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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Niam:
Need help finding some Hobbit material / maps


Jan 5 2014, 5:08pm

Post #1 of 10 (305 views)
Need help finding some Hobbit material / maps Can't Post

I have several but so far I have been somewhat disappointed in the maps. Frown Esp after reading all the books - places and battles get confusing with the changing landShocked
Does anyone know of a good book that has maps for all the ages? Or a good site that is correct? (So I can print them out)

Also anyone know of a book that lists all the battles with a brief description? (I get confusedCrazy)
I know there are several websites but I prefer to read books and find them somewhat more trust worthy Wink

Evil Thanks

Do not meddle in the affairs of Dragons, for thou are crunchy and taste good with ketchup!

Aessere Lot

Jan 5 2014, 6:17pm

Post #2 of 10 (208 views)
Karen Fonstad's Atlas [In reply to] Can't Post

try this - I find it very useful. You'll need the updated paperback.



book Gandalf

Jan 5 2014, 6:43pm

Post #3 of 10 (194 views)
source material [In reply to] Can't Post

surely everything you need to know or was officially created by tolkien (with help from christopher t) is in either lotr, the hobbit, the silmarillion, unfinished tales, and the HOME, anything else is just being made up from these sources.

This is a serious journey, not a hobbit walking-party.


Jan 5 2014, 7:25pm

Post #4 of 10 (165 views)
I second 'The Atlas of Middle-earth' [In reply to] Can't Post

And I will confirm that what you want is the revised edition.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


Jan 5 2014, 7:26pm

Post #5 of 10 (174 views)
here's a clickable link to US amazon [In reply to] Can't Post


and here's a clickable link to the UK amazon - which lets you look inside the book

here's a photo of an open page of the book:

and note to OP: if geordie finds it useful, you can be assured it's a reputable and *useful* book.
geordie has high standards. :-)

Karen was a member of TORn's message boards and I met her before she passed away at a Tolkien conference. Lovely, lovely woman.

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Jan 5 2014, 8:13pm

Post #6 of 10 (154 views)
Correct, but [In reply to] Can't Post

Of course it's true that Tolkien is the originator of all the maps and all the accounts of battles; but it's not unreasonable to wish for an encylopedic one-stop shopping source for such information, if that's where ones interest lies. The original materials were not created or published all at once and are not indexed as such by the Tolkiens, so one must depend on fan-generated sources for organized compilations.

That said, your warning about "anything else" being "just made up" is highly relevant. User beware! So many of the fan compilations of Middle-earth material that I've seen are either sloppily sourced or not sourced at all. A smaller number do commit the sin of adding conjectural details that have no basis in the original works - for the sake of drama, or fan enthusiasm, or gaming purposes, or whatever.

So I agree with the idea of using published books rather than websites when possible. On that front, Fonstad's Atlas is very good about citing sources, and not so good about projecting additional (and usually plausible) geographic details that aren't really from the Tolkien material. The Sibley book of maps is glossier but I did not find it very helpful for research purposes. Strachey's maps for LotR are intriguing and a useful balance to Fonstad, but she is both out of print and limited to LotR, with no coverage of the earlier Ages.

For a compilation of the various battles of Middle-earth, I looked for Tolkien reference books on Amazon and read the Reader Reviews (the Editorial Reviews are useless, clearly). Judging from that quick peek, I expect Foster's 'Complete Guide' or Tyler's 'Tolkien Companion' is better than Day's 'Illustrated Encyclopedia', but I'm sure others here know more about these books than I do.

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book Gandalf

Jan 5 2014, 11:06pm

Post #7 of 10 (125 views)
maybe but [In reply to] Can't Post

what is the first lessons in histroy class? always use primary sources! and secondary sources with a huge pinch of skepticism

all the books come with an index!

This is a serious journey, not a hobbit walking-party.

Aessere Lot

Jan 6 2014, 7:46pm

Post #8 of 10 (94 views)
I use primary sources [In reply to] Can't Post

- as much as I can - when I do original research. The O P asked for something which will bring together maps, battles etc. Karen Fonstad's atlas does this admirably, and I'm glad to have both editions on my shelves next to all my Tolkien books.

Aessere Lot

Jan 6 2014, 7:53pm

Post #9 of 10 (89 views)
Thanks for the mention - [In reply to] Can't Post

Smile - it's been a while since I posted here, I know.

I first saw a copy of Karen Fonstad's book at a meeting of our local 'smial' of the Tolkien Society back in the 1980s. I was smitten - it's a beautiful book. But not available in the UK at the time. I asked a friend to bring back a copy for me when he went to Mythcon. He did; and what's more it has a lovely message for me from Karen, saying how flattered she was that someone should ask a friend to bring a copy home.

That friend of mine died in 1997; so this book is especially precious to me. And what's more - for any doubters out there - it's as useful as it is beautiful.


Aessere Lot

Jan 6 2014, 7:57pm

Post #10 of 10 (94 views)
I use the indices - [In reply to] Can't Post

Smile - but I find some secondary sources invaluable. Robert Foster's 'Complete guide to Middle-earth' is a must - Christopher Tolkien uses it. And the combined Index to HoMe saves me a lot of time-consuming work, consulting the individual volumes.


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