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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Elves in Mirkwood

Hamfast of Gamwich
Rivendell


Oct 21 2013, 7:31pm

Post #1 of 11 (772 views)
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Elves in Mirkwood Can't Post

I just reread the chapter 'A Warm Welcome' and it struck me how much of this chapter talks about the wood elves in Laketown (the raftmen) and their presence's effect on the Master. Cutting these characters out would have made quite a significant change to the book.

I wonder how similar a role to this Legolas and Tauriel will play in tDoS. Will their presence there be widely known to the people of Laketown or will they be undercover? Will they try to sway the view of the Master or will they ally with Bard in mutual dislike of the company. What do people think?

"Durin's Heir you may be, but even with one eye you should see clearer. If this is victory, then our hands are too small to hold it. We will not enter Khazad-dum. You will not enter Khazad-dum. Beyond the shadow of the gate it waits for you still: Durin’s Bane. The world must change and some other power than ours must come before Durin’s Folk walk again in Moria.”


Eruvandi
Tol Eressea


Oct 21 2013, 8:13pm

Post #2 of 11 (367 views)
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nice observation! [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't really remember the presence of the wood elves in Laketown having an effect on the Master. Would you mind elaborating on this observation?

I think it's possible Legolas and Tauriel will play a similar role in DOS. Given the fact that we've seen clips of Legolas fighting orcs INDOORS somewhere in Laketown, I think it would be pretty difficult for him or Tauriel to be undercover in any way. They are both also extremely different in physical appearance from the Laketowners we've seen so far so I think their presence will be widely known. I am very curious about what (other than fighting orcs) Legolas and Tauriel will be doing while they are in Laketown! Do you think they will even have any direct interactions with the Master or Bard?

My favorite speech from the entire LOTR series: Sam:“It’s like in the great stories Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn’t want to know the end, because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was after so much bad had happened? But in the end, it’s only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come and when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer. Those are the stories that stayed with you, that meant something, even if you were too small to understand why. But I think, Mr. Frodo, I do understand, I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances at turning back, only they didn’t. They kept going because they were holding on to something.” Frodo: “What are we holding on to, Sam?” Sam: “That there’s some good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and it’s worth fighting for!”


Hamfast of Gamwich
Rivendell


Oct 21 2013, 8:43pm

Post #3 of 11 (334 views)
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Tauriel = Thrush! [In reply to] Can't Post

When the Master is considering how he should welcome Thorin he has to weigh in the fact he has woodelves sitting next to him who will report his interactions with Thorin to the Thranduil - the man Thorin has just escaped from/the Master's key trading ally. Eventually he decides to discount this and follow the masses enthusiasm for Thorin. Maybe this will be slightly different in the movie though?

Purely hypothetical idea that I'm sure will enrage purists: we know Bard is openly hostile to the company but he is ordered by the Master to escort them to the mountain on his boat. Bard has secret communications with Tauriel/Legolas and sneaks Tauriel onto his boat and allows her to track the company (a la Kate in Lost) to the mountain. She hangs around them in secret and eventually overhears Bilbo telling them about the weak spot in Smaug's belly. She then heads back to Laketown just in time to report this to Bard (who has been having archery lessons from Legolas) and he shoots the Dragon (so replaces the Thrush)!

"Durin's Heir you may be, but even with one eye you should see clearer. If this is victory, then our hands are too small to hold it. We will not enter Khazad-dum. You will not enter Khazad-dum. Beyond the shadow of the gate it waits for you still: Durin’s Bane. The world must change and some other power than ours must come before Durin’s Folk walk again in Moria.”

(This post was edited by Hamfast of Gamwich on Oct 21 2013, 8:44pm)


Eruvandi
Tol Eressea


Oct 21 2013, 8:53pm

Post #4 of 11 (297 views)
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Not sure about the thrush, but otherwise... [In reply to] Can't Post

...Your theories about Legolas and Tauriel in Laketown at least sound plausible to me! Personally, I think since we've seen a thrush flying to Erebor at the end of AUJ, that it will be an actual thrush and not Tauriel who overhears Bilbo.

I do wonder where Tauriel and Legolas will be when Smaug attacks though. Perhaps they'll have gone back to Thranduil by that time? I wonder what the fall-out/consequences will be for them having disobeyed a direct order from Thranduil and leaving the kingdom to go to Laketown?

My favorite speech from the entire LOTR series: Sam:“It’s like in the great stories Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn’t want to know the end, because how could the end be happy? How could the world go back to the way it was after so much bad had happened? But in the end, it’s only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come and when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer. Those are the stories that stayed with you, that meant something, even if you were too small to understand why. But I think, Mr. Frodo, I do understand, I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances at turning back, only they didn’t. They kept going because they were holding on to something.” Frodo: “What are we holding on to, Sam?” Sam: “That there’s some good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and it’s worth fighting for!”


Bladerunner
Gondor


Oct 21 2013, 11:18pm

Post #5 of 11 (211 views)
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I think in the movie the Master will in the end side with the elves.... [In reply to] Can't Post

and try to prevent the dwarves from continuing their quest, at which point Bard will help them escape while the mist blankets the town.



Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Oct 22 2013, 12:24am

Post #6 of 11 (175 views)
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Or the reverse [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I think in the movie the Master will in the end side with the elves.... and try to prevent the dwarves from continuing their quest, at which point Bard will help them escape while the mist blankets the town.



I think the opposite is more likely--if only because Bard seems to oppose Thorin's expedition. The Master weighs the popularity of the Dwarves among the Lake-men versus the possibility of angering the Elvenking and decides that it is better to beg forgiveness than to ask permission (so to speak). Besides, if the Dwarves succeed then there is great potential for new profits.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


Bladerunner
Gondor


Oct 22 2013, 3:11am

Post #7 of 11 (150 views)
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Bard may have a change of heart... [In reply to] Can't Post

Perhaps after talking with his kids, or some other reason (maybe Alfrid tries to kill him with that giant knife he is shown holding behind his back in the promo image). Or Bard may be outwardly opposing, but inwardly supportive of the quest. I guess we'll learn how the filmmakers played it soon enough, but, until then It's fun speculating...



MouthofSauron
Tol Eressea


Oct 22 2013, 4:06am

Post #8 of 11 (137 views)
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interesting how the orcs find their way inside Laketown? [In reply to] Can't Post

sneak attack? i thought the only way into Laketown was on a boat?


take me down to the woodland realm where the trees are green and the elf women are pretty....Oh will you please take me home!!


Faleel
Rohan

Oct 22 2013, 4:24am

Post #9 of 11 (123 views)
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Perhaps [In reply to] Can't Post

the thrush tells Taureil or Radgy ;)


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Oct 22 2013, 3:25pm

Post #10 of 11 (75 views)
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Boat or bridge [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
sneak attack? i thought the only way into Laketown was on a boat?



You forget about the bridge. This is how Thorin & Co. enter Lake-town in the book. The bridge should be guarded, but the watchmen may have become complacent and might not be properly prepared for a sudden attack of Orcs.

'There are older and fouler things than Orcs in the deep places of the world.' - Gandalf the Grey, The Fellowship of the Ring


Rembrethil
Tol Eressea


Oct 22 2013, 5:46pm

Post #11 of 11 (54 views)
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I like your idea [In reply to] Can't Post

It could happen, but then how would Dain know to come to the BOTFA??

Well they could make something up..... We will see!! Props for your creativity!!

 
 

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