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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Reading Room:
This is properly a Movie Board question

sador
Valinor


Oct 1 2013, 5:12pm


Views: 371
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This is properly a Movie Board question [In reply to] Can't Post

In the books, the only indication as to what form Sauron is Gollum's statement in The Black Gate is Closed that Sauron has only four fingers in his hand, but they are enough - which sounds pretty humanoid to me.

In the Silmarillion it is stated that after the fall of Numenor Sauron wrought himself the form of "an image of hatred and malice made visible; and the Eye of Sauron few could endure", and also that he never could appear in a fair form again; but that means that the Great Eye was already a part of the form in which he wrestled with Elendil and Gil-galad. Assuming the Akallabeth (the chapter in the Sil which deals with the Fall of numenor, from which the quote above was taken) was written to be consistent with The Lord of the Rings, this means that at the time of writing Tolkien meant the Eye was both Sauron's physical Eye in his humanoid form, and a symbol of his malice and watchfulness.

Even considering LotR alone, the apellate "The Great Eye" used by Grishnakh is not a description of Sauron, but a mere symbol, as in the heraldry of Shagrat's company - as Aragorn states in The Departure of Boromir. This seems the most reasonable explanation.

However, there two instances in which the Eye seems to be physically channeling Sauron himself - when it preceives Frodo atop Amon Hen, and in the Witch-king's threat to Eowyn on the Pelnnor Fields. These two descriptions might be cases of Tolkien getting carried away with his own imagery, thus endowing the simile with a physical reality (possibly similar to the Balrog's wings?); but I still think they can be explained away.

These two cases are probably the sources for the image PJ and crew chose - together with the drawing of the Eye inside the Ring which appears on the cover of many editions of LotR. But it is clear that Saruman's statement in the FotR movie that Sauron cannot yet take physical form again, is contradicted by Gollum's testimony in the books.

And by the way, the only time an eye appears in the Ring, it is the eye of Tom Bombadil.

Subject User Time
The Eye of Sauron rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 1 2013, 3:05pm
    This is properly a Movie Board question sador Send a private message to sador Oct 1 2013, 5:12pm
        The movie did get its inspiration from the book, then took it a bit too far squire Send a private message to squire Oct 1 2013, 6:21pm
            interesting rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 1 2013, 6:42pm
            Do you think it is significant that these sightings are both by Frodo? noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Oct 4 2013, 5:09pm
                Of course squire Send a private message to squire Oct 4 2013, 5:45pm
                The Ear of Sauron is searching for you. CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Oct 4 2013, 5:54pm
                    The Ear, The Eye, The Mouth of Sauron… noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Oct 4 2013, 6:05pm
                        Upon which is vented... Darkstone Send a private message to Darkstone Oct 4 2013, 6:07pm
                            That Darth Vader-like heavy breathing emanating from Barad-dur CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Oct 4 2013, 6:15pm
                                Surprisingly irrelevant and unuseful... Darkstone Send a private message to Darkstone Oct 4 2013, 6:29pm
                                    The Foot of Sauron - was just a leg end// noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Oct 4 2013, 7:29pm
                                        Well that's a win.. Darkstone Send a private message to Darkstone Oct 4 2013, 7:49pm
                                            The Eye of Sauron Is Upon You Meneldor Send a private message to Meneldor Oct 5 2013, 12:11am
                                                Wish granted! Though I'm not from TX!! Rembrethil Send a private message to Rembrethil Oct 5 2013, 5:30pm
        defintely a Reading Room question... rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 1 2013, 6:46pm
        I think I must be one of the few book fans Hamfast Gamgee Send a private message to Hamfast Gamgee Oct 2 2013, 12:57pm
            So if he got his ring back, Meneldor Send a private message to Meneldor Oct 2 2013, 2:18pm
                that of course if the logical question rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 2 2013, 3:50pm
                    he doesn't need a physical body to use (or hold) the Ring acheron Send a private message to acheron Oct 2 2013, 4:08pm
                        True Acheron Brethil Send a private message to Brethil Oct 2 2013, 4:23pm
                        I think there were two versions... Rembrethil Send a private message to Rembrethil Oct 2 2013, 5:09pm
                            I think so Rem Brethil Send a private message to Brethil Oct 2 2013, 5:16pm
                        I believe i read somewhere rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 2 2013, 6:55pm
                            Beings of sufficient power could reimbody but it took time. ElendilTheShort Send a private message to ElendilTheShort Oct 3 2013, 10:01am
                    I never really put much thought into his physical manifestation in the TA Rembrethil Send a private message to Rembrethil Oct 2 2013, 4:10pm
                        On the Ringwraiths rangerfromthenorth Send a private message to rangerfromthenorth Oct 2 2013, 6:47pm
                Good question... Eye's on Guard Send a private message to Eye's on Guard Oct 3 2013, 1:41am
                Open at your own risk! Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Oct 5 2013, 12:30am
                    that Maciliel Send a private message to Maciliel Oct 5 2013, 2:11am
                        OMG I agree. Brethil Send a private message to Brethil Oct 5 2013, 4:17am
            But if Gollum didn't see him... Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Oct 2 2013, 11:59pm
                Yes he had a form during the later TA ElendilTheShort Send a private message to ElendilTheShort Oct 3 2013, 10:16am
    I always wondered Lightfoot Send a private message to Lightfoot Oct 3 2013, 1:07pm
        "I've got my eye on you" "Give me a hand" "Leg it!" "Man the guns" squire Send a private message to squire Oct 3 2013, 5:33pm
    Sauron's Third Age body Elthir Send a private message to Elthir Oct 3 2013, 5:47pm
        Just what I wanted to say!! Rembrethil Send a private message to Rembrethil Oct 4 2013, 1:39am

 
 
 

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