|
|
 |
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
|
boldog
Rohan
Jul 10 2014, 9:46am
Post #1 of 10
(1365 views)
Shortcut
|
|
This next film is going to have a strong theme of death
|
Can't Post
|
|
The more I think of it the more it hits me.
In one film we are going to see at least 6 developed characters die, and another two possibly dying as well. Both goodies and baddies who have all been developed through at least two films. Thorin, Fili, Kili, Tauriel (maybe), Radagast (maybe), Smaug, Azog, and Bolg.
That is a hell of a lot of established characters to die in one film!
I think this is going to be quite a standout film, in terms of characters deaths. Most films tend to have at least one developed character die in it. Or most commonly we would have the main bad guy die, and maybe one hero die to add the emotion. But this film is going to have a lot!
And what makes it worse, is that the ones we are dreading to see go, have been developed for the whole trilogy! Im getting teary now 
Thoughts?
I believe that Azog and Bolg are possibly the only two orcs who may be an exception to the typical evil nature of an orc. Azog had brought up his son, well enough that he actually acknowledges him as his own son. That is a first for any orc. And Bolg sets out to march upon Erebor in vengeance of his fathers death. How many orcs will Try and avenge another dead orc? Most will just forget about the dead one. This gives me hope that Orcs, have some traits of good in them, even if it is small aspects.
|
|
|
Arannir
Valinor
Jul 10 2014, 9:52am
Post #2 of 10
(1012 views)
Shortcut
|
Imho there will be a lot of deaths, but death will not be a major theme of the movie.
Death was the theme of RotK.
For Bot5A it will be hybris and feuds (and what both do to individuals, as well as "nations"), imho.
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
(This post was edited by Arannir on Jul 10 2014, 9:54am)
|
|
|
Vepariga
The Shire
Jul 10 2014, 12:18pm
Post #3 of 10
(915 views)
Shortcut
|
and where there is feuds and greed, people get hurt or in Middle-Earth, people die.
- Vep - Guardsman of the woodland realm of Mirkwood -
|
|
|
QuackingTroll
Valinor
Jul 10 2014, 12:54pm
Post #5 of 10
(909 views)
Shortcut
|
|
Rebirth is another theme we might see...
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
Not literally, but in the concept of a new king under the mountain, a new king of Dale, of Bilbo's coming home as a different and "new" hobbit and more importantly of "one story ends and another begins" and the passing over to Frodo.
The deaths in TBotFA are the inevitable resolution, but they don't represent death as a finality or conclusion, there is much life after these deaths and a whole other trilogy to go.
The Return of the King, on the other hand (with the exception of passing the Red Book to Sam) death or "departing to Valinor" is very much depicted as a conclusion. There is still implied life afterwards, with Aragorn's coronation and Sam's wedding. But these are fairly solemn and do not imply a grand adventure in the same way, but rather they represent an end, in the death of an evil time.
Here's my major themes list:
AUJ: Home and loss
DoS: Redemption and discovery
TBotFA: Death and rebirth
FotR: Friendship and trust
TTT: Loyalty and goodwill (helping others)
RotK: Fate, faith and death (as a conclusion)
Fate particularly referring to philosophical ideas of afterlife as well as what the future holds for those still alive.
I'd absolutely love to see other people's "themes" lists, maybe we should have a separate thread.
(This post was edited by QuackingTroll on Jul 10 2014, 12:57pm)
|
|
|
Imladris18
Lorien
Jul 10 2014, 1:20pm
Post #6 of 10
(899 views)
Shortcut
|
|
I'd hesitate to include Radagast here.
[In reply to]
|
Can't Post
|
|
I know you said maybe, but there's increasing evidence that he does survive at least past Dol Guldur.
Regardless, there's going to be ample death and sadness. It's going to be very bittersweet.
|
|
|
kilifili
The Shire
Jul 10 2014, 7:23pm
Post #7 of 10
(818 views)
Shortcut
|
I really cant wait for this last movie - I cannot remember that I have ever been so curious about a movie.
And yes, I do hope that Fili will finally become a main character.
“And the ship went out into the High Sea and passed into the West, until at last on a night of rain Frodo smelled a sweet fragrance on the air and heard the sound of singing that came over the water. And then it seemed to him that as in his dream in the house of Bombadil, the grey rain-curtain turned all to silver glass and was rolled back, and he beheld white shores and beyond them a far green country under a swift sunrise.”
|
|
|
Loresilme
Valinor
Jul 11 2014, 2:45am
Post #8 of 10
(747 views)
Shortcut
|
In one film we are going to see at least 6 developed characters die, and another two possibly dying as well. Both goodies and baddies who have all been developed through at least two films. Thorin, Fili, Kili, Tauriel (maybe), Radagast (maybe), Smaug, Azog, and Bolg.
Let's take the baddies first. Baddies are expected to die. Even though Smaug's a major character and has a personality, he's still a baddie, and he's not human. IMO, I don't think Smaug's demise will be emotional. Azog and Bolg are also baddies, and expected to die. So also, will not be emotional.
There's no indication Radagast dies. And there's really no reason, from a story standpoint, to have him die. So if it's just that his non-presence in LOTR has to be explained, it could be that he realizes he's just too sensitive and innocent to deal with people anymore and he wanders off into the woods with his little animal and bird friends, forever. Depending on how they play that it could be very poignant, or it could be very comical.
Thorin, Fili, Kili, ok, definitely dying, definitely going to be gut wrenchingly emotional. I don't even want to think about this  .
Now, Tauriel is still the question mark. Does she die, not die, or go west. Major character, her non-presence in LOTR needs to be explained. Would her dying serve a story purpose? Well kind of, it could be used to serve any number of purposes. On the other hand, maybe three major characters dying is enough to win Tauriel a reprieve. So she doesn't die. Maybe she decides to leave for the West. Does her going West serve a story purpose? Well, kind of, it could serve to introduce and better explain that whole concept of what 'the West' is before its mention in FOTR and the ending of ROTK. As a movie firster I have to say it wasn't clear to me in the trilogy, just where the Elves were going, not in FOTR, and not at the end of ROTK when they were all leaving and taking Frodo and Bilbo with them. So they could take the opportunity to explain it in TBOFA if Tauriel decides to leave.
Most films tend to have at least one developed character die in it. Or most commonly we would have the main bad guy die, and maybe one hero die to add the emotion. But this film is going to have a lot!
I agree it is going to be tragic. I've never been both looking forward to and dreading a movie so much all at the same time .
|
|
|
MomoftheShire
Rivendell
Jul 11 2014, 5:42pm
Post #9 of 10
(682 views)
Shortcut
|
I was rereading the book, and the 3 Durin deaths (2 of which are really only described in a throw-away line!) made me cry just thinking the movies thus far!
Fili has a quiet strength throughout the movies, and I love to go back and slo-mo some of the scenes he is in. Not always in the center of the screen, but I love to watch him watching what's going on! I know the popular opinion is that PJ totally eclipses him with Kili, but just that scene telling Thorin that Fili's place is with his brother tells me more about his character than all that Kili/Tauriel stuff does about Kili.
Looking forward to Part 3 with wild anticipation and trepidation at the same time - AND I want a cut of the profits Kleenex will get from the increased sales on and around Dec 17! TORN!!!! You should figure how to set up concession stands for Kleenex at theatres all over the country - if you can't keep the profits, donate it to a PJ charity!
|
|
|
Kelly of Water's Edge
Rohan
Jul 11 2014, 6:03pm
Post #10 of 10
(690 views)
Shortcut
|
I don't know that her LOTR absence needs to be explained, the gender-bending, other alterations and massive expansion of her character aside. None of the Fellowship were near Mirkwood or Erebor and those communities had their hands full with their own problems during the War of the Rings. No need to explain why Thranduil and Dain never showed up either. All viewers need to know is their LOTR knowledge that Legolas and Gimli represented both the region and their races in the Fellowship, with maybe at most a taste of foreshadowing of what happened during the War in the area and a vague idea of how far it was from the Fellowship's path if it's really felt non-readers would get confused.
In my opinion, more importantly what does need to happen is that care needs to be taken to maintain that Legolas and Gimli's future friendship is groundbreaking, so easy on the Dwarf-Elf relationships all around.
|
|
|
|
|
