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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Thoughts on probable last theater viewing (until inevitable Trilogy showing)
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Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 5:05am

Post #1 of 31 (849 views)
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Thoughts on probable last theater viewing (until inevitable Trilogy showing) Can't Post

Tonight I realized that this was likely the last night that AUJ was playing at the theater near me, and I figured I'd better get there one last time. Unfortunately, the HFR showing was at 10:30 at night, and I have to work tomorrow, so that left me with the earlier 2D show. The first time I saw it was in 2D, but I had avoided it after being pulled into the wonder vortex that is 3D HFR. A girl's gotta do what a girl's gotta do, however, so I sucked it up and went. I was one of 8 people in the theater, and we were all clearly repeat viewers. Here is my takeaway:

--2D really, really bites, at least for TH. I was almost at the point of screaming "My eyes, they burn, they burn!" Erebor was way too detail-deprived, and the entire Rivendell scene was very blurry. I could have been watching an antique nickelodeon (no, children, it's not a cable network--look it up).

--However, notwithstanding the lack of detail, I was for some reason really able to see the dwarf faces that Azog has on his skirt better than before.

--And despite the general blur, I suddenly developed "Kazinsky-vision" and began seeing him playing Fili everywhere. And other times, if it wasn't him, I thought it must be a filler-Fili standing in until they got Dean to the set. It got to the point that any time the dwarves were in a group, I was actively seeking out Fili. I probably missed a good third of the film because of this.

--I also kept an eye out for the evolution of Thorin's beard. He started out at Erebor with a longish beard with a clip, but then I saw that by the time he got to the "never forgave/forgot" scene it was short (I think I missed this previously because I kept thinking that he might take off his shirt). So it was short before Thror/Thrain go to the dwarf kingdom in the sky (or dungeon, as the case may be). I had gotten the impression he tore it out/hacked it off because of their loss, but was there some other precipitating event before that? I thought maybe it was because Thror and Thrain had theirs singed or burned off in Erebor, but at Azanulbizar Thror seemed fully bearded. Since this kept me thinking up until I became preoccupied with Fili, I probably missed 10% of the film due to this silliness.

Anyway, I will miss seeing it in the theater, but I will be very happy to get my 3D Blu-ray so I can see all the detail I missed this time (and maybe there is some magic in clearer filming that blocks old Fili, since I swear I never really noticed him before--or if I did, I didn't care because my senses were overwhelmed with other detail).


GloryBox
Bree


Feb 8 2013, 6:01am

Post #2 of 31 (536 views)
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"the wonder vortex that is 3D HFR" - so true! [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm also addicted to the new format (yay Peter!), and I've been lucky enough to have a theater not toooo far away where I can indulge. But I've only seen it once in IMAX 3D HFR, and that was the absolute best.

My last viewing will probably be this weekend, so I'll try to switch on my own Kazinsky-vision. Thanks for mentioning that. I also want to focus on the rare scenes where Bilbo and Thorin speak directly to each other. I could be wrong, but I think there are only 3 -- "some skill at Conkers" scene, "I know you doubt me" scene, and finally the fantastic face off at the end. (I don't count the "suggest you keep up" moment). MF and RA are such fine actors that I'm really hoping they have more direct interaction in DOS and TABA. I really want to watch how these two characters use voice/expression/body language to play off each other.

So glad you got to the theater one more time -- thanks for the 2D insights!

...one morning long ago in the quiet of the world, when there was less noise and more green... The Hobbit


Roheryn
Grey Havens

Feb 8 2013, 9:15am

Post #3 of 31 (794 views)
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Azog's skirt! [In reply to] Can't Post

Drat, I knew there was something else I was supposed to look for. Forgot. Where do you see it best? If it's at Azanulbizar, forget it. I can't take my eyes off Thorin.

I managed to get to #14 today, which alas, really is likely to be my last. It's down to one showing a day at just a single theater here -- but this showing was reasonably well-attended today, for a mid-day showing, and it's on what is probably the best screen in our whole city, which is the first time I've seen it there: the XTreme Screen! 3D HFR, huge screen, amazing sound: I *felt* the stone giants battling, I *felt* the Ring fall to the rocks, I *felt* Gandalf lay the goblins (and dwarves) flat with his wizardly blast...you get the idea. That was probably the best I've seen (and heard) the movie so far, so I guess it's a good viewing to end on.


In Reply To
--And despite the general blur, I suddenly developed "Kazinsky-vision" and began seeing him playing Fili everywhere. And other times, if it wasn't him, I thought it must be a filler-Fili standing in until they got Dean to the set. It got to the point that any time the dwarves were in a group, I was actively seeking out Fili. I probably missed a good third of the film because of this. I started noticing this a lot at my last viewing, and looked into it a bit more today. With just maybe two exceptions, if there's a scene where Fili doesn't have lines, you either don't see him at all, or you don't see his face: there are strategically placed weapons, other actors' heads, he has his back to us, or his head is turned just enough away. Like the troll scene where they're all in sacks: Fili's the only one laying face down; we see a bit of the back of his head as he's basically eating dirt, and then we mostly just see the tail-end of his sack. We do see his face, without him having lines, outside the troll cave, and on the Carrock. I think that's it! I sure hope we see more of him -- face included, even when in the background -- in the next two movies.
--I also kept an eye out for the evolution of Thorin's beard. He started out at Erebor with a longish beard with a clip, but then I saw that by the time he got to the "never forgave/forgot" scene it was short (I think I missed this previously because I kept thinking that he might take off his shirt). So it was short before Thror/Thrain go to the dwarf kingdom in the sky (or dungeon, as the case may be). I had gotten the impression he tore it out/hacked it off because of their loss, but was there some other precipitating event before that? I thought maybe it was because Thror and Thrain had theirs singed or burned off in Erebor, but at Azanulbizar Thror seemed fully bearded. Since this kept me thinking up until I became preoccupied with Fili, I probably missed 10% of the film due to this silliness.
LOL! Isn't it going to be nice to have the pause and rewind buttons? I meant to pay attention to beard length too, but after Smaug's done toasting dwarves, I've completely forgotten that there's any particular thing I'm supposed to be looking for in Thorin and am just holding my breath for the shake-fist-at-the-mountain pose and the not-quite-shirtless smiting-the-anvil scene.

Okay, I noticed a few other things today too! You'd think there wouldn't be anything left to notice at this point. Either that or I'm woefully unobservant. Or maybe my observing skills are tuned in to other things...*ahem* Anyways, at Azanulbizar, after the battle we see Balin kneeling or crouching, and weeping. I finally realized it looks like he's holding the hand of a barely-moving, and then not-moving, dwarf. So it appears he's comforting someone he knows, as that dwarf dies. Dwalin comes up right then and I imagine he's crying over the same dwarf too. Very touching. Their father dies in this battle, as does Thorin's brother. I suspect the anguish we see in those two here is nothing compared to the heartbreak we'll see at the end of BO5A. By the time Dwalin's done devouring Bilbo's supper, he has spilled all over the table what looks like a bowl of rice krispies. Or little maggots. Can't tell, but it's a mess. Myrtle, Minty, Bungo, and Daisy (did I get their names right?) must be the cleverest ponies ever. Not only can they untie themselves and remove their own halters, but they can put the halters back on again and tie themselves back up too! Myrtle and Minty are deposited by one of the trolls (which one is that? I still can't keep them straight) into the little corral -- there is nothing on their heads, no halter, no nothing. Shortly thereafter, they and the other two are standing in a line, tied via lead ropes and halters to the top rail. Then they're untied and halterless, milling about. Then tied up again. Then free...etc. I'm glad our pony hasn't learned that trick yet! Also, the troll fighting actually follows more of a narrative sequence than I've given it credit for, though I won't be able to exactly recount that now since I haven't taken notes. But part of it goes like this, if I remember right (and I could well be off): Nori does something to a troll that gets himself scooped up. Ori hits that troll in the eye with his slingshot, which works: the troll drops Nori. But Ori gets scooped up instead; Dwalin does his sliding, here-Thorin-use-my-back-for-a-springboard move; Thorin leaps off Dwalin's back and up at the face of the troll with Ori, who then drops Ori as Thorin leaps back down; Thorin only has time for another slash or two before Bilbo's scooped up and the battle's over. Anyways, good luck with trying to follow all that in real-time. We need slow-mo!


andwise
Rivendell


Feb 8 2013, 1:35pm

Post #4 of 31 (442 views)
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2D/3D [In reply to] Can't Post

Its a strange old thing the divided opinions on 3D.I haven't seen it in this format as it just doesn't do anything for me,I've seen other thing in 3D and its just not my thing,I'd much rather have stuff in HD on a quality screen.as for the blurring of some images I can agree with you there.I saw it 3 times and on the last viewing there was definitely a difference in quality of picture to the previous occasions,and this was at the same cinema!don't know what went on there...but I've heard other people say similar things.they've taken it off my local cinema now too so roll on march!....may have to talk Mrs andwise into getting a slightly larger t.v. 42'' may not do it justice Wink

Arrow....black arrow,I have saved you to the last.you have never failed me and always I have recovered you.I had you from my father and he from old.if ever you came from the forges of the true king under the mountain,go now and speed well


Eowyn3
Rivendell

Feb 8 2013, 2:49pm

Post #5 of 31 (424 views)
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Checked my local theaters schedule [In reply to] Can't Post

I am so happy, not only it still showing at 3 theaters near my home with various time to choose from, but it still showing in HFR 3D with 3 difference times to choose from. I am really happy, since my city is not a huge market; only about 1 million population. I guess I' ll have to see it again for the 8Th. time!


Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 3:10pm

Post #6 of 31 (425 views)
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Saw it best at Azanulbizar [In reply to] Can't Post

You can almost see it at Weathertop, but only if you see it in HFR, where it's clearer and brighter. Otherwise he's sitting on his warg.

I have no problem with looking for stuff when Thorin is on screen. You know how people get monovision, by having Lasik in one eye, or wearing one contact lens, so they can focus on far and near vision? I have "Thorin-vision," whereby I can focus one eye on him while still looking at everything else. I had to develop this, or else I would miss all sorts of things. Unfortunately, it got turned off when I developed "Kazinsky-vision" and went on my Fili Easter egg hunt.


In Reply To
Drat, I knew there was something else I was supposed to look for. Forgot. Where do you see it best? If it's at Azanulbizar, forget it. I can't take my eyes off Thorin.



Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 3:25pm

Post #7 of 31 (436 views)
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On Kazinsky-vision... [In reply to] Can't Post

The scene in the trollshaw what where I first thought something was amiss in an earlier viewing, given that I could lay eyes on all other dwarves but Fili seemed physically unable to turn over (as opposed to Bilbo, who could not only get up but could hop around). I assumed this was a double that they used during the time until they recast.

This time the Kazinsky-vision turned on during Bag End in a big way. At the beginning of the Misty Mountain song, you can see Fili out of the corner of your eye, to the left, in the dark. It is clearly a non-Dean Fili, and I think it's Ron, not a double. In addition to the song scene, old Fili pops up in several spots during the entire Bag End scene, but the only way you figure it out is that you sometimes see Fili hair that looks a little different. I wondered at this point if this was why we hardly saw Dwalin with his fiddle, because when they first filmed it he might have had old Fili right near him. A non-Dean Fili also shows up briefly when they are first brought before the Goblin King--for the most part you don't see Fili at all, but then for a flash you see him stuck off to the left (it's always the left). However, for the running/fighting part, it appears to be Dean.

Clearly there had to be some creative editing done. I'm wondering if they will go ahead and do pick ups before DoS to put Dean in scenes that may have been filmed early on and don't have him in them. Might be more expensive, but sure would make it easier on the editor (although less of a fun challenge for us).


Eruonen
Tol Eressea


Feb 8 2013, 5:28pm

Post #8 of 31 (399 views)
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The Hobbit AUJ is showing in one theatre by me at one time...12:40. [In reply to] Can't Post

I assume that the Oscar nominations are why Argo and Lincoln are still playing in multiple theatres and at multiple times.


Brethil
Half-elven


Feb 8 2013, 5:51pm

Post #9 of 31 (394 views)
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magic rope [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes I saw that. Same continuity issue as Pippin in TTT at the night raid/ Rohan attack. Or...magic ropes!

Losing my shot to go today with major storm blowing in Frown

...she took the point at once, but she also took the spoons.


Brethil
Half-elven


Feb 8 2013, 5:56pm

Post #10 of 31 (392 views)
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cutting in [In reply to] Can't Post

Did not notice the cuts oin and out. Now I will watch for them. The recast is news to me I hadn't been following casting that closely to know that a change had been made. It was early in production?

...she took the point at once, but she also took the spoons.


Tintallė
Gondor


Feb 8 2013, 6:30pm

Post #11 of 31 (370 views)
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HFR 3D will still be at my nearby theater all next week, 2 shows/day! [In reply to] Can't Post

I am going to have to pick up some extra shifts to cover the cost of my theater visits. *sigh*


Tintallė
Gondor


Feb 8 2013, 6:36pm

Post #12 of 31 (377 views)
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Totally missed the haltered/unhaltered ponies! Noticed one or two very small things - [In reply to] Can't Post

My best discovery to date has been the patterned scarring on Azog's warg. I wonder who decided to make that happen? I think it's brilliant.

Radagast is holding little Sebastian's paw just before he says "It's not as though it's magic. . . ." That tiny little paw in the big human hand - a tender little moment.

I wonder how Dwalin got the big scar that goes across his right forehead and across the bridge of his nose?

I still need to go back to see the stairs on the side of the Carrock!


Brethil
Half-elven


Feb 8 2013, 7:19pm

Post #13 of 31 (368 views)
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no HFR close by [In reply to] Can't Post

but at least we still have three daily shows still at the theater nearest to me, although they shifted to smaller thaeter (sensible) and later times. Hoping it holds out another two weeks. I laugh at your shift comment. I've been turning down lots of them to keep going to the movie!

...she took the point at once, but she also took the spoons.


GloryBox
Bree


Feb 8 2013, 8:00pm

Post #14 of 31 (374 views)
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How does Thorin carry the oakenshield... [In reply to] Can't Post

as opposed to wearing it on his arm in battle position? I've only been able to spot him carrying it once. It appears on his left side as the company walks the narrow path out of Rivendell. Just after his "about to step over the edge of the wild" line, Thorin tells Balin to lead and turns to look back. That's when I get a half-second glimpse of the shield. Otherwise, I haven't bee able to spot it as part of his carried equipment. Seems like it must be attached to his belt (or harness?), in order to be easily reached, but not banging around when he's running. I don't think he wears it constantly on his arm, because I mostly see the heavy leather vambraces. But maybe I'm mistaken. If anyone else has spotted how he carries the shield, a heads up would be appreciated!

If I'm lucky, I'll get one more viewing, so I'll try to pay even closer attention -- not that that's a chore!

...one morning long ago in the quiet of the world, when there was less noise and more green... The Hobbit


Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 9:12pm

Post #15 of 31 (354 views)
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Yes, pretty early [In reply to] Can't Post

I think PJ announced it in March/April 2011. They had already been to "dwarf boot camp" to learn how to walk, ride, use weapons, etc., and had started filming. When they recast, poor Dean had to go to a mini-boot camp to get up to speed, which it looks like he did quite well!


Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 9:20pm

Post #16 of 31 (359 views)
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And how did he still have it after the mountains? [In reply to] Can't Post

Another big question is how he still had it after the Goblin adventure. They all fell into the crevice, and presumably they had their weapons on them (while they slept?) when they went down. The Goblins confiscated them all and put them in a pile. Then they "take up arms" and fight their way out, but I didn't see it in the pile, and didn't see it on him as he hacked his way through. Maybe he makes Fili or Kili carry it Wink


In Reply To
as opposed to wearing it on his arm in battle position? I've only been able to spot him carrying it once. It appears on his left side as the company walks the narrow path out of Rivendell. Just after his "about to step over the edge of the wild" line, Thorin tells Balin to lead and turns to look back. That's when I get a half-second glimpse of the shield. Otherwise, I haven't bee able to spot it as part of his carried equipment. Seems like it must be attached to his belt (or harness?), in order to be easily reached, but not banging around when he's running. I don't think he wears it constantly on his arm, because I mostly see the heavy leather vambraces. But maybe I'm mistaken. If anyone else has spotted how he carries the shield, a heads up would be appreciated!

If I'm lucky, I'll get one more viewing, so I'll try to pay even closer attention -- not that that's a chore!



Roheryn
Grey Havens

Feb 8 2013, 9:48pm

Post #17 of 31 (378 views)
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Majestically. [In reply to] Can't Post

He carries it so well you don't even notice it's there! But it is. It's slung on his left side as they're running from the Orcs/Wargs before Rivendell; it's there when they leave Rivendell; you have to use your imagination for Goblin-town; and obviously he's got it when they escape Goblin-town too.

I've looked for it on his pony while he's riding, but have trouble looking at the pony's gear instead of him. As our esteemed Ataahua said, only Thorin could sound manly while saying "Give him a pony!". One his best lines.


GloryBox
Bree


Feb 8 2013, 10:47pm

Post #18 of 31 (354 views)
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Well, he did hand his cloak to Kili to hold after he enters Bag End... [In reply to] Can't Post

so maybe the brothers are the designated minders for Thorin's dropped property Wink. And somebody managed to pick up Oin's squashed ear trumpet in Goblin town, soooo....I think I'll be using the slo-mo button a lot when I get the dvd!

...one morning long ago in the quiet of the world, when there was less noise and more green... The Hobbit


Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 8 2013, 10:52pm

Post #19 of 31 (352 views)
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My God, he really does! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
As our esteemed Ataahua said, only Thorin could sound manly while saying "Give him a pony!". One his best lines.


Try to imagine Aragorn saying that. No, wait, he can pull it off, too (remembering Bill the pony discussion with Sam). Okay, Borimir couldn't do it, for sure.


GloryBox
Bree


Feb 8 2013, 10:55pm

Post #20 of 31 (355 views)
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Well I sure walked smack into that one! [In reply to] Can't Post

Majestically -- you're so right! And thanks for the tip on the warg chase scene. Must do more research!

...one morning long ago in the quiet of the world, when there was less noise and more green... The Hobbit


Roheryn
Grey Havens

Feb 9 2013, 1:31am

Post #21 of 31 (326 views)
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*hands GloryBox an icepack* [In reply to] Can't Post

I figure it's important to consider each viewing as a necessary bit of research -- after all, people don't raise eyebrows so much when you say you're off to do an afternoon of research, but if you tell them you're off to see a movie for the *coughmumblecough*th time, you get lots of funny looks. Or at least I do!

By the way, I just looked at your profile...if you're a vertebrate paleontologist, esp. if you do dinosaurs, PM me? I'd bet you know my dad...


totoro
Lorien

Feb 9 2013, 2:19am

Post #22 of 31 (328 views)
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No, it is a gift... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To

In Reply To
As our esteemed Ataahua said, only Thorin could sound manly while saying "Give him a pony!". One his best lines.


Try to imagine Aragorn saying that. No, wait, he can pull it off, too (remembering Bill the pony discussion with Sam). Okay, Borimir couldn't do it, for sure.


... give him a pony to defeat our enemy.


Eowyn3
Rivendell

Feb 9 2013, 2:28am

Post #23 of 31 (317 views)
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Oh yes, [In reply to] Can't Post

I went for the 8th time today and a family member asked me if I was not tired of watching TH. Can you believe that? Only 8 times and people give you all kinds of funny looks. Anyway, saw it in HFR again and it was awesome.

" He has just as much reason to go to war as you do. Why can he not fight for those he loves?"


Elessar
Valinor


Feb 9 2013, 2:42am

Post #24 of 31 (313 views)
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Funny looks [In reply to] Can't Post

I went last weekend for my fifth and final theatre trip. My family knows how much I love Middle-earth so they understand but they lightly rib me. Which is of course with love. It's ok it's worth it.



Kimtc
Rohan


Feb 9 2013, 3:24am

Post #25 of 31 (315 views)
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Okay. So all hyper-masculine characters in LOTR/TH get a wimpy line... [In reply to] Can't Post

that they somehow turn into puddle-melting sweet talk.

I suppose this means Beorn and Bard will have to get in on this action. Not sure-- does Thranduil count for this?

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