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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Why Radagast was done wrong
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Erally
Bree

Feb 10 2013, 6:43pm

Post #1 of 54 (1891 views)
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Why Radagast was done wrong Can't Post

I myself like the company of animals more then the company of (some) humans. It is because they taught me some very important things in life; spirituality, honesty, patience, responsibility, forgiveness, love. From time to time I read in the news that another dog is killed by its owner cause of his/her breed or die for the benefit of the human. That is when I get sad and stop having faith in humanity. It dissapoints me and I am getting the feeling to make a change. I don't know the reason why Radagast enjoys the company from animals more but there has to be a serious reason for it. If someone said something about ''his'' animals hey should have got really assertive and almost ''angry'', in my opinion. That should have made him a more likeable character, with an idea and a goal. This is my honest opinion about Radagast the Brown.


peace1993
Bree


Feb 10 2013, 7:06pm

Post #2 of 54 (959 views)
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Hello [In reply to] Can't Post

Smile
But isn't that a "normal," humane reaction? Radagast isn't a human, nor is he anything close to "normal." He is a queer wizard hooked on mushrooms. I do admit that he does seem to be a little over the top at times. But, he is portrayed like that in order to get a few extra laughs from the kids in the audience.

Sam: Trust a Brandybuck and a Took.
Merry: What? That was just a detour, a shortcut.
Sam: Shortcut to what?
Pippin: Mushrooms!


Fishbug
The Shire


Feb 10 2013, 7:49pm

Post #3 of 54 (823 views)
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Um... [In reply to] Can't Post

So are you going to say why you think he was done wrong?


Bombadil
Half-elven


Feb 10 2013, 8:49pm

Post #4 of 54 (802 views)
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Bomby.. has always felt Radagast is MiddleEarth's finest veterinarian/Wizard... [In reply to] Can't Post

You may want to search
through past forums
prior to the movie
coming out?

There
the speculation is
often..hilarious and wonderful.....Heart


Hamfast of Gamwich
Rivendell


Feb 10 2013, 8:54pm

Post #5 of 54 (759 views)
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Who described the animals as 'his' animals? [In reply to] Can't Post

I can't remember any character doing so in the film.


Roheryn
Grey Havens

Feb 10 2013, 9:00pm

Post #6 of 54 (804 views)
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He's a wizard; he does as he chooses. [In reply to] Can't Post

Not sure exactly what you think was done wrong, unless you're suggesting that someone did something to Radagast that caused him to prefer the company of animals, in which case I'd disagree.

Or were you suggesting that he's not much likable because he lacks an idea and goal? I'd suggest an admirable goal for him ought to be a bit of hair-washing, but I don't think that's what you're getting at.

Regardless, welcome to TORn!


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Feb 10 2013, 9:08pm

Post #7 of 54 (833 views)
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Is [In reply to] Can't Post

You use the verb 'is' as if it were fact. It is not. He was grossly mischaracterized in the adaptation by Jackson & Company, without the dignity deserved by the Maiar/Istari. It's like putting Woody Allen (when he was funny) in the role of Maximus in Gladiator instead of Russell Crowe.


arithmancer
Grey Havens

Feb 10 2013, 9:22pm

Post #8 of 54 (746 views)
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I thought the character was as you describe... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
If someone said something about ''his'' animals hey should have got really assertive and almost ''angry'', in my opinion.


But he did. Smile

Radagast: “I’ll draw them off.”

Gandalf:“These are Gundabad Wargs; they will outrun you.”

Radagast: “These are Rhosgobel Rabbits; I’d like to see them try."


macfalk
Valinor


Feb 10 2013, 9:23pm

Post #9 of 54 (780 views)
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...and that is just your opinion [In reply to] Can't Post

"You use the verb 'is' as if it were fact. It is not. He was grossly mischaracterized in the adaptation by Jackson & Company, without the dignity deserved by the Maiar/Istari. It's like putting Woody Allen (when he was funny) in the role of Maximus in Gladiator instead of Russell Crowe. "

I don't agree with this at all.




The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Feb 10 2013, 9:34pm

Post #10 of 54 (748 views)
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Why Versus How [In reply to] Can't Post

The phrasing of this thread's question is interesting. There's a difference between "why" and "how" that is commonly confused.

"Why" essentially asks why the producers, writers and director did Radagast "wrong" (a fairly subjective term). It could delve into topics such as trying to reach a much younger market, or trying to keep it lighter and more fantastical fare than Lord of the Rings. "Why" is more about the making of the movie.

"How" they did Radagast wrongly might explore his addled mind, drug addiction, or the Rabbit Run. "How" is more about what happened in the movie without asking why.

I already know for myself, subjectively, how Radagast was done wrongly. I think it's more interesting to ask why, as the OP did. I'm just pointing out the difference to maybe elicit that kind of analysis.


Old Toby
Gondor


Feb 10 2013, 10:24pm

Post #11 of 54 (747 views)
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thanks for the distinction [In reply to] Can't Post

between the why and the how. It's a good one, and one worth noting.

Not knowing, but only speculating, that he was probably done this way in order to reach the younger market and keep the tone lighter, as you say. Makes sense. I know children here loved him as PJ & crew portrayed him, so he does appeal to that young demographic.

From my own adult (and probably way too serious) perspective, I would have liked to have seen Radagast painted with a little more serious overtone, yet still keeping him more childlike (as opposed to childish). I think a lot of the moments that elicited laughter from the children in the audience, elicited either moans or eye-rolls from some of the adults. I don't think that makes what PJ did with the character 'wrong', just different from my perspective. And I've learned to live with that (in fact, I'm quite happy with his Roscobel rabbits. I'm getting one! LOL!)

"Age is always advancing and I'm fairly sure it's up to no good." Harry Dresden (Jim Butcher)


Roheryn
Grey Havens

Feb 10 2013, 11:45pm

Post #12 of 54 (705 views)
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And your antecedents are unclear. [In reply to] Can't Post

If you really want to quibble, anyways. You use the pronoun "it" as if the antecedent were "the verb 'is'", which is fine except it doesn't make sense to suggest that "the verb 'is'" has an inherent capacity for being fact or false.

You know, Bill Clinton, if I remember right, once argued about the use of "is". Pretty sure he was trying to compensate for something.

And with that I've got completely off topic...


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Feb 11 2013, 12:11am

Post #13 of 54 (743 views)
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Word Choice [In reply to] Can't Post

I was trying to avoid repeating the words "queer wizard hooked on mushrooms," which are what "it" refers to, because writing that sequence of words is somehow awkward to me, but okay.

Tongue


(This post was edited by JWPlatt on Feb 11 2013, 12:16am)


imin
Valinor


Feb 11 2013, 12:42am

Post #14 of 54 (649 views)
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So true [In reply to] Can't Post

Sadly an opportunity missed unless you are a kid and find him hilarious! Tongue


Estel78
Tol Eressea

Feb 11 2013, 12:56am

Post #15 of 54 (648 views)
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Same is true for the trolls [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
From my own adult (and probably way too serious) perspective, I would have liked to have seen Radagast painted with a little more serious overtone, yet still keeping him more childlike (as opposed to childish).


They could have made them still child like and kinda dumb but they went way overboard, especially with that one high pitched fellow. And they were too human like, they just didn't fit into the LOTR movie universe.


jtarkey
Rohan


Feb 11 2013, 1:12am

Post #16 of 54 (647 views)
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This is so true [In reply to] Can't Post

I can't stress enough how possible it is to make a light hearted film while maintaining a high degree of respect for your audience.

I'm not calling anyone here "stupid" for liking this film, but there were a lot of things that didn't fit well into the LOTR movie-verse. And it wasn't due to the story being lighter. It was due to the way it was executed.

I would argue that even Riddles in the Dark is pretty "light" if that makes sense. But it was executed well. It had a great blend of comedy and anxiety. It was a scene that respected the audience instead of talking down to them.

A lot of things in the AUJ, including Radagast, felt like they were saying "hey this is supposed to funny, hey this is supposed to be ridiculous".

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Aragalen the Green
Gondor


Feb 11 2013, 1:26am

Post #17 of 54 (645 views)
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The Trolls, Gollum, the Great Goblin [In reply to] Can't Post

The way they all these characters were "voiced" makes me think of Tolkien reading the story to his children and supplying the voices himself. After all, you don't want the Trolls to sound all alike, and not be able to tell them apart? Smile


In Reply To
They could have made them still child like and kinda dumb but they went way overboard, especially with that one high pitched fellow. And they were too human like, they just didn't fit into the LOTR movie universe.


'"Never laugh at live dragons, Bilbo you fool!" he said to himself, and it became a favourite saying of his later, and passed into a proverb.'


Elessar
Valinor


Feb 11 2013, 1:55am

Post #18 of 54 (675 views)
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Sometimes the best things said are the things not said [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I'm not calling anyone here "stupid" for liking this film, but there were a lot of things that didn't fit well into the LOTR movie-verse. And it wasn't due to the story being lighter. It was due to the way it was executed.


Thing is saying it still comes across as if you're saying while trying to not say it. So if not talking down to people was your goal IMO you kind of failed. Best to just make your point (which was fairly well explained but with that comment) I liked the film and I would disagree 100% that it didn't fit into the movieverse. This movie felt every bit a part of the same world just with the lighter tones I would have expected. This movie IMO was every bit as good at being The Hobbit as The Lord of the Rings films were at being The Lord of the Rings.
None of the four films are perfect mind you but for me they're all fantastic. Now, ones mileage may vary of course

---------------

Different rambling

As far as Radagast he seemed fine to me I ended up really liking him. I didn't care for the bird crap but I did like the design and as I said the final result of the characters portrayal. I very much look forward to getting the statue from Weta at somepoint. During the hedgehog bit I really felt sad because I love animals but also because it made me think of my puppies (how much I love them and scared something could happen to them). The Trolls seemed dead on to me as to how I had imagined them. I didn't like the snot bit but the rest was pretty darn fun. Also, The Great Goblin was dang good fun! Didn't care for his chin but man what a great character.

Like I said ones mileage may vary with all of this. If people didn't like it that's fine but for me I will keep on loving this film.



(This post was edited by Elessar on Feb 11 2013, 1:56am)


Angharad73
Rohan

Feb 11 2013, 6:52am

Post #19 of 54 (577 views)
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I liked Radagast in the movie [In reply to] Can't Post

I did, yes, but even that being said, maybe a little less would have been more, if you know what I mean. And I'm not just talking about the bird poop. He was very funny in the movie, but I would like to see him show some more of his wizardry. He is perhaps more aware of what is going on than Saruman, for example, would give him credit for. So he may not be quite the mushroom-addled fool he appears to be - or at least I hope so.

He des take care of animals, but I don't see them as 'his'. They may be helping him in turn, but they don't belong to him. He shares space with them in the woods and he has cultivated their friendship (and he provided free, magical vet care...), so they supply him with information and services. I don't know why he should be angry if someone says anything about them. He says his "They are Rhosgobel rabbits" more with pride, which I think quite fitting.


macfalk
Valinor


Feb 11 2013, 9:00am

Post #20 of 54 (524 views)
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I agree with Elessar. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 



The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


jtarkey
Rohan


Feb 11 2013, 9:49am

Post #21 of 54 (525 views)
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The problem is... [In reply to] Can't Post

I said nearly the exact same thing in a previous thread, but without the disclaimer, and was immediately told I was calling people stupid for liking the film. This is not my opinion at all. I criticize it for the amount of problems I have with it but I like it a lot, so I would be calling myself stupid.

I mean no offense at all, I just wince at this point before I post anything negative about the movie. Backlash is expected.

"You're love of the halflings leaf has clearly slowed your mind"


Vangalad
Lorien


Feb 11 2013, 10:47am

Post #22 of 54 (555 views)
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Radagast the bird-tamer, Radagast the fool... [In reply to] Can't Post

For me (and I'm not a 5-10 year old :-) ), McCoy's Radagast is special, standing out as a character and giving a third angle on the 'wizard profile' of Middle earth...whimsy as it gets? yes, but not a mocker of our intelligence.

He is one of the aspects that differentiate the Hobbit from LOTR, giving the Hobbit its own traits on par with the tone of the book.


All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost,
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.


(This post was edited by Vangalad on Feb 11 2013, 10:48am)


imin
Valinor


Feb 11 2013, 10:58am

Post #23 of 54 (527 views)
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I wondered how long it would take for someone to take to that comment :P [In reply to] Can't Post

Third angle on wizard, sure. But done in a way which was just not very good basically. Whimsy - no, childish - yes. And there is a difference which people don't seem to get. Mocker of our intelligence i believe PJ wasn't trying to as i think this character for the most part was added for comic relief for the little ones but comparing what we know about wizards and the little we know about Radagast i think he comes up short.

It does bring the movie more in line with the more childlike tone of the book, but again when reading the book its not the same as the book.

Like i said missed opportunity but hopefully the EE's will flesh out the character a bit more and be something more than scenes that could be cut.

Each to their own though and if you liked the way Radagast was in the film then great, i wish i did.


Vangalad
Lorien


Feb 11 2013, 11:27am

Post #24 of 54 (486 views)
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I get your point [In reply to] Can't Post

and respect it, though in my view I interpret him differently, more like he possesses the innocence of a child (which is good) and acts without bearing the troubles of the greater world as Gandalf.
Some context from Tolkien's description of Radagast is in there I think, just expanded...
Nonetheless I expect to see more of him too, in the EE and DOS, as the story evolves and gets more and more serious the characters should be given their chances to show quality moments.


All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost,
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.


Steerpike
Bree


Feb 11 2013, 11:29am

Post #25 of 54 (502 views)
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You use the verb 'was' as if it were fact. It is not. [In reply to] Can't Post

There's nothing wrong stating opinion as fact (as I am doing in this very sentence), as long as the context shows it is clearly an opinion. But to do so immediately after chastising someone else for doing exactly the same thing is somewhat hypocritical, don't you think?

For the record, I love Radagast and I'm 42.

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