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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
DOS EE
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Dipling
Lorien

Apr 23 2014, 10:15am

Post #1 of 44 (3299 views)
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DOS EE Can't Post

Source not verified (HobbitCon - HDR site - member Scaramouche):
One of the actors (Adam) said that they filmed Dwarf introduction at Beorn's house. Gandalf calls Dwarfs in group of two to Beorn. They bow and tell their story, then the next two come in and so on.


NecromancerRising
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 10:27am

Post #2 of 44 (2453 views)
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Oh dear... [In reply to] Can't Post

I hope this scene will fit nicely into the narration of the story.Personally,i would love to see other scenes with Beorn such as his dialogue with Gandalf and his torture scene.If everything is included no problem by me.But to have the introduction scene at the cost of the other grittier ones, just to indulge the whining book lovers, i will be a bit dissapointed.

"Obsession and narrow-mindness is the trend of the 2000's and synonyms to many Tolkien fanatics"

(This post was edited by NecromancerRising on Apr 23 2014, 10:28am)


Glorfindela
Valinor


Apr 23 2014, 10:49am

Post #3 of 44 (2266 views)
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Dipling: [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd very much like to see this scene, provided it is not too extended. It is something I do remember from the book, and it is somewhat iconic. It would also be one scene that would provide some much-needed relief from all the comic-book action scenes and slow the film down somewhat – something that the film badly needs, in my view.


In Reply To
Source not verified (HobbitCon - HDR site - member Scaramouche):
One of the actors (Adam) said that they filmed Dwarf introduction at Beorn's house. Gandalf calls Dwarfs in group of two to Beorn. They bow and tell their story, then the next two come in and so on.



Shagrat
Gondor

Apr 23 2014, 10:50am

Post #4 of 44 (2323 views)
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Well that corroborates Martin Freeman's testimony [In reply to] Can't Post

All we need now is confirmation that the scene is actually IN the EE! The opening 20-30 minutes desperately needs expansion and breathing room IMO.


(This post was edited by Shagrat on Apr 23 2014, 10:51am)


NecromancerRising
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 10:55am

Post #5 of 44 (2227 views)
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Agree. [In reply to] Can't Post

I believe that 95% of the new scenes in the EE will be "slow" scenes.Smile

"Obsession and narrow-mindness is the trend of the 2000's and synonyms to many Tolkien fanatics"


Elessar
Valinor


Apr 23 2014, 12:10pm

Post #6 of 44 (2142 views)
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Cool [In reply to] Can't Post

It will be nice to see this scene and I'm glad we will have it to finally see it (assuming its in the EE). I do understand why it was left out because general audiences will feel like we already did this. That being said I agree most of what we will get in the EE will be slower scenes and with DOS that will be a good thing.



Loresilme
Valinor


Apr 23 2014, 12:38pm

Post #7 of 44 (2159 views)
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Maybe they'll include it in the Special Features but not in the EE itself? [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd like to see this scene. Well generally I like to watch any and all extra scenes from both trilogies - I can never get enough of either of them Smile. I'm just not sure how this could be fit into the existing sequence of events.

By the time Beorn shape-shifts back to a man, he's entered the house and looking around and sees a bunch of dwarves sleeping there, so he already knows they're all there.

Then by the next morning during their conversation he has his 'I don't like dwarves' line and a few minutes later, they're on their way.

So 'introducing the dwarves two by two' would have to happen sometime after Beorn returns and sometime before they're at breakfast around the table. But even if they have this introduction early in the morning before he serves them breakfast (aside: I still love those huge flagons, and doesn't that milk look so refreshing, lol Smile?) and Gandalf introduces them two by two and they have a quiet moment each telling them a bit about themselves, sort of breaking the ice and/or winning him over to their side, etc., why would he still be so hostile towards them right after that, to the point of saying flat out 'I don't like dwarves'?

Either way I'd still like to see this scene! It'll be interesting to see if it's in the Special Features only, or if it's in the EE itself, how it affects the scenes with Beorn overall.


Lurker in the Mirk
Valinor


Apr 23 2014, 12:40pm

Post #8 of 44 (2107 views)
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I sure hope you're right. Would love to have those quiet scenes / / [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Fan of both books and movies. Oh, and it seems I have severely misnamed myself... for the moment.

Thranduil Appreciation: I, II, III



Eleniel
Tol Eressea


Apr 23 2014, 12:58pm

Post #9 of 44 (2126 views)
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Yes, MF said it occurs the morning after their arrival... [In reply to] Can't Post

Like the condensed arrival at Bag End, I am sure it will be briefer than in the book, and understandably so, but I do think it would add to the film as it is. More character moments are sorely needed.
Here's hoping...


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
¯ Victoria Monfort


Bumblingidiot
Rohan

Apr 23 2014, 1:19pm

Post #10 of 44 (2193 views)
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"whining book lovers" [In reply to] Can't Post

otherwise known as people who disagree with you.


In Reply To
But to have the introduction scene at the cost of the other grittier ones, just to indulge the whining book lovers, i will be a bit dissapointed.


"Oh dear, oh dear, oh dear."


tsmith675
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 1:55pm

Post #11 of 44 (2106 views)
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I can almost guarantee that it will be in the EE. [In reply to] Can't Post

If they don't add more Beorn, what else are they going to add? I know there's Mirkwood, and other scenes. But with these Hobbit films, it's going to be hard to add more than 20 minutes to an EE. They desperately need all the scenes they can fit in there.

And the scene with the dwarves introducing themselves wasn't needed in the TE but is absolutely a perfect fit for the EE. Not only does it slow down the fast pacing but it's also straight out of the book. That will make many, many people happy. I just don't see how they couldn't put that in the EE. Especially knowing that they did film it.

Our destiny lies above us.

(This post was edited by tsmith675 on Apr 23 2014, 1:56pm)


Avandel
Half-elven

Apr 23 2014, 2:03pm

Post #12 of 44 (2062 views)
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Yes - totally agree w. your post [In reply to] Can't Post

"I'd like to see this scene. Well generally I like to watch any and all extra scenes from both trilogies - I can never get enough of either of them Smile. I'm just not sure how this could be fit into the existing sequence of events."

"So you are the one they call Oakenshield...." this to me sounds like Gandalf just went around the table or outside (the chopping wood picture) and simply told Beorn who the dwarves were. So not sure how all this will fit - but IMO with an EE, what difference does it make how long it is. We want it all - what good does it do to have all this wonderful footage on a shelf somewhere?


"Richard Armitage’s performance has been one of the best things about the new trilogy, making you believe that a hairy dwarf, so often the comedy element of the LOTR films, can be a heroic, tortured, and dangerous badass." - Den of Geek, The Hobbit: There & Back Again, 7 Apr 2014 - 07:07


Shagrat
Gondor

Apr 23 2014, 2:11pm

Post #13 of 44 (2083 views)
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"So you are the one they call Oakenshield" [In reply to] Can't Post

I believe this line might be a consequence of the decision, at one point, to show the Azanulbizar flashback at Beorn's house, having just encountered Azog for the first time in early cuts of the films (there was an article on the site about this recently). Beorn saying "so you are the one they call Oakenshield" would make a great deal of sense in this context.


tsmith675
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 2:26pm

Post #14 of 44 (2043 views)
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It's quite possible that... [In reply to] Can't Post

When the dwarves are introduced to Beorn, Thorin is just introduced as Thorin, not Thorin Oakenshield.

Our destiny lies above us.


SafeUnderHill
Rohan

Apr 23 2014, 2:31pm

Post #15 of 44 (2084 views)
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Since when was it an 'either' 'or' situation [In reply to] Can't Post

There's not a limit of the number of scenes they might include. So don't complain about one scene we hear being added because there are others you'd prefer instead.


Faleel
Rohan


Apr 23 2014, 2:35pm

Post #16 of 44 (2030 views)
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And [In reply to] Can't Post

lets not forget, sometimes the EE scene replaces scenes in the TE, like Saruman's death in ROTK replaces Gandalf's "No, he has no power anymore"


LordotRings93
Rohan


Apr 23 2014, 2:51pm

Post #17 of 44 (2032 views)
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How I think it will pan out: [In reply to] Can't Post

When Bilbo awakens and walks toward the table, Beorn's not in site (from what I see), so he's probably out chopping wood like in that one still we've seen. Bilbo and Gandalf go out to speak with him, and that's when Gandalf calls the dwarves out of the house two by two. I think it'd work perfectly. Then cut to the breakfast, with Beorn saying "So you're the one they call Oakenshield", with Gandalf maybe introducing Thorin last?

Lover of Medieval Fantasy
"I know what I must do. It's just... I'm afraid to do it."


Shadow&Flame
Registered User

Apr 23 2014, 4:49pm

Post #18 of 44 (1982 views)
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Funny thing about not including an introduction to each dwarf. . . [In reply to] Can't Post

In the original 2-film plan that had our company getting to Laketown by the end of the first film, a somewhat lengthy re-introduction to the dwarves during the Beorn visit late in first film would've been unnecessary and cut-able. However, with the change to the 3-film plan and placing the Beorn visit in the beginning of film 2, you'd think an introduction to the dwarves would've been a very appropriate way to start off a film and very well-timed - - yet it still made the cutting room floor. Somehow even with 3 films we fell short on time :)

Although I believe character introductions in the beginning of DOS are unnecessary (it's not like we get formally re-introduced to characters in each movie), I agree with everyone that DOS really will benefit in the EE with some added establishing, dialogue, and breathing-room scenes. I loved DOS but I'm REALLY excited to have an EE version with the first 30 minutes a bit more fleshed out. I know the dwarves themselves were rushed (while being chased) but that doesn't mean the storytelling needed to feel rushed. For example, the scene where they arrive at Mirkwood. . . Gandalf keeps summarizing their position, and any time you'd think a dwarf or Bilbo would ask a question, there's a quick silent beat and then Gandalf continues explaining their situation. And when he announces he's leaving, there definitely seems to be a back-and-forth between Gandalf, Bilbo, and dwarves cut out. Gandalf's "You've changed. . ." line to Bilbo, while awesome, seems like it jumps in from a cut line or two.

In summary, I would love to see an actual conversation or two added early on to set the table, instead of Gandalf narrating everything for a mostly silent dwarven audience. And while my hopes of a Carrock/eagles scene to start the movie off are dwindling as time goes on, I'm in favor of at least a brief opening scene where the wargs aren't already upon them to give more credit/value to their eagle rescue.


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Apr 23 2014, 6:00pm

Post #19 of 44 (1921 views)
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After what happened with AUJ SEE, i keep my expectations regarding the amount of new scenes low [In reply to] Can't Post

I bet a lot of stuff was filmed that we will never see.


(This post was edited by Estel78 on Apr 23 2014, 6:01pm)


PredatoR
Bree

Apr 23 2014, 6:14pm

Post #20 of 44 (1888 views)
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Same here [In reply to] Can't Post

I think exactly same. For sake of ultimate uncut edition or for new versions od blu ray ( 10th anniversary 25th 50th..) we will see less than what we expect. I made a list of unused scenes at this forum then when AUJ SEE was released. There were plenty of scenes that we even didnt see at SEE.

I just hope to see ultimate uncut edition in the near future with LOTR trilogy.


NecromancerRising
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 6:26pm

Post #21 of 44 (1873 views)
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Never. [In reply to] Can't Post

I am just saying what i would prefer.First,if they want to include everything about Beorn is fine by me.But, if they decided to cut some stuff from him i would prefer the introduction scene to be the first candidate.

"Obsession and narrow-mindness is the trend of the 2000's and synonyms to many Tolkien fanatics"


Avandel
Half-elven

Apr 23 2014, 6:28pm

Post #22 of 44 (1861 views)
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Oooh - love the idea of replacement scenes [In reply to] Can't Post

Not that I want anything TAKEN from DOS exactly, but I would love it if the scenes I feel were rushed into had a few more seconds added - and of course, any and ALL cut scenes.

*Wistful* I've posted this before, and don't think it was ever filmed and in this case doesn't necessarily add anything to the TE version, but I would have like to have seen the moment when Thorin and the dwarves hear Bilbo calling and Thorin has that moment of understanding and goes charging back up to the hidden door - despair to hope in an instant.

And I still like to hear Thranduil saying "where does your journey end?" so mystical - wish that could be added back in, somehow.

"Richard Armitage’s performance has been one of the best things about the new trilogy, making you believe that a hairy dwarf, so often the comedy element of the LOTR films, can be a heroic, tortured, and dangerous badass." - Den of Geek, The Hobbit: There & Back Again, 7 Apr 2014 - 07:07


Michelle Johnston
Rohan


Apr 23 2014, 6:31pm

Post #23 of 44 (1895 views)
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The original reason for the gradual introduction has been lost [In reply to] Can't Post

In the book the reason for Gandalf's ploy, not unlike Bag End, was intended to humour Beorn and introduce their story distracting him from considering the number of potential guests.

Personally given the filming of Beorn belongs to the two movie thinking both in terms of placement and time available I am surprised they filmed the segment. Much more important was to develop the back story to Beorn's experiences of Dol Gulder which would have included his incarceration by Bolg. That ties the plot into the sub plot and builds toward the BOFA and gives back story to the special personal animosity between Bolg and Beorn.

I hope the EE will expand on the Beorn Dol Gulder backstory rather than dwell on retelling the tale to beorn which we know. It will then aid my enjoyment of what happens in the final movie in the same way the teasing with the white gems makes sense of Thranduil's behaviour toward the Dwarves.

Like every one else I do not need another milli second of heavy set piece action. I want the EE to provide me with more emotional intelligence about why what is going to happen next happens and to dwell in more detail on the forward movement of the journey and the delightful and intriguing nuances provided by Bombur/Stag/Starlight Feast/Lake Town Party and THRAIN.

My Dear Bilbo something is the matter with you! you are not the same hobbit that you were.


NecromancerRising
Gondor


Apr 23 2014, 6:35pm

Post #24 of 44 (1849 views)
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Michelle i agree [In reply to] Can't Post

100% with you.Smile Beorn and Dol Guldur backstory is much more crucial than anything about him and i will be delighted to see that.

"Obsession and narrow-mindness is the trend of the 2000's and synonyms to many Tolkien fanatics"


Avandel
Half-elven

Apr 23 2014, 6:36pm

Post #25 of 44 (1852 views)
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Totally agree about the abrutptness of some scenes [In reply to] Can't Post

It never made any sense to me that Thorin wouldn't say a thing when Gandalf walks off (as Gandalf had offered to help) - so for me that's always been abrupt. The lead-in to Thorin's Laketown speech is WAY too quick IMO, given the gravity of the fact that the heir to this prophecy has just turned up. And the LOL infamous dwarves walking away from the hidden door. And wasn't there a scene where Gandalf was talking to Beorn - thought I saw pictures of that.

I worry over PJ being focused so much on TABA he doesn't worry about the DOS EE so much, but the DOS EE is something I am really looking forward to, so I hope PJ is expending a lot of care on it. Another "13 minute" blurb will make me sad, considering all the good stuff that seems to have been cut from DOS.

"Richard Armitage’s performance has been one of the best things about the new trilogy, making you believe that a hairy dwarf, so often the comedy element of the LOTR films, can be a heroic, tortured, and dangerous badass." - Den of Geek, The Hobbit: There & Back Again, 7 Apr 2014 - 07:07

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