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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
what would you have done differently?
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LordElrond
Rivendell


Mar 30 2013, 2:13am

Post #1 of 42 (717 views)
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what would you have done differently? Can't Post

I thought AUJ was fine as it was so this isnt to be negative but I just want other fans ideas about how you would make the first movie if you could've made TheHobbit a trilogy? I know alot of people would cut the Azog plotline but I cant see how it would've been a standalone film without him.


(This post was edited by LordElrond on Mar 30 2013, 2:14am)


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Mar 30 2013, 2:31am

Post #2 of 42 (434 views)
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Keep Aragorn junior [In reply to] Can't Post

in our imaginations.

Vous commencez m'ennuyer avec le port!!!


Sinister71
Tol Eressea


Mar 30 2013, 2:37am

Post #3 of 42 (444 views)
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Very simply [In reply to] Can't Post

the first film would have worked better IMO if they had only used Azog for the prologue and had Bolg in the remainder of the film. Having Dain Ironfoot show up to dispatch Azog as should be and set him up as a already great dwarf when he takes the throne as King under the mountain. THAT would have made sense instead of rewriting Tolkien's lore. Crazy


Honestly making the book into a trilogy is in my eyes all about making money and nothing more. I would have made 2 films, using more miniatures, more practical effects and less CGI, using the same cameras and technology LOTR was filmed with. So that all 5 films flowed together as one big master piece.. I would have still showed the DolGuldur stuff without getting too in depth about who the necromancer is, not tried tying everything evil in middle earth to him. Also doing things like letting the ring be a mere trinket without much explanation without resorting to slow motion dropping or close ups (since it gets full disclosure in FOTR) leaving a bit of mystery to be discovered later in LOTR as it should be.


WhiskFishercat
Bree


Mar 30 2013, 2:37am

Post #4 of 42 (402 views)
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the goblin king [In reply to] Can't Post

i would have changed his goofy one liner into something more dramatic.

I wish Azog wasnt CG.


jtarkey
Rohan


Mar 30 2013, 2:38am

Post #5 of 42 (423 views)
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I think I have it down at this point... [In reply to] Can't Post

1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...

IMO, with all of those things taken into account, AUJ could have been on par with LOTR.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Ham_Sammy
Tol Eressea

Mar 30 2013, 2:47am

Post #6 of 42 (388 views)
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Like others [In reply to] Can't Post

CGI Azog would have stayed as an actor
Cut the slapstick humor (but keep the characters like Radagast. Just get rid of the slapstick)

I was fine with the rest of it. All of it.

Thank you for your questions, now go sod off and do something useful - Martin Freeman Twitter chat 3/1/13


Chubb-Baggins
The Shire


Mar 30 2013, 2:57am

Post #7 of 42 (383 views)
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Personally [In reply to] Can't Post

1. Replace Azog with Bolg.
2. Make the Goblin King menacing instead of being a comic relief and in general let the whole Goblin Town situation be much more dangerous but realistic. Goblin = Orc.


(This post was edited by Chubb-Baggins on Mar 30 2013, 3:04am)


tarasaurus
Rohan


Mar 30 2013, 3:00am

Post #8 of 42 (370 views)
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I wouldn't [In reply to] Can't Post

I wouldn't change a thing. I loved every bit of it and treat the movies and books as two separate, though obviously similar, entities. I love what a lot of people disliked; I thought the full CGI looked brilliant and realistic, I loved all the humor, I was even fine with Azog being in it. I can't remember where I read someone say this quote (could have been the forums), but they said "when I want Peter Jackson's LOTR/Hobbit, I watch the movies; when I want Tolkien's LOTR/Hobbit, I read the books". I just feel like PJ and co. all do a wonderful job with all the material they have, and I am eternally grateful that these movies were able to be brought to life. Sounds corny, but they're a huge part of my life. Smile


sauget.diblosio
Tol Eressea

Mar 30 2013, 3:14am

Post #9 of 42 (368 views)
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I'm just going to reprint this... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...

IMO, with all of those things taken into account, AUJ could have been on par with LOTR.

and add...

11. Keep the stone giants off in the distance.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Mar 30 2013, 4:47am

Post #10 of 42 (355 views)
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This! First and foremost! [In reply to] Can't Post

And the war would have been a war of Vengeance, as in the book, for the slaying of a Thror driven to madness by his Ring.

3)And, even if Thorin killed Azog, he would have beheld a shadowy glimpse of the Balrog, but been unwilling to speak afterward of what he saw. This works regarding Balin, for Thorin would be dead by the time Balin made his poor decision, and thus could not have broken his silence to save his kinsman from follly.

Other things?

4)Galadriel would not have been portrayed as Gandalf's superior or supervisor.

5) The pinecone fires would have started blue and been slightly more explosive upon impact.

6)The sickening of The Greenwood would have been growing too strong for Radagast to curtail, not JUST emerging, though this would have been the first time he was able to definitively link it back to Dol Guldur.

7) A fuller, if quiet White Council, with Glorfindel and Cirdan.

8) A little more dark fur on those wargs (still miles better than the ttt ones!!!).

9) No bird poop in Radagasts hair. Less snot


I don't think there is a WHOLE lot other than that which I would have changed. No fake out before the hug at the end. lol. The Stone giants would have been both less stone and less gigantic.

In Reply To
the first film would have worked better IMO if they had only used Azog for the prologue and had Bolg in the remainder of the film. Crazy


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

(This post was edited by Altaira on Jun 7 2013, 4:07am)


DanielLB
Immortal


Mar 30 2013, 10:54am

Post #11 of 42 (280 views)
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#8 [In reply to] Can't Post

I'd say they didn't try hard enough to flesh all the Dwarves out!

Wink


herzogian
Bree

Mar 30 2013, 11:24am

Post #12 of 42 (276 views)
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Breath [In reply to] Can't Post

I would have made more room for "small" magical moments. Conversations, nature, characterbuilding. Things that make the movie breath more. Instead of unnessecary rollercoaster actionscenes. That in my opinion would've made the film alot better.


Patty
Immortal


Mar 30 2013, 11:31am

Post #13 of 42 (259 views)
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Yes, a couple more folks at the White Council... [In reply to] Can't Post

Not many, of course, since secrecy was necessary. But I would also have included Celeborn. Just to make him seem more important, like he was in the EE of Fellowship.

More people would have made Galadriel's pacing seem less noticeable to me.Tongue

Permanent address: Into the West






Glorfindela
Valinor


Mar 30 2013, 12:33pm

Post #14 of 42 (254 views)
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I agree with you [In reply to] Can't Post

Because I hadn't read the book for a long time, the film was perfectly fine with me. For me the book is one thing, the film another.

The acting, visuals and music in AUJ are brilliant, as far as I'm concerned.

There were many more changes in LOTR that I objected to more strongly, such as the loss of Glorfindel to 'flesh out' a cheesy romance, the changes to Theoden's character, as well as that of Faramir and Denethor, and the very poor portrayal of Merry (in particular) and Pippin.


In Reply To
I wouldn't change a thing. I loved every bit of it and treat the movies and books as two separate, though obviously similar, entities. I love what a lot of people disliked; I thought the full CGI looked brilliant and realistic, I loved all the humor, I was even fine with Azog being in it. I can't remember where I read someone say this quote (could have been the forums), but they said "when I want Peter Jackson's LOTR/Hobbit, I watch the movies; when I want Tolkien's LOTR/Hobbit, I read the books". I just feel like PJ and co. all do a wonderful job with all the material they have, and I am eternally grateful that these movies were able to be brought to life. Sounds corny, but they're a huge part of my life. Smile



dormouse
Half-elven


Mar 30 2013, 1:49pm

Post #15 of 42 (264 views)
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Made an awful mess of it, I expect.... [In reply to] Can't Post

...since I'm not a film director. Wink

Like you, I think they did just fine.


imin
Valinor


Mar 30 2013, 2:38pm

Post #16 of 42 (232 views)
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Think i will just repeat this with number 11 as well! :) // [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

In Reply To
1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...

IMO, with all of those things taken into account, AUJ could have been on par with LOTR.

and add...

11. Keep the stone giants off in the distance.



Elenorflower
Gondor


Mar 30 2013, 2:39pm

Post #17 of 42 (249 views)
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I would have made the films [In reply to] Can't Post

like the books. or in other words nothing that isnt in the book, so no Azog, WC, Radagast, Necromancer, Tauriel, Legolas, OTT stone giants, belching, snot, green vegtable hating, Thorin as main protagonist, Thranduil as Mr Nastypants, and general video game roller coaster rides.


Elenorflower
Gondor


Mar 30 2013, 2:42pm

Post #18 of 42 (239 views)
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1. shoot on film [In reply to] Can't Post

yeah I forgot that one, which for me is probably one of the most important. I miss the cinematic look and subtlety of film.


Elenorflower
Gondor


Mar 30 2013, 2:45pm

Post #19 of 42 (223 views)
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we are on the same page exactly [In reply to] Can't Post

Wink

In Reply To
1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...

IMO, with all of those things taken into account, AUJ could have been on par with LOTR.



Eleniel
Grey Havens


Mar 30 2013, 2:54pm

Post #20 of 42 (234 views)
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Let me add to the chorus... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...

IMO, with all of those things taken into account, AUJ could have been on par with LOTR.






I also think the crux of the problem is that the film makers appear to have trusted Tolkien less this time round... it feels like Tolkien has been used as the magic ingredient in an average blockbuster-type movie, rather than writing a screenplay to serve Tolkien's vision.


"Choosing Trust over Doubt gets me burned once in a while, but I'd rather be singed than hardened."
Victoria Monfort






sauget.diblosio
Tol Eressea

Mar 30 2013, 3:27pm

Post #21 of 42 (204 views)
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Nicely put. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I also think the crux of the problem is that the film makers appear to have trusted Tolkien less this time round... it feels like Tolkien has been used as the magic ingredient in an average blockbuster-type movie, rather than writing a screenplay to serve Tolkien's vision.



MouthofSauron
Tol Eressea


Mar 30 2013, 5:13pm

Post #22 of 42 (196 views)
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only 2 things [In reply to] Can't Post

nothing that would have made or break the film. Gandalf being surrounded by green smoke rings in the dark while the dwarves sing the far over the misty mountains song, both Gandalf's and Thorin's swords glow blue.


take me down to the woodland realm where the trees are green and the elf women are pretty....Oh will you please take me home!!

(This post was edited by MouthofSauron on Mar 30 2013, 5:14pm)


Lusitano
Tol Eressea


Mar 30 2013, 6:21pm

Post #23 of 42 (176 views)
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Well said Eleniel [In reply to] Can't Post

I susbscribe what others have said, especially the importance of shooting on film, rather than using 3D Rigs, 48 fps and digital photography.

Ill add replace RA with an older, more experienced actor as befits the Thorin Tolkien wrote, not Aragorn Junior. He should be more pompous.

Reduce the over indulgence and use of CGI and green screen work. Use real locations, forests, hillsides, as much as possible, including for Rivendell , the hillsides for the fifteenbirds scene and try to find some real caves for the goblin tunnels, if possible.

Replace the unnatural, synthethized, lighting used by the DP with a carefull use of natural lights : sunlight, moonlight, fireplace and candle light, taking advantage of the dark and drop the big studio lights. Case studies for a brilliant usage of lighting: the new world, barry lyndon, game of thrones. the girl with the pearl earings.


No stick insects and keep the stone giants in the distance , portraying them in a subtle way, like Tolkien did.

Vous commencez m'ennuyer avec le port!!!


BoromirOfWinterfell
Rohan


Mar 30 2013, 6:49pm

Post #24 of 42 (170 views)
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A valid point. [In reply to] Can't Post

I wanted more scenes like the one in Bag End where Thorin says to Balin "I would take each and every one of these dwarves over the mightiest army...". To me it showed that Balin was Thorin's confidant; a beautiful moment. Even book-wise, LotR had many more "breathing" moments, as you say.

"Eala Earendel engla beorhtast
ofer middangeard monnum sended."

"You think you world is safe? It is an illusion. A comforting lie told to protect you. Enjoy these final moments of peace. For I have returned to have my vengeance. So, shall we begin? " - John Harrison/Khan/Sherlock/Smaug (Star Trek: Into Darkness)


triptrap
Lorien

Mar 30 2013, 6:53pm

Post #25 of 42 (164 views)
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Agreement! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
2. Make the Goblin King menacing instead of being a comic relief and in general let the whole Goblin Town situation be much more dangerous but realistic. Goblin = Orc.

Signed!

1. Shoot on Film
2. Use more on location sets
3. No Bunny sled
4. No Azog
5. No slapstick comedy, witty dialogue instead.
6. Extend Rivendell into a beautiful sequence, instead of a boring exposition, slapt-stick dwarf, CGI fest.
7. Don't forget about Bilbo
8. Stop trying so hard to make the audience care about 15 main characters. Flesh out Bilbo, Gandalf, Thorin, and Balin first and foremost.
9. Go back to realistic, gritty action. Stop the video game, suspense destroying action sequences
10. Please fix Ian Holms wig. I don't care if he just got up, took a shower...etc...


---> Signed!


In general i'd trust a lot more in the things we all know made LOTR so special and awesome: Outdoor sets and more natural landscapes, more realistic combat, more character moments( i think the Hobbit had a bit too much of a division in 2 halfs, the first being very talk-heavy, the second being merely anything but action sequences), use miniatures etc.


(This post was edited by triptrap on Mar 30 2013, 6:57pm)

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