ring survives. I was there, Gandalf. I was there three thousand years ago...
LISTEN : movie audio from this part (298 KB) ---- CD audio from this part (250 KB)

This is a perfect example of what came to make me see these variants as representing the 'Line of Men'.
For more information, see my web page on the Rivendell Theme







Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 4:18pm

Post #3 of 16 (145 views)
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Q & A 2 : What part of Frodo's body feels a sudden pain when a Ringwraith screams in the marshes? [In reply to] Can't Post

What part of Frodo's body feels a sudden pain when a Ringwraith screams in the marshes?

His left shoulder



I was fascinated by how Frodo's/Elijah's face seemed to distort when he was under the effects of the Ring, the Wraiths, or Sauron. Have we ever heard whether that's something Elijah was able to do on his own or whether CGfx were involved?

bonus points: why?
That's where he was stabbed was sufficient answer since I know you all know the answer.

Details like: Witch-King, Morgul Blade, Weathertop appreciated.

Extra appreciation for : it also happens at Minas Morgul.




Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 5:49pm

Post #4 of 16 (140 views)
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Q & A 3 : What is the fourth line of the traveling song "The Road Goes Ever On"? [In reply to] Can't Post

What is the fourth line of the traveling song "The Road Goes Ever On"?

"And I must follow if I can"
The Road goes ever on and on
Down from the door where it began.
Now far ahead the Road has gone,
And I must follow, if I can

bonus points: what character(s) sing(s) this song in the movies and when?
Gandalf when he arrives in the Shire (or Hobbiton or whatever geographical location that is)
Bilbo when he leaves Bag End



Starling answered : Dum dum dee dum dee dume dee dum... I think as a humorous 'I don't know answer'
weaver wrote : Both Gandalf and Bilbo sing it, but I think Bilbo is the only one who gets to the 4th line.

Both point to further interesting if totally trivial information.
I'll be offering music samples in the conversation below.
You can either download each sample - links given below - or you can download the entire pack HERE. 1.5 MB
All files are zipped. They must be downloaded onto your harddrive and unzipped before listening. Let me know if you have problems.


Gandalf arrives:
In the TE, we simply hear the four lines of the song with no instrumentation (ZIP FILE)
In the EE, Gandalf hums the first line, sings the second, hums the third, sings the fourth. Then he sings all four lines. Quiet instrumentation accompanies the singing. This is also what's heard on the CR-ROTK. (ZIP FILE)

Bilbo leaves:
In the TE and EE, we only hear the first two lines sung. (ZIP FILE)
On the CR-FOTR, we can hear all four lines. (ZIP FILE)

So, both Starling and weaver came close to accurate observations but both are slightly off the mark.



Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 5:57pm

Post #5 of 16 (142 views)
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Q & A 4 : How many days and nights do the trackers chase the Uruk-hai captors across Rohan? [In reply to] Can't Post

How many days and nights do the trackers chase the Uruk-hai captors across Rohan?

Three
Gimli: Three days and nights pursuit. No food, no rest, and no sign our quarry, but what bare rock can tell.
Mauhur: I'm starvin'. We ain't had nothing but maggoty bread for three stinkin' days.

Oh-kay. The card answers 'three' and we have two quotes from the movie that use the word 'three'. But two game participants answered with this observation:
Elberbeth : Gimli says "three days and nights' pursuit" but this is before the "red sun rises", so that has to be the fourth day.
Tyler : Gimli says "three days and nights' pursuit" but then "red sun rises", so that could be the fourth day.
For me to determine (to my own personal exacting standards) if this is an accurate point, I'd have to thoroughly research the whole issue. None of us care that much so I waved to my standards as they flew out the window and I gave everyone a point for whatever answer they gave. Of our two resident jokesters, one (Owly) actually gave the correct answer! That left Darkstone: do I give a point to him along with the rest and spoil his perfect zero or deny him the 'freebie'?

Ah, it's tough being trivia mistress.

;^)



Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 6:06pm

Post #6 of 16 (140 views)
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Q & A 5 : What metaphor does Théoden use to describe how the Uruk-hai will break upon Helm's Deep? [In reply to] Can't Post

What metaphor does Théoden use to describe how the Uruk-hai will break upon Helm's Deep?
"Like water on rocks"
Théoden: They will break upon this fortress like water on rock.

That's what the card says... honest.

Many of you made the observation that this is a simile not a metaphor. This is the sort of thing I can never keep straight in my head. Usually, I run into things and realize I must choose the right word, grammatical structure or spelling but I'm not quite sure what one is correct. I just look things up every time. I had a moment of panic when I thought perhaps this was a question I had written. I was sure I would question whether metaphor was correct and would look it up but perhaps I had overlooked it.

So, obsessive person I am... I looked through the entire stack of cards trying to find out if this was the game's question or mine. It was the game's. In fact, this was a rare trivia week in which I just wrote all the questions as they stood on one card. (I usually pick and choose among many cards.)

For those who pointed out the error, I awarded a bonus point!




Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 6:30pm

Post #7 of 16 (141 views)
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Q & A 6 : What king slain by Sauron is played by actor Peter McKenzie? [In reply to] Can't Post

What king slain by Sauron is played by actor Peter McKenzie?
Elendil


Some of you realized there were two Kings in the prologue: Elendil & Gil-Galad
(Gil-Galad was an Elven King... of him the harpers sadly sing... I love the Hobbitons version of this)

But only one was played by Peter McKenzie. Do we see Gil-Galad being slain? I can't remember.
bonus point: what kin of Peter McKenzie also appears in the movies?
Bret McKenzie
Who is Bret McKenzie, you ask? (Note: one t on Bret... as someone whose name is always spelled wrong, I try to remember this)
Knowing who Bret was signaled my entrance into serious fan status. When I was scouring the web in the summer of 2002 trying to find anything to satisfy my enduring thirst for all things LOTR, I ran across the word: FIGWIT.

Hun? Figwit? What's that?
Upon learning the answer, I realized I was in possession of information only a geek would know. I had crossed the line from casual to serious fan.
If you don't know who Figwit is or the history of Figwit, check out Wikipedia or the website, Figwit Lives. The short answer here is: he's this guy:

You see him in the Council of Elrond and, as a direct nod to the fans, in the ROTK accompanying Arwen to the Grey Havens.

If you don't know who Bret is, you probably don't know of the folk duo, Flight of the Conchords. You can check them out on GoogleVideo (especially this one: Frodo Don't Wear the Ring) at HBO or at TORnsib Sherry's site, What the Folk. They're pretty funny.





Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 8:15pm

Post #8 of 16 (147 views)
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Scores [In reply to] Can't Post

Lots of bonus points were possible this week, a total of 5:
  • knowing why Frodo's shoulder hurt when the Ringwraith screamed
  • knowing Gandalf sung The Road Goes Ever On
  • knowing Bilbo sung The Road Goes Ever On
  • noting 'like water on rocks' was a simile not a metaphor
  • identifying Bret McKenzie as the son of Peter McKenzie

I accepted just 'shoulder' as a correct answer for Q #2 even though the card said 'left shoulder'

Everyone got a point for Q #4: How many days and nights do the trackers chase the Uruk-hai captors across Rohan.

Any answer for Q #5: 'like water on rock' that contained the words 'water' and 'rock' were counted as correct. I even counted 'wave' as correct. I stopped short of counting 'vodka on rocks' as correct. ;^)

Tyler gave the fourth line of the song as: I should get a ride from a ranger if i can! (playing off his previous weeks' answers)
Tyler, would that ride be in a Ford Ranger or is it, as Darkstone answers: And I must follow in a Ford van?



Scores:


Ainu Laire : 6
3 bonus points


Darkstone : 0 plus the one point given everyone + Lots of laughs
Just because... I did a search for Ninja pirate supermodels and found that it wasn't totally a joke:

Darkstone you delight and amaze me. Anyone who wants to know more about this... ask him.

elvenhobbit
: 4
2 bonus points


Alassëa Eruvande : 6
4 bonus points


Starling : 4 + the drinks on me
2 bonus


Owlyross : 1 + much amusement
1 bonus


weaver : 6 + a can of Penzoil for her 'Nascar race of Men'
3 bonus points


Elberbeth : 6
5 bonus points
for her answer 'hunky men' I will say...
Fee Fo Fum Fi
I declare an E.I.




hasufel : 6
1 bonus point


laerasea : 6
1 bonus point


Menelwyn : 6
5 bonus points


dernwyn : 6 + LOL on the dolphins!
4 bonus points



Tyler : 6
2 bonus points
He's off hitching a ride with a ranger



One Ringer : 6
2 bonus points


elentari3018 : 6
2 bonus points


Loresilme : 5
3 bonus points


Thanks for playing.
Y'all come back now... you hear?




weaver
Half-elven

Feb 24 2008, 9:06pm

Post #9 of 16 (125 views)
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Thank you, oh Trivia Mistress! [In reply to] Can't Post

 
What a great title for the keeper of this game!

Delightful artwork in this scoring post -- glad I got some bonus points for the Nascar answer.

I hope you are having as much fun being Trivia Mistress as I am playing along!

Weaver



weaver
Half-elven

Feb 24 2008, 9:08pm

Post #10 of 16 (130 views)
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Geez, that's confusing.. [In reply to] Can't Post

But your research reveals my viewing/listening habits when it comes to the films -- I listen to the complete recordings, and watch the TE's, though not for many months. But I listen to the recordings weekly, so that's what lodged in my brain on this question.

Weaver



Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 9:29pm

Post #11 of 16 (121 views)
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Not if you keep a spread sheet [In reply to] Can't Post

just joking. I'm not that obsessive.

mostly.

Actually, I've developed my own sort of spread sheets for the music. I have to be super organized to keep track of the 100's of sound clips and bits of information. For the ROTK lyrics, for example, I have a sound clip for every piece of singing in the CR, the OST if different from the CR, the EE, the TE if different from the EE, and finally... the credits if there.

Each 'scene' has a number that runs sequentially through the movie so I might have

07 SceneX CR
07 SceneX OST
07 SceneX TE
07 SceneX EE
07 SceneX FanClubCredits

I found, when I went to check the two scenes from this weeks quiz that I wasn't as organized for FOTR and I didn't have the clips I wanted. And I was trying to number them so that every clip had a new number so
Gandalf singing in TE was 02
Gandalf singing in EE was 03
etc.

And not all the singing was there and the numbers were off!

Ai! it's an affront to the compulsive brain and it's now on my list to redo the FOTR singing file.

And people wonder why I don't want to document The Hobbit's soundtrack.




Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 9:31pm

Post #12 of 16 (119 views)
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fun [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I hope you are having as much fun being Trivia Mistress as I am playing along!


yeah, mostly. My tendency to obsess with things is like a Labrador puppy. It takes a bit of reigning in but it's fun to play with.



weaver
Half-elven

Feb 24 2008, 10:20pm

Post #13 of 16 (132 views)
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Ai! A spreadsheet has come! [In reply to] Can't Post

 
For my response, I'll just post this photo of me from my high school math class:



Weaver



Magpie
Immortal


Feb 24 2008, 11:17pm

Post #14 of 16 (121 views)
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ROTFLOL!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

I did notice that when you said, in response to the new quiz...

Quote
Math was never my strong suit. I will probably undo my "6" score from last week on this one!

...you got the number "6" correct!

*still chortling at the deer*

I suppose that sounds wicked to anyone who wasn't around when you were trying to number questions, let alone score them. If you remember, I even poked fun at your trials in my April Fool's quiz.





weaver
Half-elven

Feb 25 2008, 1:59am

Post #15 of 16 (112 views)
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yep, never put me in charge of counting anything... [In reply to] Can't Post

Hard to believe I was once allowed to actually work a cash register...

Every once in awhile I have one of those jobs, where I have to stuff a mailing, and make sure that everyone gets exactly the same thing in every envelope. At the end, I always have three of one thing, two of something else and not enough of one more thing -- and then I have to re-open all the envelopes to see where I messed up.

I'm thinking of making that deer my avatar...if I could ever figure out how to do that!

Weaver



Starling
Half-elven


Feb 27 2008, 8:01am

Post #16 of 16 (410 views)
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*flaps wings* Oh, what fun! Thanks, feathered one. :-D // [In reply to] Can't Post


 
 

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