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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Smaug Speaking

Preciousssss
The Shire

Oct 5 2013, 7:53am

Post #1 of 25 (1333 views)
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Smaug Speaking Can't Post

So far what we have heard of Smaug speaking has been awesome. But I think that when we see Smaug speaking it will look almost comical, or is that just me???
I just hope Peter and his team make it look realistic.
What do you think.


Cave Troll
Rivendell

Oct 5 2013, 8:08am

Post #2 of 25 (816 views)
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One of the few things... [In reply to] Can't Post

I have no fear about.

I think it'll look great.


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 5 2013, 8:08am

Post #3 of 25 (734 views)
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They conquered Gollum ... WETA can do anything! / [In reply to] Can't Post

 



Angharad73
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 8:28am

Post #4 of 25 (745 views)
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I'm sure it will be... [In reply to] Can't Post

...interesting Tongue

Didn't Cumberbatch say that he did Mocap for Smaug? I wonder how that worked...


Semper Fi
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 10:42am

Post #5 of 25 (690 views)
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But he is somewhat comical in the book [In reply to] Can't Post

He's very vain and that always come with a degree of comedy. Besides, Cumberbatch has a great comic timing, it would be a travesty to restrain him to play overly serious.

"RadagaStoner deserves no mercy!" Tauriel the Radagast Slayer, the Chief of Inglorious Elfguards

Tauriel saved us from Itaril. Never forget.



Peterthorn of Rohan
Rivendell

Oct 5 2013, 10:46am

Post #6 of 25 (647 views)
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I don't think he will be comical [In reply to] Can't Post

He will be evil!:-)


Semper Fi
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 10:50am

Post #7 of 25 (623 views)
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Evil can be comical [In reply to] Can't Post

and it's not a put-down to say that there's some comedy in it. the character was created that way by Tolkien.

"RadagaStoner deserves no mercy!" Tauriel the Radagast Slayer, the Chief of Inglorious Elfguards

Tauriel saved us from Itaril. Never forget.



xxxyyy
Rohan

Oct 5 2013, 12:58pm

Post #8 of 25 (609 views)
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I totally agree with you. Let's hope we don't see him talking. [In reply to] Can't Post

PJ and Co are a clever bunch of people, I'm sure they come up with something ingenious.
I think, having Smaug talk like a "normal" animal would be extremely mortifying... I think he should be portrayed as a supernatural being, able to creep into one's mind.
I'll keep my fingers crossed for something clever and not trivial and sadly comic like lipsinch.

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Fleuz
Lorien


Oct 5 2013, 1:25pm

Post #9 of 25 (566 views)
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They will not force Smaug to be comic like [In reply to] Can't Post

so I think when thy tried different things of how he speaks they tried both with moving lips etc. and without. And chose the right way for them.
And in the past this was always a good choice. Accept Azog of course... Angelic


Skaan
Lorien


Oct 5 2013, 1:28pm

Post #10 of 25 (567 views)
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His mouth already looks very flexible [In reply to] Can't Post

When looking at both the DoS trailers, Smaug's mouth and lips seem very flexible already, which suggests they've designed his mouth in a way that supports lip sync. I'm fairly certain we'll see him talk, rather than doing something like talking telepathically.

Also, i wouldn't really call lip sync on a dragon trivial. As far as i remember, we have yet to see a dragon with proper lip sync on screen, so Weta could bring something innovating with this similar to how they innovated on motion capture with Gollum in LOTR. The closest example we've got is the dragon from Dragonheart, but even there the dragon's mouth somewhat resembled a human mouth, whereas Smaug's mouth definately looks more like a mouth you'd expect a dragon/lizard to have.

It'll definately be no easy task to make this look good and not comical/cartoony though. And despite knowing what Weta's capable of, i still have my doubts about it. Let's hope for the best.


Hanzkaz
Rohan

Oct 5 2013, 4:49pm

Post #11 of 25 (496 views)
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I just hope a talking Smaug - [In reply to] Can't Post

- doesn't look like he's straight out of 'Dragonheart'.

That would ruin it for me.

Then again, I'd always wondered how they'd portray a Balrog on screen and was quite impressed by what PJ and Co. finally came up with.

___________________________________________________


From the makers of 'The Lord of the Rings' comes the sequel to Peter Jackson's Hobbit Trilogy -
'The War in the North, Part I : The Sword in the Tomb'.



(This post was edited by Hanzkaz on Oct 5 2013, 4:54pm)


Semper Fi
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 4:53pm

Post #12 of 25 (474 views)
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Dragonheart was made before mo'cap technology [In reply to] Can't Post

So you bet it won't look anything like that when he talks, if he talks and doesn't telepathically communicate with Bilbo or whatever.

"RadagaStoner deserves no mercy!" Tauriel the Radagast Slayer, the Chief of Inglorious Elfguards

Tauriel saved us from Itaril. Never forget.



Ham_Sammy
Tol Eressea

Oct 5 2013, 5:24pm

Post #13 of 25 (444 views)
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I'm not worried [In reply to] Can't Post

Weta and PeformanceCapture have come a long way. It's going to be great.

Thank you for your questions, now go sod off and do something useful - Martin Freeman Twitter chat 3/1/13


sycorax82
Rohan

Oct 5 2013, 7:07pm

Post #14 of 25 (404 views)
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Dragonheart was very well done, especially for the time (16 years ago now) [In reply to] Can't Post

The only downside to Draco speaking was how they had to give him basically human features in order to pull it off. He is still the screen dragon to beat, in my opinion. If WETA can bring the brilliance of Gollum to a dragon then they might just do it.


FaramirAndEowynMorningStar
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 7:15pm

Post #15 of 25 (413 views)
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Ooooh, he has such an eerie voice! [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm wondering if it's telepathy (like Saphira in Eragon) because they haven't made any of the other animals talk with their lips moving.

I thought that was quite interesting how, in the trailer, you cannot be sure where exactly the voice is coming from - all you know is that he is looking for Bilbo.

....."Loyalty, Honor,
......A Willing Heart.
I can ask no more than that."

...... ~ Thorin Oakenshield


Thorins_apprentice
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 8:42pm

Post #16 of 25 (397 views)
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Smaug,Gloin and Oin [In reply to] Can't Post

are the only character designs that look appropriate to the source material so far imo.All else has been butchered beyond belief, although Ori and Fili truly pass as Young Dwarves.As far as Smaug talking, I think it would be better to have him telepathically talking to Bilbo and the ring could be talking to him at the same time, just think how that could play out.The ring could be persuading him to take it off and reveal himself to Smaug and Bilbo has to fight the urge, frantically trying to hide from Smaug that could play around with his sanity for a bit. Think of the scene when Frodo is trying to hide, from the Ringwraiths in The Two towers, it could be a good parallel.

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(This post was edited by Thorins_apprentice on Oct 5 2013, 8:45pm)


ByThorinsBeard
Rohan


Oct 5 2013, 10:29pm

Post #17 of 25 (343 views)
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I don't so think so [In reply to] Can't Post

being that Smaug was one of the elements GDT helped to conceptualize, I think he will be menacing and not comical in his mannerisms.

Smaug has worked for me so far, very slithery and serpent like.

"Logic will get you from A to B. Imagination will take you anywhere." - Albert Einstein.



Smeagol Bagginsess
Rivendell


Oct 6 2013, 4:11am

Post #18 of 25 (286 views)
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I Don't think so. [In reply to] Can't Post

The
Ring hasn't awoken yet. It will be years before the Ring could have any
effect on the bearer.
That's when Sauron fully regains his strength. Otherwise, one would
wonder why the Ringwraiths were not aware of it whenever Bilbo put on
the Ring.
And that's not a very good way to bridge the two trilogies.


Old Pilgrim
Rivendell


Oct 6 2013, 5:35am

Post #19 of 25 (271 views)
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Don't forget on some older characters [In reply to] Can't Post

like Gandalf, Saruman and Galadriel whose character designs are very true to the lore. But otherwise I agree with you regarding Dwarves though I also like the appearance of some others like old Balin and Dwalin (though he should have some hair to look more authentic). Kili is the worst of the Dwarves as he can be also men or an elf. Other Dwarves won't be so bad with different hair style and more natural beards but after watching AUJ so many time they I find them quite fond already.

Now regarding Smaug and the ring. I wouldn't mind at all if he will be talking with his mouth without any telepathic thing because Middle Earth is a fantasy world and everything is possible here. Was Gollum strange seeing talking or three Trolls in the first movie? No and Smaug won't be either if they make it on a proper way. Some doesn't like that animals talk, but I was always enjoying watching Aslan in Narnia and wasn't complaining at all that his lips were moving.
Ring shouldn't play so vital role yet because it is too early. Becoming invisible is one of his greatest capabilities while others more mind orientated should be much more subtle.


Fleuz
Lorien


Oct 6 2013, 5:54am

Post #20 of 25 (245 views)
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But... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
The
Ring hasn't awoken yet. It will be years before the Ring could have any
effect on the bearer.
That's when Sauron fully regains his strength. Otherwise, one would
wonder why the Ringwraiths were not aware of it whenever Bilbo put on
the Ring.
And that's not a very good way to bridge the two trilogies.


The Ring had effected Gollum, when Sauron was "dead".
And also Bilbo had his hard moment in the LOTR Trilogy.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Oct 6 2013, 9:42am

Post #21 of 25 (228 views)
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I think there will be some humor in Smaug's portrayal. [In reply to] Can't Post

He need not be "comical". Pompous & Evil will do. Pompous and Evil can be played for humor.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

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Hanzkaz
Rohan

Oct 6 2013, 11:22am

Post #22 of 25 (224 views)
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Wouldn't the Necromancer's proximity - [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
The
Ring hasn't awoken yet. It will be years before the Ring could have any
effect on the bearer.


- affect the Ring? I would have thought that the Ring was active during the Erebor quest but had problems handling a Hobbit and only quietened down after it's Master relocated to Mordor. It probably only started playing up again decades because Sauron had got stronger ..

___________________________________________________


From the makers of 'The Lord of the Rings' comes the sequel to Peter Jackson's Hobbit Trilogy -
'The War in the North, Part I : The Sword in the Tomb'.



Old Pilgrim
Rivendell


Oct 7 2013, 8:11am

Post #23 of 25 (124 views)
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The One Ring [In reply to] Can't Post

had always influence on it's bearer what is clearly seen on Gollum. It is not just a tool to make you invisible, but it also change your character and you become obsessed with it after a long time bearing it.

The other question is whether the Ring can sense it's master and via versa. I believe the answer is that the Necromancer wasn't strong enough at that time to establish this connection and that is also the reason why Bilbo didn't see him while bearing the ring. Perhaps this connection was also vital for others to sense the One Ring since in the Hobbit no one knows that Bilbo have it while in the Lord of the Rings many sence its influence.


Misty Mountain Hop
Rivendell


Oct 7 2013, 8:16pm

Post #24 of 25 (91 views)
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I'm willing to bet WETA will blow us away! [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Oct 8 2013, 9:21am

Post #25 of 25 (85 views)
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nnaaaah won't be comical. Pretty sure they'll nail it. As long as they don't do some absurd voice alterations! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

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Both here on Earth and on the stage of the stars" - J.G.Kittel, writing about the composer Jan Dismas Zelenka (1740)
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