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boldog
Rohan
Jun 20 2014, 11:38am
Post #1 of 10
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So who are all the main Anti Heroes in Tolkiens lore?
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Anti heroes, are characters who lack pure heroic characteristics, but still have that sense of "good" in them.
So this got me thinking, how many are there in Tolkiens lore? Ill try and name a few here, but if there is more, can you add on.
1. Thorin: during his dragon sickness
2. Feonor: Driven mad by his oath, would stop at nothing for vengeance upon morgoth
3. Sons of Feanor: Same as their father, and would even go as far as killing their own people to fulfill this oath.
4.Turin: Fought for the good side, but slowly was on a decent into despair.
5. Thranduil: Greedy, and cares little for others, yet in times of need, he fights for the good
6.?
Thats all I can think off from the top of my head. Any others you know of?
I believe that Azog and Bolg are possibly the only two orcs who may be an exception to the typical evil nature of an orc. Azog had brought up his son, well enough that he actually acknowledges him as his own son. That is a first for any orc. And Bolg sets out to march upon Erebor in vengeance of his fathers death. How many orcs will Try and avenge another dead orc? Most will just forget about the dead one. This gives me hope that Orcs, have some traits of good in them, even if it is small aspects.
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Arannir
Valinor
Jun 20 2014, 12:09pm
Post #2 of 10
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Depends on the definition of anti-hero...
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... when one looks through literature some use it as a term for characters who do not have classical hero traits (doubt instead of confidence, physically not exactly hero-like, etc.) while some only use it for those who mean good and are fundamentally good but ultimately fail or even do Evil deeds while the reader/audience/etc still has an understanding for them, at least on some level.
Frodo falls in both categories to some extent, Boromir mostly in the latter.
I wonder though whether the first category has not become the new "classical hero" (in modern literature, television and movies).
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
(This post was edited by Arannir on Jun 20 2014, 12:15pm)
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Otaku-sempai
Immortal
Jun 20 2014, 12:37pm
Post #3 of 10
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Doing the right thing for the wrong reasons.
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The two dictionary definitions I have for antihero essentially agree:
- "a protagonist who is notably lacking in heroic qualities (as courage)." - The Merriam-Webster Dictionary (1997).
- "somebody who is the central character in a story but who is not brave, noble, or morally good as heroes traditionally are. - Encarta World English Dictionary (1999).
The most oft-cited example is probably the character of Harry Flashman of the Flashman novels by the late George MacDonald Fraser. I'm not sure that any of Tolkien's Middle-earth characters meet the above definitions. Maybe Smeagol when he takes the Ring into the Crack of Doom with him, but that was unintentional. Many of Tolkien's characters (like Boromir, Thorin Oakenshield, and Turin) are tragic heroes, but that isn't quite the same thing as an antihero.
'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring
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Maciliel
Valinor
Jun 20 2014, 1:27pm
Post #4 of 10
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the only plausible candidates that come to mind in tolkien's works are feanor and maedhros, and of the two, maedhros is the better candidate. he was very conflicted, and acted very nobly on many occasions, which are interesting contrasts to the atrocities.
i agree with otaku-sempai's assessment of tragic hero. boromir, turin, hurin, and thorin are all tragic heroes (thorin less so in the book, incredibly so in the films).
cheers --
.
aka. fili orc-enshield
+++++++++++++++++++
the scene, as i understand it, is exceptionally well-written. fili (in sort of a callback to the scene with the eagles), calls out "thorRIIIIIIN!!!" just as he sees the pale orc veer in for the kill. he picks up the severed arm of an orc which is lying on the ground, swings it up in desperation, effectively blocking the pale orc's blow. and thus, forever after, fili is known as "fili orc-enshield."
this earns him deep respect from his hard-to-please uncle. as well as a hug. kili wipes his boots on the pale orc's glory box. -- maciliel telpemairo
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DaughterofLaketown
Gondor
Jun 20 2014, 5:14pm
Post #5 of 10
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Well since I love anti heroes...
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But there is also a fine line between anti hero and villain so some of these might be considered villians to some.
Feanor
Turin
Maeglin
Melkor /as a distinction from Morgoth
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squire
Half-elven
Jun 20 2014, 6:54pm
Post #6 of 10
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...as the only real antihero in The Lord of the Rings. He is a central protagonist who is conflicted between the villainous and virtuous parts of his character. And I agree that Feanor is an antihero in The Silmarillion. I'm not familiar enough with the work to try to identify too many more.
In general, I think of 'antihero' as a modern literary concept that would not be found in the heroic legends that Tolkien wanted to model much of his fantastic fiction on. In such legends, a hero is a hero (protagonist), a villain is a villain (antagonist), and everyday people are caught between.
In contrast, the antihero seems very modern to me, the product of a psychological outlook rather than an archetypal outlook. He may be an ostensibly villainous type raised to the status of hero through residual virtues or presentation in a sympathetic light (Gollum), or an ostensibly heroic type who proves to be willing to indulge in villainy to further his heroic ends (Feanor). Neither type is all that common in the Tolkien's works; that they appear at all is testimony to Tolkien's inherent modernism as a writer of the 20th century.
squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'. and 'Designing The Two Towers'.
Footeramas: The 3rd & 4th TORn Reading Room LotR Discussion and NOW the 1st BotR Discussion too! and "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
squiretalk introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary
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Arannir
Valinor
Jun 20 2014, 9:46pm
Post #7 of 10
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Very much agree on the psychologcial outlook...
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... vs. archetypical outlook.
This is also why I said above that I believe the antihero has kind of become the classical or normal hero of contemporary literature.
"I am afraid it is only too likely to be true what you say about the critics and the public. I am dreading the publication for it will be impossible not to mind what is said. I have exposed my heart to be shot at." J.R.R. Tolkien
We all have our hearts and minds one way or another invested in these books and movies. So we all mind and should show the necessary respect.
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Meneldor
Valinor
Jun 21 2014, 1:42am
Post #9 of 10
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Strider as he first appeared in Bree seemed like he might be an antihero, but of course the longer we watch him, the less he seems anti and the more he shows his true qualities as a hero.
They that go down to the sea in ships, that do business in great waters; These see the works of the Lord, and His wonders in the deep.
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Hamfast Gamgee
Tol Eressea
Jun 21 2014, 11:16pm
Post #10 of 10
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What about the evil that Men do in general
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If many Men had not given in to evil, Numenor would still have existed and been able to defeat Sauron comfortably, the Nine would never have existed and Sauron armies at the end of the 3rd age would have been considerably fewer!
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