Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
The Hobbit revision

thorinoakenshield
Rivendell


Sep 14 2013, 8:28pm

Post #1 of 19 (862 views)
Shortcut
The Hobbit revision Can't Post

Hi people. I thought I would share an idea I had. First of all, let me first say that I LOVED AUJ. There were just some things I would have done differently. Ok, a LOT of things. It was still a great movie. Me and my brother had an idea though. We thought we could re-write the hobbit the way we envisioned it.(I mean the movie of coarse.) along with re-writing the screenplay, we also thought that we could draw our own designs for characters and locations. So, we and a few of our friends are going to start to do this "revision". I wanted to share this with you because I wanted to know what you would have done differently to AUJ. Not that it actually matters, because this is actually gonna be a movie, but I thought it would be fun. I also wanted to know weather or not you guys would be interested in me sharing the re write with you all. Thank you!


burgahobbit
Rohan


Sep 15 2013, 1:10am

Post #2 of 19 (349 views)
Shortcut
We'd love to see it! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hmmmm, let me think. This should be a fun thread. I know what the main complaints are (Azog, Radagast, character development, etc.) so I'll try some little nitpicks that are more unique. This is one of my biggest complaints about the film but not one I have seen addressed on here.

I would have had the Goblins capture the dwarves and Bilbo, in the cave rather than having the floor collapse. This way, when Bilbo sneaks away and lets the goblins walk past him, he would have had to make a choice. He had just told Bofur that he was going back to Rivindell, and Thorin overheard this. Now would be his chance. He can turn around and go back into the cave, and back to his home just like before. But this time his friends are in trouble. He looks back to the cave, but turns bravely and draws his sword, following the dwarves and the army of goblins. This also would have made sense of Thorin's statement later, when he says to Bilbo, "Why did you come back?". As it stands in the movie, Bilbo's speech was great, but what he should have said realistically is, "Well I wouldn't have come back, to be honest, but I didn't really have choice considering the fact that I can't fly, and I can't jump a hundred feet into the air and climb five miles up a crazy winding tunnel!"

That's one thing. Another thing I would have done different would be to make the trees at the end burn. I mean the ones that the company are actually on. Sure trees burn in the movie, but they missed the whole point, the fire was supposed to be a threat to the Company. Even if all the trees fall down and one hangs over the edge of the cliff (which I greatly dislike as it is), at least make the final tree burn as the eagles come to save the day just before it bursts into flames. Would have made the scene that much more iconic. Smile

Those are my two cents anyway.

"I've found it is the small things, everyday deeds of ordinary folk, that keeps the darkness at bay. Simple acts of kindness and love. Why Bilbo Baggins? Perhaps it is because Im afraid, and he gives me courage. - Gandalf the Grey.

"Do not be afraid Mithrandir, if ever you should need my help, I will come." - Lady Galadriel.

(This post was edited by burgahobbit on Sep 15 2013, 1:11am)


Eleniel
Grey Havens


Sep 15 2013, 7:58am

Post #3 of 19 (258 views)
Shortcut
Great point about the fire and the trees... [In reply to] Can't Post

that's something I hadn't really noticed, but yes, that would be much better in terms of realism and closeness to the description in the book.

Talking of which, my pet hate is the dialogue during the cooking of the Dwarves - the whole "parasite" conversation is simply way too modern (and scientifically, it should have been endoparasite, anyway Wink) for Tolkien, and besides, the whole thing was so obvious a time-wasting ploy that it took any tension out of the storyline as to how the party was going to escape. Surely it could have worked to keep the lines for Bilbo about the best way to cook Dwarf, but then, keeping the camera solely on the campfire scene, add Gandalf's disguised voice in to keep interjecting with a different method, as in the book, with the Trolls arguing and denying it was them speaking? We still wouldn't need to see Gandalf until the "Dawn take you" moment.

Just an idea...


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
Victoria Monfort


thorinoakenshield
Rivendell


Sep 15 2013, 1:19pm

Post #4 of 19 (193 views)
Shortcut
Great ideas! [In reply to] Can't Post

We have decided to scrap all elements of Azog, except in some sort of prologue/flashback at Azunulzibar. Also, we got rid of Radagast completely from the film. For the designs of the dwarves, we are making them look much more dwarf-like. There will be a Necromancer plot, except a lot more faithful to the appendecies. We are now trying to figure out where the first film will end. Our current options are 1. The climax of the film could be the goblin tunnel escape. In the fray, Bilbo will fall and hit his head and get knocked out. Screen goes black, and credits roll. 2. The film could end where the actual movie ended. 3. The film could end after Beorn's house, and the dwarves are standing outside of Mirkwood. Camera goes up above the trees showing the lonely mountain in the distance. I am certainly open to other ideas though!


malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:04pm

Post #5 of 19 (189 views)
Shortcut
A few things I'd change [In reply to] Can't Post

This of course depends on how we approach the film. If the Jackson films had never happended and we were just looking at The Hobbit, my thoughts:

I'd keep the fairytale tone of the book where approiate- I see no reasons why talking animals, talking purse (obviously), and as many songs as possible couldn't work with 'Durin's Folk'.

Beorn would be left an enigma.

Instead of the 'Dragon being silent for 60 years' I'd keep a closer timespan to the book say 120-150 years since the fall of Erebor-I always liked that the dwarves were essentially middle aged miners setting out against enormous odds to discover the fate of a old mystery-In AUJ the dwarves looked too human for my tastes, and I didn't like the contraction of the timeline, it all felt too heroic and too recent for me.

I'd keep an Older Thorin (and cast Ian Mcshane in the role) and the multi coloured beards and musical intstruments in the film-I always thought of Thorin as a wounded lion, old but fierce ,set in his ways, but as proud and heroic as he needs to be, I rather detested the mock Aragron direction PJ and co went for with their Thorin, he was far too predictable for my tastes, I'd make Thorin a bit more of a bad guy. It wouldn't sell at the cinema but hey it's my script.

I'd stick as close as possible to The real history of Durin's folk, but wouldn't show all of it in one go. leaving it to be spread out in flashback's over the course of the two films, and perhaps even have flashbacks to the fall of gondolin and the necklace of the Dwarves-IF I found it added to the story-I'd only show what was really appropriate to the tone and pace of The Hobbit's central story-and of course I'd leave some stuff for new readers to discover.

No Frodo, Romance, or Estel Cameo.

Bilbo would find Sting Himself.

Riddles would be kept line for line the same.

Yeah, no Fork Monster, Bolg would have a more prominent role but I wouldn't have him chasing the company so early in the stroyline, I'd have the Rabit wrangler in the film but I would introduce him later, perhaps at:

The White Council-I'd also add cameos for Cirdan and Glorfindel., and Celeborn.

-Even though I would have been fine with as little of the appendices stuff as possible in the film, I can appreciate Gandalf buggering off randomly would be a bit cheap, so I would include the Necromancer storyline-But keep it to an absolute minimum (say 10-15% of the Total storyline if that) and I would not reveal the Necromancer's true indentity as it has no place in The Hobbit.

I'd like to figure out a way to have the narrators voice in the film, though it might not have worked.

No rock em sock stone gaints-mysterious shapes in the fog-we see the size hear the noises and get a quick glimpse or two of them hurling rocks into the valley, but it wouldn't be entirely obvious who or what they are.

2 films not 3.

I don't have much to say.



thorinoakenshield
Rivendell


Sep 15 2013, 2:10pm

Post #6 of 19 (179 views)
Shortcut
Just so you know [In reply to] Can't Post

Our version is from scratch, so nothing will be the same as PJs unless we feel like it should. After hearing your idea about Bilbo wanting to help his friends instead of going home, we have decided to keep that element in. We are going to make it as consistent to LOTR as possible, so Bilbo finding the ring in FOTR prologue will be the same or very similar.
Also, I forgot to mention that we are debating weather or not there should be a prologue. We could have the attack on Erebor, or we could have it where it was in the book, at Bag-End. It could be narrated by Thorin.


malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:16pm

Post #7 of 19 (174 views)
Shortcut
How are you approaching the book? As it was conceived or what it became? [In reply to] Can't Post

I.e Are you looking at it as a children's fairytale loosely connected with BOLT and the 1926 Silmarillion, or a adventure story that leads into LOTR? Either way I'm curious to know how you would set up the backstory and culture of Middle Earth, and whether you would reference any events of the earlier ages (i.e Who Durin is, The Fall of Gondolin etc)

I don't have much to say.



Arannir
Valinor


Sep 15 2013, 2:24pm

Post #8 of 19 (178 views)
Shortcut
Only two major tings I would have done... [In reply to] Can't Post

... keep the stne giants as mere shadows moving in the mists, with one of the dwarves mntioning the old legends.

... scratch the tombs of the Nazgul OR explain that they have been undead since they fall to Sauron's will and that - if anything - their earthly remains could have been buried.



A dragon is no idle fancy. Whatever may be his origins, in fact or invention, the dragon in legend is a potent creation of mens imagination, richer in significance than his barrow is in gold. J.R.R. Tolkien

Words of wisdom that should be remembered - both by critics, purists and anyone in between.


malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:28pm

Post #9 of 19 (178 views)
Shortcut
No Talking Purse? [In reply to] Can't Post

One of the few elements of the story consistent to every single draft (even the 1960 hobbit)? Wink


Agreed on the other two counts, still scratching my head at how the ringwraiths can have tombs...

I don't have much to say.



Arannir
Valinor


Sep 15 2013, 2:28pm

Post #10 of 19 (166 views)
Shortcut
No, I absolutely hate the purse ;) [In reply to] Can't Post

 



A dragon is no idle fancy. Whatever may be his origins, in fact or invention, the dragon in legend is a potent creation of mens imagination, richer in significance than his barrow is in gold. J.R.R. Tolkien

Words of wisdom that should be remembered - both by critics, purists and anyone in between.


malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:33pm

Post #11 of 19 (163 views)
Shortcut
Don't tell DanielLB. [In reply to] Can't Post

I still say the purse is more in Tolkien's spirt than Tauirel (not saying it would workn in the film though)

I don't have much to say.



Escapist
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:34pm

Post #12 of 19 (168 views)
Shortcut
I think it depends on the purpose of the rewrite. [In reply to] Can't Post

If the goal was to make something that would increase critic reviews then I would drop the technology innovations, add more action (but make it less kid-friendly), keep it at two movies, increase the emotional content, and make a third bridge movie that focused on Aragorn and involved Viggo in a similar way to the involvement of Andy Serkis and included much more of the original cast of LotR.

If the goal was to make it more true to the books then I would add a narrator book-end layer and cut out appendix add-ins (but wouldn't necessarily shorten the number of movies to 2 - more likely it would be 3 movies closer to 2 hours each).

If the goal was to just make an entertaining movie appropriate for the widest general audience possible, I would be hard pressed to figure out what to change.


Arannir
Valinor


Sep 15 2013, 2:34pm

Post #13 of 19 (161 views)
Shortcut
Maybe. [In reply to] Can't Post

But I already hated it in the original book. TH (the book) is not an untouchable masterpiece to me.



A dragon is no idle fancy. Whatever may be his origins, in fact or invention, the dragon in legend is a potent creation of mens imagination, richer in significance than his barrow is in gold. J.R.R. Tolkien

Words of wisdom that should be remembered - both by critics, purists and anyone in between.


thorinoakenshield
Rivendell


Sep 15 2013, 2:40pm

Post #14 of 19 (164 views)
Shortcut
Malickfan [In reply to] Can't Post

We are approaching the film in a darker way than AUJ, but no that much darker. The first film will be like FOTR, where it is not as dark, and as the film progresses, it will get darker. We are getting rid of a lot of the fairy tale elements, but not all of them. One of the major changes is that the talking purse will be a part of Thorin and Company, ultimately replacing Bilbo in the end.Tongue


malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:40pm

Post #15 of 19 (161 views)
Shortcut
None of Tolkien's works are untouchable masterpeices... [In reply to] Can't Post

And this would be a pretty boring forum if they were.

TH is not Tolkien's best work, but in a funny way that's why I like it so much-it's not at the same level as LOTR so I look at it from a unrelated perspective, I sometimes think Tolkien spent so long building his world he forgot to work on the stories, The Hobbit is inconsistant and small scale, but to me it's an easier more enjoyable comfort read than the longwinded prose of LOTR, the LOTR is epic, The Hobbit is fun.

Just my two cents.

I don't have much to say.



malickfan
Gondor


Sep 15 2013, 2:43pm

Post #16 of 19 (155 views)
Shortcut
Hmm I'm partially with you... [In reply to] Can't Post

The Lack of fairytale fun is a bummer, but the jumpstarting of the purse's hollywood career is a plus.

If you fit in a cameo for Cirdan I'll forgive you.

I don't have much to say.



thorinoakenshield
Rivendell


Sep 15 2013, 3:02pm

Post #17 of 19 (157 views)
Shortcut
Cirdan and Glorfindell [In reply to] Can't Post

Will be at the white council. Another scene I forgot to mention is a birthday party scene. We thought that AUJ didn't have enough of the outside of the shire, so we divised a scene to help with this. It's the morning after Bilbo and Gandalfs chat outside of Bag-End. Bilbo is at a child's, possibly his cousins birthday party. Bilbo has a chat with the boys father. Bilbo gives the child his gift. The boy opens it up, and it is a toy dragon. The boys father looks at Bilbo with disappointment. He says something about how hobbit children should not be badly influenced by a dragon toy, and If he grew up thinking about dragons, he might become like those Tooks, going on adventures all the time. The camera pans into Bilbo's face. It looks like Bilbo is trying to remember something. "adventures" he said under his breath. "Gandalf!" Bilbo runs off to Bag-End thinking that he is late for tea with Gandalf.
That is only a rough draft , so it may be completely different.


Eleniel
Grey Havens


Sep 15 2013, 5:43pm

Post #18 of 19 (129 views)
Shortcut
Regarding prologue or not... [In reply to] Can't Post

The fan edit I've seen, a shortened version of the Erebor prologue is inserted into the Unexpected Party sequence. I think it may have even been done in two visual segments rather than one long exposition... It does work very well, though hearing Old Bilbo's voice at that point in the proceedings is obviously wrong, but for your version someone else would be narrating, presumably!


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
Victoria Monfort


burgahobbit
Rohan


Sep 16 2013, 1:16pm

Post #19 of 19 (64 views)
Shortcut
About that idea [In reply to] Can't Post

When I posted that I thought that you were simply changing the current movie to what you wanted it to be, rather than starting from scratch. Sorry for the confusion. In that case, you could just use that moment as it is in the book. There is a similar choice Bilbo makes in the book when he has just made it out of the Misty Mountains. He does not know where the Company is, and assumes that they are still in the tunnels. He feels that it is his duty to go back in and save them, despite how hard his struggles in there had just been, and as he is discerning and just when he decides to help the dwarves out, he hears them in the opposite direction.

So you could just scrap my "movie version" that they didn't use in the movie anyway and just stick with the book in this case. Smile

"I've found it is the small things, everyday deeds of ordinary folk, that keeps the darkness at bay. Simple acts of kindness and love. Why Bilbo Baggins? Perhaps it is because Im afraid, and he gives me courage. - Gandalf the Grey.

"Do not be afraid Mithrandir, if ever you should need my help, I will come." - Lady Galadriel.

 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.