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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Northern Mine Barrage :
Beorn in the trailer

thorinoakenshield
Cabin Boy


Jul 21 2013, 6:46pm

Post #1 of 20 (1807 views)
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Beorn in the trailer Can't Post

I recently read the 'Queer Lodgings' chapter in The Hobbit, and the line where it says Bilbo had uneasy dreams about Beorn. Could what we see in the trailer be a dream? We clearly see a bear, most likely Beorn, bursting through the door of a building, most likely Beorn's Hall. Could this be one of Bilbo's dreams, or is this the real deal? Thoughts, speculation?


MomoftheShire
Cabin Boy

Jul 21 2013, 7:13pm

Post #2 of 20 (789 views)
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Real? Maybe [In reply to] Can't Post

Gandalf warns the company not to go outside at night. Could be they didn't listen, or, like you surmise, one of Bilbo's dreams. Really don't think that clip is their first encounter with Beorn.


vexx801
Cabin Boy


Jul 21 2013, 9:11pm

Post #3 of 20 (665 views)
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Hmm. [In reply to] Can't Post

I suppose I hadn't considered this as a possibility. But it would certainly make sense! I would rather what we saw to not be our introduction to Beorn.


Barrow-Wight
Rigger


Jul 21 2013, 9:30pm

Post #4 of 20 (683 views)
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many possibilities [In reply to] Can't Post

maybe they discover Beorn's house and find it empty and take refuge only to be attacked by Beorn in bear form. Or they meet him in human form and stay at his house only to discover he's a skin changer later? lot of possibilities.


Carne
Sailing Master

Jul 21 2013, 9:36pm

Post #5 of 20 (638 views)
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I agree with your first guess [In reply to] Can't Post

Most likely the company arriving at Beorn's house only to find it empty. Maybe they're being chased by some warg riders and decide to enter, only to have Beorn show up later realizing someone or something is inside his house.


Lieutenant of Dol Guldur
Gunner


Jul 21 2013, 10:05pm

Post #6 of 20 (698 views)
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Here's my DOS beginning and first meeting with Beorn [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Maybe they're being chased by some warg riders and decide to enter


Here is my theory of the DOS beginning. Starting with the Gandalf meets Thrain in Dol Guldur (or Moria) flashback as a prologue. Perhaps introducing Bolg and perhaps even a glimpse of Beorn. Cut. Today. On their way from the Carrock to Mirkwood Gandalf remembers this first meeting with Beorn but is interrupted by howling. Wargs. Perhaps Fimbul (the master hunter) tracked them. Azog is not with him but sending his best Orcs with him. The company again runs away. The notice a giant house and because there are warg-rider behind them they only notice the open door. They enter. It's all empty. They close the door and only can hear what happens. They hear Orcs crying and a roaring bear (do bears roar?). They open the door because they want to know what's going on outside. We see a giant bear killing Orcs and Wargs and rip them apart. Very brutal. Than the bear notices the Dwarves. His head turns to the open door. He attacks them as we see it in the trailer. He manages to enter the house but than Gandalf saves the day. He speaks some powerful words in an old language and the bear transforms into Beorn.

What about this theory? My only problem with it is that it reminds me a little bit too much of the two Warg attack scenes from AUJ. Where the company is chased by Warg-riders and are saved in the last minute. Especially the first scene where thy first can't see what's going on. The difference is that their savior this time attacks them too. At least for a short moment.



"There is only one Lord of the Ring, only one who can bend it to his will. And he does not share power."


MomoftheShire
Cabin Boy

Jul 21 2013, 10:20pm

Post #7 of 20 (616 views)
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That's A HUGE supposition! [In reply to] Can't Post

Frown


burgahobbit
Rigger


Jul 22 2013, 12:07am

Post #8 of 20 (555 views)
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I think its a cool idea [In reply to] Can't Post

And the comparisons with the first two warg scenes doesn't make it impossible. All the warg chases would still have a unique flavor and I have my own idea for this Beorn scene.

1. Radagast distracts the wargs as the Company stealthily makes their way across the land until they are smelled and surrounded. It is bright daylight and Azog is not present. They are saved by elves at the last moment.
2. The Company hears the wargs and runs to the edge of a cliff. They climb up into trees and it is night. Azog the Defiler reveales himself to Thorin. Finally the Company's last tree is being pushed off the mountainside by the wargs before the eagles finally swoop in and save the day.
3. (speculation): The dwarves, Bilbo and Gandalf walk casually away from the Carrock all day until it is evening. The wargs are heard in the distance and the company makes for the open door of Beorn's house, wolves howling and orcs grunting behind them. They wait in quiet in the house. Soon they hear something bounding towards them, a head appears in the door and they think it is a warg until Gandalf says, "Do not harm him, this is no enemy!" But Beorn still isn't so sure, he breaks through the door now that the dwarves have stopped resisting and is about to kill when Gandalf holds him back with some magic.

"I don't mean to be blunt but I felt I had to speak my mind, I'm sorry." - Bilbo Baggins.
"Apology accepted." - Balin.


"You don't really suppose do you that all your adventures and escapes were managed by mere luck? Just for your sole benefit?"
"There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring, and not by its maker. In which case you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought." - Gandalf the Grey, from The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings.


DuBekar
Cabin Boy


Jul 22 2013, 10:26am

Post #9 of 20 (424 views)
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I really hope so.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Because i don't want Beorn to be introduce in this way because he is a funny but serious character and the scene in the book when they first meet Beorn is iconic and funny! I would love it too be that way.

I have a theory also:

After Gandalf and co has climbed down Carrock and moving towards Mirkwood they will stop at Beorns house (like in the book). Gandalf introduce everyone (perhaps not exactly like the book, but some) and after some talk and maybe some flashback scenes of Beorn being tortured by Bolg in Dol Goldur they are interupt or something by the Wargs and Beorns yells too them too seek refuge inside his house (like in the sneek peek back in March) and Bilbo is the last to enter and sees Beorn transforms into a bear and starts to kill Orcs and then charge the house (if i remember correctly Beorn couldn't control himself in Bear form, right?) And then Gandalf use Magic to turn him back, or he leaves and comes back in the morning.

" Why, O people of Noldor! Fëanor cried. Why should we longer serve the jealous Valar, who cannot keep us nor even their own realm secure from their enemy? And though he be now their foe, are not they and he of one kin? Vengence calls me hence, but even were it otherwise I would not dwell longer in the same land with the kin of my father's slayer and of the thief of treasure. Yet i am not the only valiant in this valiant people. And have ye not all lost your King? And what else have ye not lost, cooped here in a narrow land between the mountains and the sea? Here once was light, that the Valar begrudged to middle-earth, but now dark levels all. Shall we mourn here deedless forever, a shadow-folk, mist-haunting, dropping vain tears in the thankless sea? Or shall we return to our home? In cuiviènen sweet ran the waters under uncloaded stars, and wide lands lay about, where a free people might walk. There they lie still and await us who in out folly forsook them. Come away! Let the cowards keep this city!"

(This post was edited by DuBekar on Jul 22 2013, 10:28am)


Arandir
Gunner


Jul 22 2013, 1:47pm

Post #10 of 20 (395 views)
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Beorn's introduction to the dwarves is one of my favourite moments in the book [In reply to] Can't Post

It's one of those moments I really look forward to reading - however, it is clear that (due to time constraints - even though with a trilogy now), there's no way they're going to waist 5 or 6 minutes reintroducing us to the characters just for the sake of that scene - unless, of course, they think of a clever way around it.

As to that sequence, I've never thought of it in terms of being a dream (though it's interesting - even though it clearly isn't night time).

I've always thought that the bear attacking the company is one of Beorn's other bear-friends making an acquaintance .. Sly

Other than that, I do like the idea of the Company sheltering in his house and Beorn initially reacting against potential strangers ...

'A Tolkienist's Perspective' Blog


Bombadil
First Mate


Jul 22 2013, 2:10pm

Post #11 of 20 (353 views)
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Anyone of these Ideas are Great! [In reply to] Can't Post

Bomby tries to remain
Non-Judgemental...


SGH9564
Swabbie

Jul 22 2013, 10:58pm

Post #12 of 20 (259 views)
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Does anyone think it is possible ......... [In reply to] Can't Post

that that is not in fact Beorn? I know this may sound weird, but the first time I watched the trailer, I thought that looked much more like a giant dog than a giant bear. To me the face just does not look bear-ish? enough, and the proportion of the head is more similar to a large dog. We know from the book that Beorn does have large bees on the premise, is it possible that he has giant guard dogs? This would make sense for his character (standoffish outsider) and not be too far of a stretch from the book. The company could be chased into the house by these dogs and Beorn comes to save the day/ and or Gandalf calms them down? Sorry that was so long, but what do you guys think?


burgahobbit
Rigger


Jul 23 2013, 12:51am

Post #13 of 20 (229 views)
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I think its possible [In reply to] Can't Post

It sounds like something Peter Jackson might do and it's a really cool idea. But personally I think that its just unfinished CGI that's supposed to look like a bear. We'll just have to wait and see. (And you're good, that post wasn't too long at all!) Smile

"I don't mean to be blunt but I felt I had to speak my mind, I'm sorry." - Bilbo Baggins.
"Apology accepted." - Balin.


"You don't really suppose do you that all your adventures and escapes were managed by mere luck? Just for your sole benefit?"
"There are other forces at work in this world, Frodo, besides the will of evil. Bilbo was meant to find the Ring, and not by its maker. In which case you also were meant to have it. And that is an encouraging thought." - Gandalf the Grey, from The Hobbit and The Lord of the Rings.

(This post was edited by burgahobbit on Jul 23 2013, 12:51am)


Faenoriel
Sailing Master


Jul 23 2013, 7:58pm

Post #14 of 20 (122 views)
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If that's Bilbo's dream, it's lot more boring than the one in the book [In reply to] Can't Post

The dancing bears were such a magical moment... one hopes against hope PJ won't turn it into a dull action scene.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


The Grey Elf
Gunner


Jul 24 2013, 12:38am

Post #15 of 20 (110 views)
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I think the company just wound up at the wrong address somehow... [In reply to] Can't Post

Ate up all the porridge, Bombur then broke a chair .... According to lore, bears react poorly to home invasions by moppets. Wink


Rembrethil
Sailing Master

Jul 24 2013, 2:02am

Post #16 of 20 (113 views)
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I'm thinking about the Bear-dance that goes on at the end of their first day with Beorn [In reply to] Can't Post

I think that Beorn warns them about not opening the door at night, but SOMEBODY doesn't listen and a wild bear charges the door.


Lost Hobbit
Cabin Boy


Jul 24 2013, 6:02am

Post #17 of 20 (102 views)
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I had... [In reply to] Can't Post

...even more pessimistic idea. Beorn mentally acts like Hulk, unable to control his emotions and this is when he break into his own house.... Crazy


Fredeghar Wayfarer
Able Seaman


Jul 24 2013, 9:22am

Post #18 of 20 (88 views)
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Your theory seems very likely... [In reply to] Can't Post

...but regardless of whether there's another warg attack, I think this will be our first glimpse of Beorn. Re-introducing the dwarves two by two as they meet Beorn isn't very cinematic. That scene will probably be condensed, as their intro at Bag End was. They will likely all enter Beorn's Hall at the same time and be mistaken for trespassers when Beorn gets home. My guess is that after a frightening moment of the Company fending off a giant bear, Gandalf clears up the misunderstanding.

And I'd be okay with that. Beorn may be a humorous character but he's not someone to be trifled with. Even in the book, I got a sense of unease and danger from him.


Rembrethil
Sailing Master

Jul 24 2013, 2:15pm

Post #19 of 20 (84 views)
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Maybe!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Too possible to be ignored. I was just surprised that no one else thought of it!


celboy
Swabbie


Aug 2 2013, 7:01pm

Post #20 of 20 (39 views)
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Being that...... [In reply to] Can't Post

Weta did the bear in a forrest scene in "Wolverine", I hope it looks better than that did.

I really hope they nail that.

celboy

"I'm a libra. What sign are you?"--Dwan KK76

 
 

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