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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Scenes with Rob Kazinsky as Fili in AUJ?
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TheHutt
Gondor


Mar 26 2013, 4:34pm

Post #1 of 61 (2053 views)
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Scenes with Rob Kazinsky as Fili in AUJ? Can't Post

Despite from Fili being recast with Dean O'Gorman (and quite nicely played, by the way), in the movie, there seems to be at least two scenes still using Rob Kazinsky as Fili.

1) When the Elves are about to surround the dwarves in Rivendell:

http://s51.radikal.ru/.../3e/ca23adf851a7.jpg

2) Shot of Thorin at the Warg attack (which even made it to the NZ postcard):

http://www.henneth-annun.ru/...9/thcc_thorin_03.jpg

Also, Fili seems to be missing from most of the Great Goblin shots for exactly the same reason.

Now did anyone notice any other notable instances with Kazinsky as Fili?


Arandir
Gondor


Mar 26 2013, 4:50pm

Post #2 of 61 (1011 views)
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Both look like O'Gorman to me ... however, [In reply to] Can't Post

this shot seems to be of Kazinsky:
http://screencapped.net/...16#top_display_media

'The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey' Review


Carne
Tol Eressea

Mar 26 2013, 5:05pm

Post #3 of 61 (951 views)
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The top one looks like Kazinsky, the bottom is O'Gorman [In reply to] Can't Post

Funnily enough someone tweeted a screenshot (Fili behind Balin during the cleanup song) to Kazinsky asking if it was him, to which he replied with something like "I have no idea who that is". Graham McTavis didn't know either.

I'm guessing they have used a body double or stunt double in some quick shots.


(This post was edited by Carne on Mar 26 2013, 5:05pm)


Lindele
Gondor


Mar 26 2013, 5:18pm

Post #4 of 61 (926 views)
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Considering [In reply to] Can't Post

that they didn't even do any loaction shoots until late 2011, months after Kazinsky was replaced...I'm pretty postive that at least the second one isn't him.
Honestly I don't think they done much shooting of the dwarves if any at all when he was replaced


DanielLB
Immortal


Mar 26 2013, 5:21pm

Post #5 of 61 (936 views)
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It was a months worth of filming [In reply to] Can't Post

So yes, he didn't film much.

Filming started 21st March, and Kazinksky announced on 24th April he was to leave.


Angharad73
Rohan


Mar 26 2013, 5:27pm

Post #6 of 61 (973 views)
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Some of the Bag End scenes... [In reply to] Can't Post

... do seem to have Kazinsky in them, if I remember correctly. I'll have to watch more closely (again) when I get my DVD.


Spaldron
Rivendell


Mar 26 2013, 5:34pm

Post #7 of 61 (997 views)
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There's a single close up shot of Fili... [In reply to] Can't Post

... sitting by the campfire in the scene on the cliff (when Balin tells the tale of the battle outside Moria) and it looks nothing like O'Gorman. Not sure if it's Kazinsky though. I don't have any pics.

"A single dream is more powerful than a thousand realities."


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Mar 26 2013, 5:49pm

Post #8 of 61 (871 views)
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Cool question [In reply to] Can't Post

I was wondering about this... keep in mind too that some of the shots featuring Fili (or any of the other dwarves for that matter) might involve the use of scale doubles and digital masks. So it wouldn't be completely out of line to use Kazinsky footage.

However it would be cool to get a positive ID before they erase him entirely in future pressings (or what ever it's called when you make a DVD/BR).


(This post was edited by SirDennisC on Mar 26 2013, 5:50pm)


jtarkey
Rohan


Mar 26 2013, 6:07pm

Post #9 of 61 (882 views)
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I noticed that too... [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm pretty sure it's just the lighting though. It puts a lot of strange shadows on his face. I highly doubt they would have put a closeup of Kazinsky in the film.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Riven Delve
Grey Havens


Mar 26 2013, 6:15pm

Post #10 of 61 (914 views)
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Bag End scenes [In reply to] Can't Post

You can see Kazinsky clearly in this "glory box" scene, and also during the Blunt the Knives scene. Also, as Arandir noted, he's in the Misty Mountains Cold song scene. You can't see Fili's face at all during the Trollshaws scene where the dwarves are bagged up--I have to wonder if they shot that part with a "wig double" before they had O'Gorman on site! Smile I couldn't find Fili in half the Goblintown scenes, but I don't know if that's because Kazinsky was shot in some of them, or the action was just going too fast for me!

I think your second picture at the warg attack is O'Gorman, but he does look a little odd.


"I left the night, with its remote and singing stars, and came in, to the glow of the fire, and the chair where he had been sitting, and the unstrung harp." --The Last Enchantment


Oscarilbo
Lorien


Mar 26 2013, 7:30pm

Post #11 of 61 (798 views)
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Clearly ??? [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry but, I don't think that's Kazinsky at all. That's pretty clearly O'Gorman in both images.

"The World is Changed, I feel it in the water. I feel it in the earth. I smell it in the air"


Angharad73
Rohan


Mar 26 2013, 7:35pm

Post #12 of 61 (783 views)
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Is there actually... [In reply to] Can't Post

... a picture of Rob Kazinsky in Fili costume and makeup somewhere that's not a screencap? Like the promo shots (or whatever you call those) of all the others? I'm just curious...


Riven Delve
Grey Havens


Mar 26 2013, 8:25pm

Post #13 of 61 (750 views)
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One way to tell, [In reply to] Can't Post

although I will admit it's hard to discern in static screencaps, is that O'Gorman is shorter than Kazinsky, who is about Kili's height. Kazinsky's face is longer also. I am almost positive that the first one is Kazinsky, because immediately after that screencap, Fili and Kili go into the Bag End dining room together and are of a similar height.

And then there's O'Gorman's dimples, which are hard to fake!

But I've been wrong before! Smile


"I left the night, with its remote and singing stars, and came in, to the glow of the fire, and the chair where he had been sitting, and the unstrung harp." --The Last Enchantment


Brethil
Half-elven


Mar 26 2013, 8:46pm

Post #14 of 61 (767 views)
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There's Fili and then theres FILI [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
although I will admit it's hard to discern in static screencaps, is that O'Gorman is shorter than Kazinsky, who is about Kili's height. Kazinsky's face is longer also. I am almost positive that the first one is Kazinsky, because immediately after that screencap, Fili and Kili go into the Bag End dining room together and are of a similar height.

And then there's O'Gorman's dimples, which are hard to fake!

But I've been wrong before! Smile......




......Surely not about DIMPLES, Riven Delve?Smile

I do think the Glory Box is O'Gorman, but as others have shown with the shadowed cap (very dark) of Misty Mountains as the camera pans past the "Fili" figure to Thorin that is clearly NOT O'Gorman - but is it Kazinsky or just a double? From what I can see doesn't look like either of them.

And the Fili in the sack at the Trollshaw, face down (and no shot with the Company when the Trolls get their surrender) is that Kazinsky? It looks like it to me. Would they have filmed that in the first few weeks? (As DanielB points out it's a short interval before the swap.)

Hell hath no fury like a Dragon who is missing a cup.


Angharad73
Rohan


Mar 26 2013, 8:47pm

Post #15 of 61 (681 views)
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I thought so too. [In reply to] Can't Post

In both of the screencaps you posted before (the 'Glory Box' one and the one from 'Blunt the Knives'), Fili doesn't really look like O'Gorman to me. Not that I can be sure, though...


Na Vedui
Rohan

Mar 26 2013, 9:11pm

Post #16 of 61 (733 views)
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A possible Kazinsky [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi everyone! After lurking for ages, I've finally got round to joining (hence the name Smile).
There's another possible Rob Kazinsky Fili - unfortunately I don't have a link, but if you have access to screencaps, it's at Rivendell, a few shots after Gloin does his "offer us insult" stuff; there's a shot with Gloin at left, looking sideways, Balin in the middle, and Fili on the right. He's a bit out of focus but definitely not Dean - his nose is much straighter for one thing, and his hair seems a bit darker, though that may just be the lighting.


cats16
Valinor

Mar 26 2013, 9:13pm

Post #17 of 61 (649 views)
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Same with me [In reply to] Can't Post

There were parts of the Blunt the Knives sequence when I was pretty sure it was not O'Gorman. I think they were the long shots that showed several dwarves in one shot. Makes it easier to hide him in those.

But there is one shot in Bag End that is clearly Kazinsky. It's when Gandalf is counting the dwarves on his fingers as they are preparing dinner. Fili and Kili walk by carrying a barrel of ale, and Fili looks up and smiles at Gandalf. It's a pretty long look, so maybe someone could post it if they see it.


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Mar 26 2013, 9:18pm

Post #18 of 61 (664 views)
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And it looks like Kazinsky from behind [In reply to] Can't Post

Seriously, posture, gate -- in short, body physics -- can be used to identify a person. (Remember this the next time you recognize a friend from behind or too far away to discern facial features.)


Riven Delve
Grey Havens


Mar 26 2013, 10:25pm

Post #19 of 61 (623 views)
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Do you mean this scene? [In reply to] Can't Post

Brothers carrying keg.

It looks like Kazinsky to me too. And he is really tall, unlike O'Gorman. See this link, compared to Kili.


"I left the night, with its remote and singing stars, and came in, to the glow of the fire, and the chair where he had been sitting, and the unstrung harp." --The Last Enchantment


cats16
Valinor

Mar 26 2013, 10:36pm

Post #20 of 61 (582 views)
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Yep that's it. [In reply to] Can't Post

As someone else already said, it's a lot harder to see the difference in screen caps as opposed to running video. But still, good find. Smile


Riven Delve
Grey Havens


Mar 26 2013, 10:39pm

Post #21 of 61 (610 views)
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Welcome, Na Vedui! [In reply to] Can't Post

At last! (Do I have that translation correct?) Smile

You must have elf-eyes as well as an elf-name. I never would have seen this one. Is that the scene you were thinking of? Definitely not O'Gorman!


"I left the night, with its remote and singing stars, and came in, to the glow of the fire, and the chair where he had been sitting, and the unstrung harp." --The Last Enchantment


marillaraina
Rohan

Mar 26 2013, 10:53pm

Post #22 of 61 (627 views)
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There are a lot of scenes with Kazinsky. [In reply to] Can't Post

He's at Bag End, probably at least as much as O'Gorman. Almost every scene that doesn't involve dialogue or isn't relatively clear seems to be Kazinsky. He's even in the Blunt the Knives scenes, a lot of that wild stuff in the background is Kazinsky. In fact once I got to watch the blu-ray I realized he was in more scenes than I had thought, there were at least two scenes I had thought were O'Gorman and it turned out to be Kazinsky.

This'll all make it look like I've spent a lot of time looking for this, but I honestly haven't.. :D LOL It's probably because I've watched the Kili scenes so closely that I also ended up noticing Fili a lot too. Sly

In the Glory Box scene they do some trick editing, it starts out with O'Gorman giving Bilbo his weapons and they use O'Gorman's dialogue about his weapons but when the scene goes to a longer shot it's Kazinsky. That was one of the scenes that I originally thought was all O'Gorman but then realized on the Blu Ray it was Kazinsky. As well given Kili is in "old make up", it's also when Kazinsky was still in the film. You then see Fili walk into the dining room and he and Kili are about the same height, like Turner and Kazinsky were whereas O'Gorman is shorter esp. whenever he has to walk(they can have him on lifts when they are mostly standing still, like the picute of them at Bilbo's door, but otherwise he's about 4 inches shorter).

There is a scene at the table where you see Kazinsky sitting next to Turner, then the scene cuts away and cuts back and Ori is sitting there! It's one of the scenes with Kili's old make up where he's sitting on the opposite side of the table from where he's sitting after Thorin arrives. There's another shot at the table where there is no one sitting next to Kili but there is a sort of shadow there, which I assume was a way of cutting Kazinsky out of the scene.

He's definitely at Rivendell, IMO that picture in the first post is clearly him and in the other scenes where you see Fili(usually from the side and distant) also were not O'Gorman. When they are mulling around that circular area when they first arrived, he's off to the right of the screen at the edge of the group. He just moves differently than O'Gorman seems to as Fili.

Honestly from what I can tell, he was doing a fine job as the character, given most of the shots are not close up obviously, I tried to just watch body movement and stuff and he seemed to be just what you'd expect.

Spaldron, I know what close up shot of Fili you are talking about and that IS O'Gorman, he just looks unfortunately like Chad Kroeger(lead singer of Nickelback) in it. It's been kind of joked about how an unfortunate trick of the lighting made him look like a guy widely considered one of the most unnattractive men in rock. LOL


(This post was edited by marillaraina on Mar 26 2013, 11:02pm)


Riven Delve
Grey Havens


Mar 26 2013, 10:59pm

Post #23 of 61 (594 views)
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I'm NEVER wrong about dimples [In reply to] Can't Post

(such as these), but I could be wrong about whether the actor in question is the one the dimples belong to. Wink

I'm not sure if sack-Fili is O'Gorman, but I think O'Gorman did the actual fight scene. Check this one.


"I left the night, with its remote and singing stars, and came in, to the glow of the fire, and the chair where he had been sitting, and the unstrung harp." --The Last Enchantment


Na Vedui
Rohan

Mar 26 2013, 11:10pm

Post #24 of 61 (588 views)
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Rob Kazinsky in Rivendell [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi Rivendelve,

Yes, that's the shot I was thinking of; thanks for finding the screencap. (And you're right about the translation.)


marillaraina
Rohan

Mar 26 2013, 11:18pm

Post #25 of 61 (547 views)
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Yeah [In reply to] Can't Post

Yeah O'Gorman is doing the fighting in the Trollshaws scene. I have to admit I'm not sure who the back of the head in the Goblintown scene belongs to(the one right after they "land" and the Goblins come in to pull the dwarves out, Kili and Fili are backed up against the wall and they reach for Thorin and Thorin reaches for them just before being pulled away) http://oi47.tinypic.com/nm136a.jpg

To me it looks like Dean's Fili from behind, but otherwise Fili isn't very visible during this scene, even the shots where all the dwarves seem to be visible in front of the Goblin King, I've counted 12 of them, Kili and Thorin pretty much front and center, shooting matching Durin glares of death :D , but Fili isn't around. So I assume they filmed most of the Goblintown scenes before Dean was ready to step in.

(How do you make a labelled URL? Some of the posts above have labelled URL and I can't seem to do it in the way it's usually done [url=url address]Label</url>(where < >is replaced with [ ] )


(This post was edited by marillaraina on Mar 26 2013, 11:27pm)

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