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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Some thoughts...

Owain
Tol Eressea


Feb 8 2013, 9:00pm


Views: 260
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Some thoughts... [In reply to] Can't Post


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When watching the movie the second time, I wonder why they didn't all just fight Azog and his followers? At some point you would think getting chased would be tiresome, and you would set up an ambush.

1. Two wargs attack the Company in the woods. They are both killed immediately. The dwarves are competent at killing.
2. The orcs are not expert fighters. Even Bilbo kills one, and he has no fighting experience whatsoever.
3. Some have long range weapons, and Kili is shown to be a good archer.
4. When the majority of them get out of the tree to rush to Thorin's defense, none of them are hurt by orcs.
5. They have a wizard with them who is powerful enough to kill a Balrog.
6. The Elves hate orcs and killed some for you. Surely they would help you kill the rest with an ambush.

When you force characters into the story, as well as making the dwarves more competent than shown in the book, you create more holes in the logic. This didn't add tension, just confusion.


1. There were only 2 wargs in the woods... they could manage that... they had to... they were right on top of them. They didn't know how many more there were so their instinct was to get to a better position before they made a stand. So they ran knowing there would be more but not knowing how many.
2. Being an expert fighter doesn't mean you can't get killed in battle. The unexpected happens all of the time. And they didn't know what their expertise level was until they faced them. To assume that all fight the same would probably be unwise. Hence sending in warg scouts to test their metal. (Also interesting to note... it was mostly the warriors or experience/trained that really did any of the killing - Thorin, Dwalin, and Kili.)
3. Long range weapons are great if everybody is armed with them and knows how to use them and has an infinite supply of arrows and hits every mark every time.
4. Perhaps the sudden attack at the most dire moment was ... well... unexpected and caught the enemy by surprise. I wouldn't say none of them were hurt but they survived.
5. Indeed, Gandalf is one of if not the most powerful beings in all of Middle Earth. But even if Peter Jackson hadn't' added Azog and Company to the storyline... Out of the Frying Pan, Into The Fire was a standoff in the trees between our beloved company and the goblins/wargs from the Misty Mountains as Tolkien wrote it. Tolkien didn't have Gandalf use his incredible power (the kind that can take down Balrog's) at that point (and many others) in the novel either. Is that a hole in logic or intentional? (Somewhat rhetorical question)
6. I think this denies some of the tension that exists between the dwarves and elves that was laid out pretty clearly in the prologue and developed into Rivendell... and is also apparent in the novel. The Elves weren't aiding the dwarves when they attacked the party that was surrounding the dwarven company at the secret entrance to the Valley of Imladris... they had already been tracking them. And Thorin resisted the assistance of elves and many others throughout the journey for fear of losing the fortune.

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."

(This post was edited by Owain on Feb 8 2013, 9:02pm)

Subject User Time
Why didn't they fight Azog? stoutfiles Send a private message to stoutfiles Feb 8 2013, 2:59pm
    They are stuck on trees Eowyn3 Send a private message to Eowyn3 Feb 8 2013, 3:06pm
        Not referring to the tree scene stoutfiles Send a private message to stoutfiles Feb 8 2013, 3:10pm
            Sorry, got the wrong scene. Eowyn3 Send a private message to Eowyn3 Feb 8 2013, 4:38pm
    Fighting wouldn't have guaranteed they'd all survive would it? Earl Send a private message to Earl Feb 8 2013, 3:23pm
    The dwarves generally run away a lot Kimtc Send a private message to Kimtc Feb 8 2013, 3:39pm
        no more running! stoutfiles Send a private message to stoutfiles Feb 8 2013, 4:18pm
            And there was the matter of that Balrog. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Feb 10 2013, 3:12am
    Some thoughts... Owain Send a private message to Owain Feb 8 2013, 9:00pm
        well said // Rostron2 Send a private message to Rostron2 Feb 8 2013, 9:19pm
        not a hole in logic irodino Send a private message to irodino Feb 9 2013, 5:10am
            Agreed.// Owain Send a private message to Owain Feb 9 2013, 5:37am

 
 
 

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