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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
The SLIGHTLY Extended Edition
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Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 3:41am

Post #151 of 371 (2884 views)
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Why would you doubt? [In reply to] Can't Post

All of the material is being done by the exact same team who worked on the LotR appendices (Michael Pellerin and his crew). I don't know why you'd expect the material here to be anything less than phenomenal.

"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence


(This post was edited by Aragorn the Elfstone on Aug 1 2013, 3:43am)


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 3:46am

Post #152 of 371 (2854 views)
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All other considerations aside, I still say Woody Allen should have been Bilbo. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 3:47am

Post #153 of 371 (2880 views)
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DoM [In reply to] Can't Post

It has come to mean giving a company a pass on something they have done and could do better, consequently encouraging them to lowering their own standards and expectations.


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 3:51am

Post #154 of 371 (2872 views)
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The Team [In reply to] Can't Post

It's not the team folks are criticizing. Folks are seeing past that to understand that it's a different company with different aesthetics and standards running and supporting the team. WB is not New Line. The Hobbit is not The Lord of the Rings. If The Lord of the Rings Extended Editions were phenomenal, The Hobbit Extended Edition is less than phenomenal with fewer than promised minutes and fewer commentary tracks, both popular items.


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Aug 1 2013, 3:54am)


FrogmortonJustice65
Rivendell


Aug 1 2013, 3:54am

Post #155 of 371 (2870 views)
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I am fine with this... [In reply to] Can't Post

Granted, I am likely an outlier and have not purchased the theatrical edition of AUJ, so I am not getting "robbed" by WB/New Line/PJ/whoever. I don't understand the point of buying an inferior product when you know a superior (in this case superior by 13 minutes Tongue ) product is just around the corner if you have patience.

Maybe I just have more patience than some other people. Or perhaps I am cheaper/stingier.

I suppose if I was really hankering to watch AUJ between its theatrical run and the release of the EE, I could just rent it rather than shelling out $20 (or whatever it costs) for a bare-bones DVD. I actually see no need to rewatch AUJ right away - I saw it twice in theaters. There is no point in obsessively re-watching it for me in that interim period between AUJ and DoS. I'll pick up the EE in October and watch it once or twice before DoS and be happy.

People complaining about getting "sucked into paying for 2 versions" are silly. WB and PJ didn't point a gun to your head and force you to buy it. You bought it because you are a good consumer and blindly bought an inferior product knowing that an improved version would be released a few months later. You have nobody to blame but yourself. Have some self control; or if you really cannot help but watch the movie again, rent it or torrent it or find another way to see it that doesn't involve you paying to own the same movie on DVD twice.

I'm *a little*, and truthfully, only a little, disappointed there will only be 13 extra minutes, but I'm sure there will be plenty of bonus content for the next films. And as long as the QUALITY of the bonus scenes is good, I'm not that concerned about sheer QUANTITY. I haven't watched the Elrond/Bilbo scene which is circulating (I hate watching bits and pieces of movies I am anticipating but haven't seen yet, I want to see the entire cohesive product), but it sounds like the scenes they've included for the EE will please fans like me that enjoy character development type of scenes. Bilbo in the Shire, Rivendell, etc, all sounds great.

Not really sure how the extras/documentaries stack up with the LOTR DVDs but that doesn't really concern me. They're of secondary importance; I will watch them once or twice and enjoy them, but I'm really buying the DVD for the movie and 13 extra minutes I didn't see in theaters.

The box art is fine too; a little disappointed that my Hobbit EE's wont perfectly match up with my LOTR ones, but it's not that big of a deal in my mind.

Also, how much longer do you think PJ could even make AUJ if wanted??? It already has a quite lengthy runtime given that it is the first of a three part series based on a very slim book.

 photo cbccab4e-f61e-4be5-aaa1-20e302430c7c.jpg

(This post was edited by FrogmortonJustice65 on Aug 1 2013, 3:56am)


Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 3:55am

Post #156 of 371 (2865 views)
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Have you not seen the Best Buy documentary [In reply to] Can't Post

"A Hobbit's Tale: The Journey Begins" that was included in their exclusive edition of the theatrical cut? It was 30 minutes long and a small tease of what we'll be getting with the Appendices. It was perfectly in line with the quality we've come to expect from the LotR appendices.

I know you all think WB is the Necromancer and all, but Michael and his team shoot and edit the material - not WB.

"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence


(This post was edited by Aragorn the Elfstone on Aug 1 2013, 3:58am)


jtarkey
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 3:56am

Post #157 of 371 (2862 views)
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AUJ was filmed by nearly the exact same team that made LOTR... [In reply to] Can't Post

And I wasn't very impressed...

If I found both the film and the original Blu-Ray release itself to be less than phenomenal, why would why expect anything different? Especially when the details thus far don't seem to genuinely impress any one..

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 4:00am

Post #158 of 371 (2830 views)
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The alternative is that some of might be sincere in our affection.// [In reply to] Can't Post

//

"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 4:02am

Post #159 of 371 (2842 views)
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The Box [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Granted, I am likely an outlier and have not purchased the theatrical edition of AUJ, so I am not getting "robbed" by WB/New Line/PJ/whoever. I don't understand the point of buying an inferior product when you know a superior (in this case superior by 13 minutes Tongue ) product is just around the corner if you have patience.

...The box art is fine too; a little disappointed that my Hobbit EE's wont perfectly match up with my LOTR ones, but it's not that big of a deal in my mind.


Folks might be less disappointed if Sir Peter Jackson had not "promised" 25 minutes. Thirteen is better than zero, afterall. But 13 minutes is still shorter than any of the LOTR EEs, and there is far less commentary. So it doesn't add up for folks as solidly as the LOTR EEs.

Box art: Really? This is the first I've heard the boxes are not compatible with the LOTR boxes. That is major deal to many, including myself, whose cynicism about WB's marketing management this time around stoked fears that they wouldn't get even the boxes right. Do you have a source for this box issue? Boy, if true, it really seals the deal for WB Marketing's bad reputation.


Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 4:05am

Post #160 of 371 (2848 views)
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Where's the 25 minute quote? [In reply to] Can't Post

I recall hearing PJ say "15...20...25 minutes", in an AICN interview, which I took to mean that he hadn't made up his mind. Where did he definitively say 25 minutes?

"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 4:06am

Post #161 of 371 (2823 views)
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Still Not On Point [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
"A Hobbit's Tale: The Journey Begins" that was included in their exclusive edition of the theatrical cut? It was 30 minutes long and a small tease of what we'll be getting with the Appendices. It was perfectly in line with the quality we've come to expect from the LotR appendices.

I know you all think WB is the Necromancer and all, but Michael and his team shoot and edit the material - not WB.


I don't think folks are complaining about the lengthy special features other than a comparatively short 13 minutes of extra footage out of a "promised" 25, and a dearth of commentary (and now maybe the box itself). There's really no issue with what you say above, but that's not the concern.


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Aug 1 2013, 4:07am)


FrogmortonJustice65
Rivendell


Aug 1 2013, 4:07am

Post #162 of 371 (2835 views)
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concerning box art [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

Box art: Really? This is the first I've heard the boxes are not compatible with the LOTR boxes. That is major deal to many, including myself, whose cynicism about WB's marketing management this time around stoked fears that they wouldn't get even the boxes right. Do you have a source for this box issue? Boy, if true, it really seals the deal for WB Marketing's bad reputation.


My source is just people complaining around here. I sympathize with this concern because I am also a collector and value continuity, but at the same time it's not a major disappointment for me. You can't judge a DVD by looking at the box art.

 photo cbccab4e-f61e-4be5-aaa1-20e302430c7c.jpg


jtarkey
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:08am

Post #163 of 371 (2831 views)
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The box art is a big deal for me, I'm sorry. [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm hearing a lot of comments such as "it's not a big deal" and "I can live with it".

Why have that attitude when the LOTR EE's set a standard that most of us assumed would be followed? Why should we so readily brush things aside that are such obvious mistakes in marketing?

If it's really no concern to some people, I guess that's fine?

I just feel it should be. Once again, WE are the ones paying for this. Is it wrong that I expected something on the same level of quality as the LOTR EE's? And I'm not even talking about the amount of footage here. Simply the presentation and details are enough to make me raise an eyebrow.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Aragorn the Elfstone
Tol Eressea


Aug 1 2013, 4:09am

Post #164 of 371 (2812 views)
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Please read the rest of this subthread... [In reply to] Can't Post

We are indeed discussing the documentaries. Some here are expressing concern that they'll merely be rehashes of the production vlogs.

"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence


(This post was edited by Aragorn the Elfstone on Aug 1 2013, 4:11am)


bborchar
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:12am

Post #165 of 371 (2783 views)
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I also don't recall hearing an exact time given... [In reply to] Can't Post

...people have just assumed that his rough estimate was cold hard fact.

Honestly, it just feels like he's criticized for everything he does, not matter what it is.


The Doctor: ... No! No! Nonononononono, it's... not like that. That's not what I'm like!
Amy: Then what are you like?
The Doctor: I dunno, Gandalf. Like a space Gandalf. Or that little green guy in Star Wars...


jtarkey
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:16am

Post #166 of 371 (2807 views)
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No, he's critisized because there are some legititmate concerns about the general quality of these films. [In reply to] Can't Post

Look no further than the comparison between the praise LOTR received and the less than warm welcome of AUJ.

No one is picking on PJ. No one has some vendetta or agenda against his decisions.

Just as some people legitimately love AUJ, some legitimately don't.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


angelclaw
Bree

Aug 1 2013, 4:20am

Post #167 of 371 (2785 views)
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Because I don't want to be disappointed [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't know how much more plainly I can say it. I really want the Appendices to be all new material, and I really want the extra 13 minutes to be pure gold. I just don't want to get my hopes up only to have them crushed, because that's kind of the vibe I'm getting with what we know so far.


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 4:23am

Post #168 of 371 (2814 views)
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Unbalanced [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
The alternative is that some of might be sincere in our affection.


Of course. But some folks are more unbalanced than others in their objectivity, offering only praise in a deeply biased fashion and allowing no criticism, to provide a sense of balance, to go undefended. People like me feel the need to provide the critical balance to compensate for those who cannot or are unwilling to provide it for themselves. The decision is still theirs, however, so they are free to remain in their private utopia. Wink


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Aug 1 2013, 4:29am)


bborchar
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:30am

Post #169 of 371 (2784 views)
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But this has absolutely nothing to do with the "quality" of the film... [In reply to] Can't Post

...this is just people upset because they convinced themselves of one thing and then got another. PJ never said "It will be 25 minutes, definitely"...he gave a rough estimate.

I can be quite critical when I believe criticism is warranted- but I fail to see how that applies in this case.


The Doctor: ... No! No! Nonononononono, it's... not like that. That's not what I'm like!
Amy: Then what are you like?
The Doctor: I dunno, Gandalf. Like a space Gandalf. Or that little green guy in Star Wars...


(This post was edited by bborchar on Aug 1 2013, 4:32am)


Ataahua
Superuser / Moderator


Aug 1 2013, 4:35am

Post #170 of 371 (2784 views)
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It is not anyone's role here to compensate for others' opinions. [In reply to] Can't Post

If you haven't read it in recent months, please reaquaint yourself with Silverlode's sticky post at the top, 'The courtesy of our hall has somewhat lessened of late', - particularly parts of points seven and eight.

We expect every to stay within our TORnetiquette during discussions.

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauronís master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded beggar with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Ataahua's stories


jtarkey
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:36am

Post #171 of 371 (2771 views)
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Yes! My feelings exactly! [In reply to] Can't Post

Of course I want everything to be fantastic. But since I've already experienced disappointment with this entire production, being cautious is the only safe route.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


jtarkey
Rohan


Aug 1 2013, 4:41am

Post #172 of 371 (2784 views)
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But the length of extra footage isn't the main concern here. [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm actually satisfied with 13 minutes. That doesn't bother me at all. It also doesn't help either...

What bothers me is the lack of commentaries, the possibility that we've already seen a good deal of the special features, and the disappointing cover.

It just comes across as cheap, and not in the vein of the LOTR EE's at all.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Aug 1 2013, 4:41am

Post #173 of 371 (2784 views)
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Momentum [In reply to] Can't Post

It really seems to me to be more of a WB issue than a PJ issue. Jackson had plenty of good faith momentum going into The Hobbit from LOTR. He is probably not in control of things like making sure the new boxes are compatible with the LOTR boxes. Saying 25 minutes, then changing it to 13 - I think he is in control of that, but with heavy WB influence.

He always makes a good impression on me when I see him in videos despite my complaints. I like Peter Jackson from afar, but I don't know him personally so my objectivity tells me I cannot completely trust videos and interviews. I can see, however, where he has to be politic at times in his position to stay friendly with the studio, government, or whomever else he needs to please, giving less than candid responses. In that sense, I have some sympathy for what he has to deal with every day.

But The Hobbit has turned into something less than LOTR and so any lost momentum, I feel, has only been lost through mistakes on The Hobbit and not anyone's personal opinions of the man. I only hope that the next two films bring it back.


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Aug 1 2013, 4:47am)


zombywoof
The Shire

Aug 1 2013, 4:42am

Post #174 of 371 (2822 views)
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A new member's perspective... [In reply to] Can't Post

I can understand why some might feel a bit cheated by this - particularly since many of us paid $30 for the blu-ray as it is. Why didn't they just release the extended edition to start with. Oh, right! They can make more money off of us this way! :-)

Personally, I found the theatrical cut to have the feel of an extended edition as it is, which is why I liked it so much. Like many of you, I'll be buying to see those documentaries and to listen to those commentaries. I really enjoyed hearing PJ and co talk about what he changed and why. It's a bit of a bummer that we won't get cast commentaries, but it's possible that PJ has spoiled us with the LoTR sets!


Ham_Sammy
Tol Eressea

Aug 1 2013, 4:43am

Post #175 of 371 (2757 views)
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same here [In reply to] Can't Post

Although I am not disappointed in AUJ, I am disappointed in WB's ham handedness in marketing and the lackluster design of much that surrounds the film. It just feels like WB doesn't care about the fans. The New Line experience was far different. I think that's the majority of the disappointment. The fact that they think they can just throw some red meat out there and people will buy it without any real thought of going first class for a first class fandom.

Thank you for your questions, now go sod off and do something useful - Martin Freeman Twitter chat 3/1/13

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