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Boromir: Who was he?
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Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2013, 8:39pm

Post #1 of 45 (504 views)
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Boromir: Who was he? Can't Post

Boromir was an enigma to me after I first met him. It took me some time to fully realise his complete character, and here is a summary of my thoughts of him.

My personal opinion of Boromir has undergone many metamorphoses. As a young, Movie-first viewer, my early opinion of Boromir was quite naïve, and the ones that followed were little better. Here he is, as I first saw him:

(Note: All comments are sampling of my thoughts in the period of time they pertain to. They do not necessarily reflect my current opinions)

He was the screw-up of the movie(s), ranking only below Isildur in incompetence. (Saruman was corrupted in a direct tete-a-tete with Sauron, he had some excuse. Everyone KNOWS how all-powerful Sauron was!! Wink) It was HIS fault that the Fellowship was broken at Rauros, they only gave him a cliché redemptive death scene, so that he wasn't hated too much. If only he had stayed true, then the Fellowship would have been able to fulfill its mission!

As the movies progressed, and a few details from the EE's percolated through my brain, I began to realise that movie-Boromir was there for himself...and his father. He was there to claim power for Gondor, strength to defeat Sauron and raise Gondor to glory. If he had stayed with the Fellowship, as they neared Gondor, he would have pulled in that direction. Movie-Aragorn, far from the most confident leader, would have his hands full with this headstrong individual. The Ring would have gotten to Gondor( read: 'Denethor'), one way or another if Boromir had stayed( read: 'lived').

Such was my understanding of the Movie-verse character. He was an ambitious warrior, seeking to aid his people. A little mad and power hungry, but what great warrior doesn't have an ego to match?

Then I discovered the books.

I began to read, and was overwhelmed by the detail, and divergences from the real story. (Movie-firster, try not to hate Wink ) I had to read it quite a few times to glean more of the details, and I still find new ones!
My opinion underwent radical change. Boromir was 'sent' by some strange-fated dream to Rivendell, for some, unknown reason. Eventually he wanted to take the Ring, (because EVERYONE wants it). He was just like any other, and it was natural to act like Isildur. 'The hearts of men are easily corrupted' after all....

Reading further, more facts needed reconciliation. He willingly acquiesced to Aragorn's leading, accepting his lineage and authority without question. Why? Faramir had the same dream too, and first? These, and many other questions were raised by the enormous wealth of insights that I had tapped. Then I began to disabuse myself of many preconceptions that caused me to conflate the Movies and Books, and allowed me to accurately assess his character.

Here is an attempt at a revised opinion:

Boromir was a headstrong individual, no doubt. He was a valorous and ambitious man, a great warrior and leader. The dream came to Faramir, but as a meeker man, he needed an encouragement to get on the road. Unfortunately, in learning the lore of Denethor, Boromir saw glory and honor to be gained in the enterprise, and usurped it from his brother.

His pride was evident in the council, but he served the Fellowship well in the early days that followed. He demonstrated personal courage and strength, also a willingness to toil and conquer hardships.
Following Gandalf though, all were content EXCEPT Boromir. He ALWAYS knew a better way, and refused to take the path to Moria, even when on its doorstep. Suspicion and pride would describe his attitude, but he was always ready to protect the company from perceived danger.

As they came closer to the point where the road towards Minas Tirith needed to be taken or forsaken, I think that he began to press his agenda, taking advantage of Aragorn's uncertainty. It was evident that he had not abandoned the idea of using the Ring. I think that when Frodo revealed the fact that Galadriel wielded Nenya in Lothlorien, the results and effects in that land only confirmed Boromir in his ideas that the One could be used.

Finally, when the choice had to be made, Boromir pressed his point. His downfall, perhaps, was pride. He overestimated his own moral strength. His intentions were no doubt good, but he did not realise the difference between the One and all the other Rings. Even the One had done Bilbo and Frodo no harm, why should it do so to him? Taking his own words as true, he wanted to only do good, but his pride was the thing that the Ring exploited. All of his schemes ended in self-aggrandisement; he did not see the dangers inherent of the Ring, and possibly, power itself.

I do not think he intended treachery at all. His offer to Frodo of aid in Gondor, I think was genuine. He was not a dishonorable man, prone to lie, and if he were so, I doubt that he would be held in high regard. Tolkien, via Faramir, says that the Gondorians are 'truth-speakers' , so I little doubt his words.

After his spell of madness, induced by the Ring no doubt, he did see the folly of his words. He saw himself and his failure. He now knew that he was not as strong as he had thought. He now saw his failure in full light. He had failed himself, the Company, and in all, the realm of Gondor.

His part was over now; bowed and beaten, but never conquered.

Boromir was proud, in a good way, but lacked wisdom to restrain his rashness. Thus he overestimated himself, and undervalued evil, though he never became evil himself. He repented, and found that wisdom before his death. There was a point that he consciously chose between good and evil, as Galadriel did, and though wavering, he came back to the side of good and right. Too late for his life to be saved, but not too late for forgiveness.

Such are/were my thoughts.

What are yours?

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


rangerfromthenorth
Rivendell

Nov 12 2013, 9:32pm

Post #2 of 45 (306 views)
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Boromir (From another Movie Firster) [In reply to] Can't Post

I have always loved Boromir. Not his rebellion or fall but his development as a character. I guess I am a sucker for a tragic redemption story.

Boromir is indeed head-strong but he is also valiant and brave with few who could compare to him in Middle Earth.

Can we fault him for his down-fall? Can we fault Frodo for his? The was beyond any of them and Boromir's weakness is that he knows his home will not survive Sauron and it is his desire to save his people which seems to motivate him wanting to take the Ring. Much like Gandalf says he would take the Ring in a desire to do good. That is how the Ring works, it decieves. And Boromir was decieved.

But in the end, Boromir redeems himself in that he sacrifices his life for the Hobbits and in the Book his loyalty to Aragorn is very strong throughout.

Not all those who wander are lost


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2013, 9:40pm

Post #3 of 45 (284 views)
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Yes, I have grown to like him too [In reply to] Can't Post

In re-reading all the parts about him,(Thank-you Index!!) I realised how little he actually factors into the overall story between Rivendell and Moria. Most of his dialogue was limited to single lines of complaint or disagreement. He no doubt was very active and well-intentioned, but in looking at him alone, he came off as almost constantly whinging. Sean Bean does breathe a bit more life into the character, and definitely gives many a face to associate with the name.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


rangerfromthenorth
Rivendell

Nov 12 2013, 9:46pm

Post #4 of 45 (282 views)
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hmmm... [In reply to] Can't Post

I seem to remember him and Aragorn desiring to fight alongside Gandalf against the balrog.

He was whiny in that later he desired others to go with him to Gondor, but I think had to do with his own loyalty. He would die for these people why would they not come with him? Also, of course, the Ring was twisting him at this point.

Not all those who wander are lost


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2013, 9:56pm

Post #5 of 45 (279 views)
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Yes [In reply to] Can't Post

Just looking at his dialogue sequentially, and without outside consideration of context, it looked like he was whiny. Not to say he was, but it appeared so.

Oh, the dangers of quotes out of contexts!!!

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


Meneldor
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2013, 11:50pm

Post #6 of 45 (299 views)
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A book firsters perspective: [In reply to] Can't Post

My opinion of Boromir was that he was a bully; a big athletic alpha male jock who took what he wanted and had the looks and charm to get away with it. The dream came to Faramir (the worthier person) but big bully Boromir took the quest away from his little brother, just like he undoubtedly took anything else he wanted from Faramir. His soul was fertile ground for the corrupting influence of the ring and he paid the price for his pride and self-centeredness.

When the movies came out 20 years later, I was surprised and confused to find myself liking Boromir. PJ and Sean Bean clearly interpreted the character of Boromir very differently than I did, whether deliberately or not I couldn't say.


They that go down to the sea in ships, that do business in great waters; These see the works of the Lord, and His wonders in the deep.


Lightfoot
Rivendell


Nov 13 2013, 12:07am

Post #7 of 45 (273 views)
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To be honest with you [In reply to] Can't Post

I hated Boromir the first time I read the books. Granted I was 8 years old so my entire understanding of ME was - shall we say a little unusual Crazy After I reread the books I began to understand and appreciate him more and more. Now I can honestly say that I like Boromir- his loyalty, courage, and strength really stick out. When I finally got around to watching the films I was a little upset on how he was portrayed- he seemed a little more evil than I remembered - but he had a lovely death scene- so that made it a little better.

Faithful servant yet master's bane,
Lightfoot's foal, swift Snowmane



Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 1:16am

Post #8 of 45 (251 views)
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Yes, I was about the same age..... [In reply to] Can't Post

He came across as more maniacal and crazed in the film. In the books he seemed really sorry and conscious of his wrongdoing. His return to defend Merry and Pippin though was quite dramatic, and I think the drama trumped his character moment.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


FaramirFan
The Shire

Nov 13 2013, 2:24am

Post #9 of 45 (254 views)
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Movie treatment of Boromir wasn't bad [In reply to] Can't Post

The movie gave a fairly accurate characterization of Boromir, though I wouldn't sprain my elbow trying to pat Jackson on the back for it - Boromir simply fit his partisan agenda well enough he didn't require a facelift.

He's a tragic figure, though. Much moreso than Isildur, who kept the ring without need. Boromir's home, friends and family were about to be overrun by a seemingly irresistible and terrifyingly ferocious enemy. He also had a very accurate appreciation of what the Council of Elrond's plan entailed, and he was bloody *right* - one really does NOT simply walk into Mordor. Neither Denethor nor Boromir were irrational in their despair. Their entire nation was destined for annihilation, and frankly if not for the fact they were part of a book, they'd have suffered the same fate as the Men in the Dark Years of Sauron's dominion, or Beleriand immediately pre-War of Wrath.

Bottom line is, just because Gandalf says it's so, doesn't make it believable. Smile

ps - Isildur is a whole 'nother problem. The Numenoreans, not the Elves, were the uber-mensch of Middle Earth. Isildur taking the ring when he did is entirely out of character for him and his people. Bad Isildur, bad boy! I've always believed Tolkien should have explained that action in more detail (perhaps in his letters?) I tend to view his actions as anomalous, and Faramir's as representative, for Numenoreans.


Plurmo
Rohan

Nov 13 2013, 4:47am

Post #10 of 45 (244 views)
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The problem I have with Boromir is [In reply to] Can't Post

how long he waited to try and catch the Ring. I cannot envision any gondorian warrior at the end of the Third Age that after encountering a Balrog would not immediately become a bit insane. Those were not warriors used to fighting face to face with dragons, Sauron, Morgoth, Carcharoth, Ungoliant and the like. You see, a Balrog is a First Age horror. An anomaly so great that it would signal imminent defeat even to a mighty gondorian captain. Indeed especially to a mighty gondorian captain. In any case if I were Boromir, after coming outside the East Gate of Moria the first thing I would have done would be to take the Ring at whatever cost and jump with it downhill towards Gondor like a Rhosgobel hare, forgetting all about pride, imagining Balrogs everywhere, shouting "daddy! bring wood and oil!".


Elizabeth
Valinor


Nov 13 2013, 7:57am

Post #11 of 45 (248 views)
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That sums it up pretty well. [In reply to] Can't Post

Boromir was an excellent general. Beyond that, not many redeeming qualities in book-Boromir. The movie (and Sean Bean's brilliant performance) did a great rehabilitation job -- he was almost likeable by the time he was dead.

We must remember that the hobbits accompanied Frodo with the Ring all the way from the Shire, and Aragorn, Legolas, Gimli, and Gandalf joined them at Rivendell. No one was tempted by it except Boromir. So, it's power isn't that great except on a person who is deeply flawed to begin with.

Yes, Frodo succumbed to it at the end, but only after it had worn him down both physically and mentally over many months.








(This post was edited by Elizabeth on Nov 13 2013, 8:02am)


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 1:58pm

Post #12 of 45 (213 views)
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Thoughts... [In reply to] Can't Post

Reading the books, it does seem like that.

I think that the hobbits were young and naive enough to be ignorant of the usefulness of the power. They really had no use for it. Can you imagine Pippin or Merry with the Ring? Sam doesn't seem to ponder the thought long either, even after being exposed to it just a long as anyone else.

As for the others, Gandalf feels the fear of temptation at Bag End. Though his position as a Maiar might have helped, 'I have a mission from the Valar!'

Gimli and Legolas never disclose thier feelings, but I think there might have been some temptation.

Aragorn would seem as capable of rejection as Faramir, in the short-term, but in the end it wins over everyone.

Boromir had the most to win, and lose. He was the first to break, but not the only one, I think, that would have.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


FaramirFan
The Shire

Nov 13 2013, 3:57pm

Post #13 of 45 (206 views)
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over-emphasis on Ring's corrupting power [In reply to] Can't Post

It is simply not necessary to explain Boromir's actions. Primary exhibit: Denethor

Denethor's views on ring usage were the same as his eldest son's. No convincing argument can be made that the Ring's power influenced him from 500 miles away.

Both he and Boromir, however, were responsible for their people's well-being. And both were aware of the threat looming on their borders. Their problem was that they were too proud to take the word of Gandalf and Elrond that using the ring was worse than everyone they knew dying.

I'm admittedly a Numenorean fanboy, and a fondness for Faramir will predispose towards forgiveness, at least, for his immediate family. I don't believe he'd see the desire to save all their friends and family from death as "evil".


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 4:17pm

Post #14 of 45 (194 views)
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A bit overused.... [In reply to] Can't Post

The Ring gets a lot of blame, and I'd agree that it gets more credit for the evil that comes about, than it is due.

There are innumerable factors at play, and Denethor had access to a palantir, besides.

Innumerable factors at work, but the immediate presence if the Ring would have some effect. If have to read up more to begin to try to ennumerate its capabilities.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


FaramirFan
The Shire

Nov 13 2013, 4:28pm

Post #15 of 45 (184 views)
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no doubt... [In reply to] Can't Post

...that the ring had an effect on Boromir. I keep coming back to Isildur, though. (The counter-example to Denethor.)

Denethor and Boromir both had good reason to use the Ring. I don't see a lot of change from Boromir's initial inclination at the Council of Elrond to the Falls of Rauros - it's more to me that the imminent departure of the Ringbearer forces the issue. Hence, to my mind, the Ring doesn't *necessarily* affect him much. However, JRR says it does, so it did. Not a problem.

Isildur is an argument for "immediate corruption" - it either took "control" of him near-instantly, or something else. Smile The reason he's the counter-example to Denethor is that Denethor wanted the Ring due to need, without exposure, while Isildur wanted the Ring due to exposure, without need. (oh my head hurts!)

So I'm back to being a fanboy, Boromir's okay and y'all are just mean. Smile

Dude - this whole Osanwe-Kenta thing is also making my head hurt. If it's impossible to mentally coerce another, then what the heck is going on with the Ring's corruption, Sam's looking into the Palantir, etc? Saruman's voice fits, but nothing else.

That deserves a separate thread.


Werde Spinner
Rohan


Nov 13 2013, 4:32pm

Post #16 of 45 (184 views)
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*bows in awe of the superior analysis* [In reply to] Can't Post

I've never sat down and tried to type my thoughts on Boromir like this before so any reply I can give will necessarily be inferior to your amazing and thought-provoking post. I'm trying to think back to when I first read LOTR eight years or more ago and recall what I thought of Boromir then. (Book-firster, although I had seen pictures from ROTK, which spoiled me on Gandalf's return... grrr.) I didn't like Boromir originally, that's for sure. I don't know if it was the complaining part; he was quite right to not want to go into Moria, and I can understand why he'd be leery of Lothlorien. I think the thing that got me was that he interrupted Elrond in Rivendell and Celeborn in Lothlorien. Sometimes it's the small breeches of basic good manners that really affect my view of a person or character.

I also hated Denethor on sight. All my sympathies lay with Faramir. Poor captain Faramir. I loved him so much.

However, once I saw the movies, my opinion of Boromir began to chance. For the first time I noticed his loyalty to his people and his country, his affection for Faramir ("Remember today, little brother."), his protectiveness of the hobbits (helps them in the snow, wants to let them rest after Moria, dies protecting Merry and Pippin - he even lays a hand on Gimli's shoulder at Balin's tomb!), etc. I realized he was not so much of a 2D character as I had thought. And so, on rereading the books, I was able to also pick up on his good qualities. And so now I see him as a character in a bad situation; yes, he has his flaws or the Ring wouldn't have been able to get to him the most quickly out of all the Fellowship, but he has his redeeming qualities, too.

I also have a better opinion of Denethor now. It's not that he hates Faramir and loves Boromir; it's just that he loves Boromir more. It's not that he necessarily wants the rest of Middle-earth to burn; it's just that his concern for Gondor has grown so great that its welfare is uppermost in his mind and nothing else matters compared to it. He also seems to make the mistake of equating himself with Gondor, but the palantir can't be helping his sanity here. Denethor, though, is more culpable than Boromir in my opinion, because he refuses to learn that his way is not always the best way. Boromir eventually accepted that his solution, "Let's take the Ring to Gondor and blow up Sauron with it or something," was not the best way. When Denethor couldn't get his way, he just went into despair and denial and killed himself, a bit like a spoiled child: "My way or no way."

As for Faramir, I still love him so much. Wink It's hard not to. I think he has enough of a grasp of reality to see that taking the Ring won't work - and don't tell me he doesn't feel the pull of the Ring in the book, because I think he does. He's just wise enough to see that it wouldn't work and lets himself be guided by his oath to Frodo ("...not even if it lay by the wayside...") in letting it go.

"I had forgotten that. It is hard to be sure of anything among so many marvels. The world is all grown strange. Elf and Dwarf in company walk in our daily fields; and folk speak with the Lady of the Wood and yet live; and the Sword comes back to war that was broken in the long ages ere the fathers of our fathers rode into the Mark! How shall a man judge what to do in such times?"

"As he ever has judged. Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house."


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 4:49pm

Post #17 of 45 (172 views)
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Yeah, he seemed to be pretty status quo [In reply to] Can't Post

Sam stated that Boromir brought his peril with him to Lorien. He really didn't give up in the idea that it could be used for good, hence his constant insistence to take it to Gondor. He had already been coveting it before he came to Rauros, possibly before he saw it at Rivendell. He was already on a slippery slope, and the crisis forced him to make a rash decision. The wrong one at first, but like I said, he repented and atoned. The very possibility of gaining the Ring might have been temptation enough. People risk important things on the chance of gaining more.

Perhaps Isildur saw the power firsthand and wanted it. His family took the Palantiri and they worked well, maybe he thought he could uses the Ring too?

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 5:13pm

Post #18 of 45 (168 views)
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*bows in return* [In reply to] Can't Post

You have some great points yourself. I just put down random musings and memories in a chronological order. Nothing fancy, just a stream of consciousness style, that, I feel, allows for deeper expression. Put your thoughts of a musing down on paper, and you'll get similar results. Writing, just writing without pause, sometimes forces you to be brutally honest, sometimes in spite of yourself, as you have no time to edit your thoughts. Editing comes later.

Denethor is quite unlikeable, but I am beginning to see his twisted mode of thinking. You bring up good ideas here!! Don't sell yourself short!!

Boromir is one of those characters that you have to warm up to over time. He was very similar to Brandir in my first conceived opinions. I realised that I sympathised more with other characters, at his expense. Not really fair.

Ah, Faramir, I have always liked him!! I felt he was an honorable man who would sacrifice for his sense of duty. Boromir seemed to do his duty for the honor, Faramir because it WAS an honor, the right thing to do. Faramir got a bit of a short-ended stick in the movies in terms of development and screen time, but I still love him for his book character. There want much time to establish him as a character anyway.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


Phantom
The Shire


Nov 13 2013, 5:51pm

Post #19 of 45 (172 views)
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Boromir/Faramir/Denethor [In reply to] Can't Post

Boromir's heart was was in the right place, but his head always wasn't. He sought to use the ring to empower Gondor and defeat Sauron. Good idea in theory, but the chances of it turning into Isildur part II were good. Movie-Boromir showed that he was under the Ring's influence from the very first time he glanced at it. Had he taken it, it would've worsened to whatever end.

Some responsibility has to be put on Denethor for this.

Faramir had the prophetic dream and was possibly stronger in character than Boromir in the sense that he may not have been so easily swayed by the Ring's power. Denethor sent Boromir instead, and he was slain. Almost in retribution for this, he sent Faramir to retake Osgiliath, knowing he'd be slain too. In a nutshell Denethor was at least indirectly responsible for the death of both his sons, although Faramir survived, but by then Denethor was too consumed by grief.

I've always wondered if things would've turned out differently if Faramir had gone to Rivendell instead of Boromir.

And what do trees have to talk about? Hmm...except the consistency of squirrel droppings?


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 6:03pm

Post #20 of 45 (158 views)
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Guilt, guilt, guilt [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, Denethor must have been sick with guilt. It is said that Boromir urged his case to make the journey, but I think Denethor backed his son against the elders who wished to send Faramir. The movies took more liberty by having Boromir and Denethor fully aware of the Ring, but it is at least hinted that Denetgor knew more than he let on.

I agree with all you said.

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!


Phantom
The Shire


Nov 13 2013, 6:24pm

Post #21 of 45 (154 views)
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Denethor [In reply to] Can't Post

Denethor definitely knew more than he let on, since he was using the palantir. I think that only added to his madness and grief.

And what do trees have to talk about? Hmm...except the consistency of squirrel droppings?


Elizabeth
Valinor


Nov 13 2013, 7:23pm

Post #22 of 45 (148 views)
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A palantir isn't necessarily evil. [In reply to] Can't Post

The movie suggested that it is, and a lot of people accepted that. However, it was really just a communication device that the Numenorians used to manage their governance of ME in the early Third Age.

The problem is that the Minas Ithil stone was take by Sauron when it fell. Being now in the "network", Sauron could use it to manipulate both Denethor and Saruman. The essential evil is Sauron.








Elizabeth
Valinor


Nov 13 2013, 7:31pm

Post #23 of 45 (154 views)
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Faramir's mission to Osgiliath [In reply to] Can't Post

...was not a suicide mission. It was a desperate, high-risk venture to hold off the invasion just a little longer in the hope that help from Rohan would come. In fact, Faramir's men did exactly that: they held out for two precious days, which made all the difference. Had they not done so, both the Rohirrim and Aragorn's efforts would have come too late.

This strategy was much too subtle for Jackson, who made Denethor into an obvious ogre from the outset and Faramir's mission into deliberate murder/suicide, thus weakening the story considerably.

The book bemoaned the fact that a quarter of Faramir's men died; the movie implied that Faramir was the only survivor.








(This post was edited by Elizabeth on Nov 13 2013, 7:33pm)


rangerfromthenorth
Rivendell

Nov 13 2013, 7:45pm

Post #24 of 45 (159 views)
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I must disagree whole-heartedly as nicely as I can... [In reply to] Can't Post

In regards to your statement regarding the Ring's power of corruption. Gandalf was tempted to take it but passed the test. Galadriel wanted it, but her wisdom prevailed in the end.

The Ring's power of temptation was great (hence why Frodo had to part with the Company) but the Ring above all else desired to return to Sauron. This is why I believe it did not tempt Gandalf as a primary focus, because Gandalf could have defeated Sauron with the Ring. In turn this is why it tempts both Galadriel and boromir for it knows their weaknesses and that if they take it Sauron wins. Sure, Boromir was the weakest link in the fellowship, but this is why the Ring focuses in on him.

In the incident in the book, even Boromir claims to come to his senses after he sees Frodo disappear, he is portrayed as a man possessed, you can his immediate repentance as as not genuine but I think his specific fall is portrayed in the Book as exactly a result of his weakness and the active temptation of the Ring itself. I wish I had my copy of the book handy but I do not.

Not all those who wander are lost


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Nov 13 2013, 10:17pm

Post #25 of 45 (137 views)
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I like that idea!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

If we agree that the Ring was capable of semi-conscious thought and preferred Sauron to someone else, it would explain much. It's not a toxic presence that corrupts all around it, but a slow poison to its bearer or the weak people nearby.

Any temptation that it occurred, outside of its will, would be a moral failing in the one who wants the Ring. Thus they might feel morally culpable( or not) if they succumb. It would go far to explain Gandalf, Faramir, Bombadil, and possibly Galadriel or Elrond's conscious rejection. The Ring might not have wanted to change hands, this making it easier, as they only had to restrain themselves, not do battle with another will.

It might seem like an all corrupting temptation, and to be played as such in the films, but instead it only tempts those who it thinks can get it to Mordor the quickest. Gondor is EXTREMELY close to Mordor, so maybe it thought that it could hitch a ride to its doorstep. With Gollum it miscalculated, as with Bilbo, as they wanted no part of power and honor, or perhaps it took the best chance it had to get to Sauron.

Great idea, and worthy of consideration!!

Call me Rem. Rembrethil is a lot to type!!

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