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Bofur01
Lorien
Apr 12 2014, 6:05pm
Post #26 of 210
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I don't think it's a form of Black Speech, as:
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"Orcs are intended to have had a fairly small vocabulary to begin with, supplementing it as needed by words from the languages of Elves, Dwarves, and Men, and also Black Speech"
And a link? Here: http://midgardsmal.com/blog/
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BlackFox
Half-elven
Apr 12 2014, 6:11pm
Post #27 of 210
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I'm glad you cleared it up. And thanks for the link. So, who's up for some Orkish lessons? 
"Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake." - Henry David Thoreau
(This post was edited by BlackFox on Apr 12 2014, 6:12pm)
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Bofur01
Lorien
Apr 12 2014, 6:21pm
Post #28 of 210
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"Khozdayin obguryash! Abgurid!"
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Eruvandi
Tol Eressea
Apr 12 2014, 6:28pm
Post #29 of 210
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"So I will call upon Your name
And keep my eyes above the waves
When oceans rise
My soul will rest in Your embrace
For I am Yours and You are mine"
--Hillsong United
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BlackFox
Half-elven
Apr 12 2014, 6:35pm
Post #31 of 210
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"The dwarves are getting away! Follow them!"? //
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"Our truest life is when we are in dreams awake." - Henry David Thoreau
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Bofur01
Lorien
Apr 12 2014, 6:37pm
Post #32 of 210
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But yes, Khozd is Dwarf, -ai/ayi is a plural suffix for people, and -n is a definite suffix, meaning "the"
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vanima ephel
Rivendell
Apr 12 2014, 9:59pm
Post #33 of 210
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I especially like:
VII. Imrid amrad ursul! ‘Die a death of flames!’ [Khuzdûl, see here]
I wanted to know what kind of mud Thorin was slinging at Thranduil. I don't understand why they didn't give it subtitles. I assumed it was something crude.
That is SO much better! :D
"I dissent, even at the risk of being held incorrect or not sober."
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Bofur01
Lorien
Apr 12 2014, 10:10pm
Post #34 of 210
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And also, Thorin's less direct insult to Thranduil
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when he was talking to Balin in the dungeons was said (by RA) to mean "I pour excrement on your head"...
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elf-lady
Rivendell
Apr 12 2014, 10:23pm
Post #35 of 210
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And omg this thread is moving fast. I can't get online so much anymore due to heavy workload and I need to find some time to read through all the posts. Thanks for posting all those interviews. I can't wait until my DVD arrives (why it's taking so long I really don't know!). 
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vanima ephel
Rivendell
Apr 12 2014, 10:25pm
Post #36 of 210
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I really like your "heart language" concept
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But it does seem like the general consensus is that it makes more sense, in what is often an action film, to use Elvish sparingly. I still think it's likely being used for emphasis as a "heart language," here and there, but considering that Legolas - Door Guard scene, and a couple of other sequences when Elvish is used mostly by Legolas or Thranduil to give orders, I wonder if it could also be required for official commands and exchanges. Then Thranduil is just Being The Elvenking when he's whipping out the Elvish to stop Tauriel from killing the Orc. :p
"I dissent, even at the risk of being held incorrect or not sober."
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vanima ephel
Rivendell
Apr 12 2014, 10:30pm
Post #37 of 210
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"I dissent, even at the risk of being held incorrect or not sober."
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Rembrethil
Tol Eressea
Apr 13 2014, 3:11am
Post #39 of 210
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It is so very hard not to spout English in my Japanese language class when we really get going.
Call me Rem, and remember, not all who ramble are lost...Uh...where was I?
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Lurker in the Mirk
Valinor
Apr 13 2014, 5:22am
Post #46 of 210
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I suspect they're building Thranduil's morality around the "Long will I tarry ere I begin this war for gold" line, and thereby giving a more tangible justification to his desire for treasure than just the usual refrain that he's simply got gem-envy on his mind.
And if that is linked to Lee's inspiration from Oberon and the Fisher King ("They’re not like people. They don’t understand things like people. They’re more like a blizzard, or a very old tree, or a bear, or a tiger. They’re wild things."), the concept of the link between king and land, then Mirkwood's sickness corrupting his heart, and Lee's mention (somewhere else I think) that Thranduil is aware of what's happening but can't stop the process, then I guess it ties in to his apparent greed on the surface. Which of course then resolves itself (hopefully) in TABA when the story of the White Gems is revealed and the Necromancer cast out from Dol Guldor.
It is interesting that Thranduil does nothing else except for the tradeoff he proposed to Thorin in their faceoff to get the gems back, no waterboarding etc (which is a fortuitous bit of canon adherence imo).
Also, in the AUJ prologue sequence, he did not go ballistic and snatch that treasure box, even though he could make off with it easily enough. Rather curious given the overt significance of the gems to him. But then in reference to the "I'm patient, I can wait" line, it does suggest that he is cognizant and has enough presence of mind, despite the apparent betrayal/rejection in these 2 scenes to believe he will have the last laugh - which speaks again to the "wild things" bit.
I guess what I'm trying to say is that all the above seem like indications to the importance of those gems to him vis-a-vis the garden variety treasure, and at the same time demonstrate his greed may be different than what we see at face-value.
In TABA, we may see something like a TTT Faramir-Frodo moment ("I think at last we understand each other, Frodo Baggins") though whether Thorin is able to respond when it happens is another question.
... then again, my memory of all this is a bit dusty at the moment and I was not a very good student in Lit. class, so it could all just be random mites reaching and espousing implausible theories by proxy but I agree with you
Lee Pace is disagreeing with the idea that Thranduil wants to build up the kind of treasure that other Elf Lords have, and - indirectly - saying that the Elvenking's desire for the White Gems has only to do with the (quasi-religious?) association they have with starlight for him.
I know I've seen it argued that Tolkien's Thranduil is interested in accumulating wealth, but I'm guessing this means that PJ and Co. intend that he have a different bent.
PS: Canon-wise, we don't get any insight any influence Oropher (Legolas=Leggy, Thranduil=Thrandy, Oropher=Orry?) might have on Thranduil's treasure greed, do we?
Elvenking enthrallment
--------------------------
Thranduil Appreciation thread III
Thranduil Appreciation thread II
Thranduil Appreciation thread
(This post was edited by Lurker in the Mirk on Apr 13 2014, 5:32am)
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jkm7
Bree
Apr 13 2014, 12:01pm
Post #49 of 210
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Thanks for posting all these interesting Interviews
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and Video. There's some I didn't know yet. I love how much thought and effort Lee put into his role.
Also congrats to Thranduil, King of Sass, winner of March Madness and even beating the likes of Galadriel, Aragorn and Bilbo, not to mention his own son. Hopefully PJ and the other producers will have realized by now how popular and perfect Thranduil is and give him more screentime in the EE and in TABA.
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Kerewyn
Rohan
Apr 13 2014, 12:48pm
Post #50 of 210
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Hi Thralls. Forgot to mention I was off to New Zealand for a couple of weeks. Yes they do have internet there, all except my sister who I stayed with, so I decided to treat it as a screen-time break.
No unexpected meeting of minor cast members at parties this time, but I did pick up Weta's Chronicles 2 and 3 'from the source', saving on postage.
And wow, a third appreciation thread! And the March Madness contest - can't believe I missed the whole thing. I have been really enjoying the discussion between you, Lurker and vanima ephel. You are able to express a level of fandom and attention to detail that swills randomly around in my head but remains difficult (somehow) for me to articulate.
I would have joined in to say I have just watched 'Possession' and was equally enthralled by how LP played that bad boy. And also thanks for bringing my attention to Thranduil's half-sheath - I had not noticed that. But... moving on, since we are in a new thread.
Love the vid you posted with the filming of the interrogation scene. New footage, I am just drinking it in! I too am holding out for the EE - I recall how my TEs of LOTR were taking up space once the EEs took pride of place. I figure I can always rent DoS TE if I get desperate.
And thanks also for posting the interview above with Lee Pace. Lots of good stuff there. I am musing on this line in particular:
But he is also sensitive, and I don’t mean emotionally sensitive. I mean, I believe that not a leaf moves in that forest that he doesn’t feel.
'O' is very useful. You use it when you say... "Oscar's only ostrich oiled an orange owl today."
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Awesome! Thanks!//
[
The one website that had those words in it didn't know what Khozdayin obguryash means. 
this fandom 
