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Eowyn3
Rivendell
Feb 4 2013, 6:35pm
Post #1 of 39
(1444 views)
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Thorin's beard!
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There have been several people who have commented on the fact that Thorin should have a long beard. While watching AUJ yesterday again, I noticed that he does have a long beard at the beginning of the movie. During the Erabor scene you can notice that he has a beard the same length as his hair, only that it is braided and so it's hard to notice.
As somebody posted on another thread, it would make sense for Thorin to have a short beard now, since Dwarves tear their beards in time of grief. And it would make sense that his beard was not as long as Thror's or Thrain's during the Erabor scene, because he was still young.
Also, his hair still awesome!
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stoutfiles
Rohan
Feb 4 2013, 6:41pm
Post #2 of 39
(808 views)
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He's the oldest member in the party, but looks middle aged. Basically they gave him as much age and much beard as they could without losing the sexy appeal. Book accuracy loses to getting more people in the theaters.
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arithmancer
Grey Havens
Feb 4 2013, 6:43pm
Post #3 of 39
(810 views)
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How did I miss that?  It's not as though I were looking elsewhere once Thorin showed up on screen, in my later viewings...
I suppose this just illustrates the trivial nature (to me, naturally!) of the discussion of who looks like a "real Dwarf" and who does not. Shown a Thorin who does and does not (by this, to me, arbitrary standard) I did not notice a difference.
Does he have the short beard, or still this longer one, at Azanulbizar, did you notice?
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Eowyn3
Rivendell
Feb 4 2013, 6:52pm
Post #4 of 39
(784 views)
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And I finally noticed the beard at the Erabor scene. I did not notice at the battle of Azanulbizar. I'll have to watch it again, but my guess is that he had it short already. His hair looked as awesome as ever!
(This post was edited by Eowyn3 on Feb 4 2013, 6:58pm)
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Angharad73
Rohan
Feb 4 2013, 7:06pm
Post #5 of 39
(778 views)
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There's a clip on the beard as well.
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Isn't there? It's hard to see though how long the beard really is - I didn't even notice it until I specifically looked for it.
At the Battle of Azanulbizar the beard was short already, I'm pretty sure. I think I read somewhere that the change in beard came about because RA decided to grow his own instead of always wearing a fake one?
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julia0925
The Shire
Feb 4 2013, 7:34pm
Post #7 of 39
(715 views)
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I've heard or read that RA decided Thorin would keep his beard short in respect to those who lost their lives in Erebor. Also, his father and grandfather had singed beards when they left the mountain.
It makes sense to me--other dwarf cultures I've read about shave their beards in grief when someone they loves dies, so Thorin having a short beard never worried me.
-----
Lotr: You know it's been a bad day when even the elf is smudged.
TH: when the going gets tough, the tough call the eagles.
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Angharad73
Rohan
Feb 4 2013, 7:43pm
Post #8 of 39
(697 views)
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Yeah, I never worried about the beard length either...
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But then again, I'm not a fan of over-long beards. The plaited one with the clip would have been ok, still, but the way it turned out is fine with me, too. After all, it's not the beard length that counts - it's how well you wear it 
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Kimtc
Rohan
Feb 4 2013, 8:05pm
Post #9 of 39
(700 views)
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I think the problem is we just aren't looking closely enough
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Which is weird, given how much of these boards are given up to discussion of Thorin and his general sex appeal. I think some of us don't get past the eyes. But seriously, the last time I went I planned on looking for his beard in the first scene, and indeed it was longer. Then I got hung up on the damned eyes, and didn't bother to notice his beard after. Sad, sad, sad.
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Baggins Babe
Registered User
Feb 4 2013, 9:50pm
Post #10 of 39
(665 views)
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There's an answer for this.......
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...in Brian Sibley's Movie Guide. Richard Armitage says that the book mentions Thror and Thrain escaping Erebor with singed beards, and he decided that perhaps Thorin had cut his beard out of respect for his father and grandfather and the indignity they had suffered.
So much fascinating detail in that book.
"It was said to me by Elrond Halfelven that I should find friendship upon the way, secret and unlooked for. To have found it turns evil to great good."
***************************************
I used to have a handle on life - but it fell off.
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Roheryn
Grey Havens
Feb 5 2013, 2:42am
Post #11 of 39
(548 views)
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I have trouble following through with plans too...
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For my last, oh, 9 viewings or so, I've gone in *every single time* determined to pay attention to whatever music is playing right as Bilbo opens the door to find Thorin on the doorstep, and for the next 30 seconds or so. I'm pretty sure it must match the first 30 seconds of "Axe or Sword" on the soundtrack, but you know what? I still have absolutely no idea if it does! I get completely sidetracked as soon as he turns his head (before he even says "Gandalf!"), and clearly my thoughts are very firmly on something else besides the music. I've never yet remembered to think about the music again until they're all sitting down together at the table.
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Eowyn3
Rivendell
Feb 5 2013, 2:54am
Post #12 of 39
(533 views)
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I also have plans on matching the music, paying attention to all kinds of details, etc. And then other things distract me. Thorin's hair, beard, eyes. I'll just have to keep watching this movie more times.
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Eowyn3
Rivendell
Feb 5 2013, 3:03am
Post #14 of 39
(521 views)
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I can't think of anything else.
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Thorins_apprentice
Rohan
Feb 5 2013, 4:13am
Post #15 of 39
(535 views)
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What was his reason, for having almost no facial hair at all.Dwarves take pride in their beards and this is an issue like it or not.
Truth be told Kili should have a longer beard.Even when a Dwarf is young, they sport impressive Beards plaited and all.They could have at least plaited ,his hair or something Dwarven but they decided to go with a scruffy Elven look.I honestly think it's funny when people call Kili "the hottest Dwarf" because he quite obviously is no Dwarf but a midget Elf.Watching the movie i thought it was pathetic and odd that he is the ONLY guy without any Dwarven makeup whatsoever.He just looks like a Human.It really distracted me because i know it's a company of Dwarves but my mind dosen't register to Kili.I keep thinking he doesn't belong in the group.
We are more connected than ever before, more able to spread our ideas and beliefs, our anger and fears. As we exercise the right to advocate our views, and as we animate our supporters, we must all assume responsibility for our words and actions before they enter a vast echo chamber and reach those both serious and delirious, connected and unhinged.
(This post was edited by Thorins_apprentice on Feb 5 2013, 4:19am)
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Súlimë
Rivendell
Feb 5 2013, 4:24am
Post #16 of 39
(504 views)
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I have a hard time NOT looking at Thorin too.
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Kirly
Lorien
Feb 5 2013, 5:30am
Post #17 of 39
(511 views)
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yep, Thorin has me the moment he raises his eyebrows in that scene! //
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My avatar photo is Lake Tekapo in New Zealand's South Island. Taken by me in 2004 on a Red Carpet Tours LOTR Movie Location Tour. 'Twas the Vacation of a Lifetime!
pictures taken while on the tour are here:
https://picasaweb.google.com/Kirly7/LOTRNewZealandTour#
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GloryBox
Bree
Feb 5 2013, 6:29am
Post #18 of 39
(498 views)
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Great idea! Activate Thorin Cloaking Device...
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and then maybe I can take in the rest of the scene.
...one morning long ago in the quiet of the world, when there was less noise and more green... The Hobbit
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jimmyfenn
Rohan
Feb 5 2013, 6:49am
Post #19 of 39
(482 views)
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why not let RA jus rewrite the whole book! thorin should have a long beard. thats it.
"You Tolkien to me?!" - Hobbit de Niro
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Old Toby
Grey Havens
Feb 5 2013, 8:46am
Post #20 of 39
(453 views)
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You mean there's music when Thorin shows up at the door?
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I think I must go deaf from the moment the door opens till he says, "Gandalf!" And I don't notice anything else for the next few minutes. (Except I always notice how he bumps his head going through to the next room!)
"Age is always advancing and I'm fairly sure it's up to no good." Harry Dresden (Jim Butcher)
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Roheryn
Grey Havens
Feb 5 2013, 8:53am
Post #21 of 39
(465 views)
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Well now, see, therein lies the problem...
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I only think there must be because it's in the soundtrack, but for the life of me I have absolutely no recollection of any music from our first glimpse of Thorin until they're all sitting down at the table (at which point I finally remember to think again). Thorin's entrance is the biggest IFTSMMOP* scene of the whole movie for me.
*I Forgot To Swallow My Mouthful Of Popcorn
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Macfeast
Rohan
Feb 5 2013, 11:09am
Post #22 of 39
(444 views)
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Doesn't change the fact that I would have thought it very interesting seeing a character of such importance in a much more unconventional design than what one usually see in film. Even if the change makes sense, it still disappoints me, because I wanted to see it unchanged.
(This post was edited by Macfeast on Feb 5 2013, 11:18am)
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Eowyn3
Rivendell
Feb 5 2013, 11:32am
Post #23 of 39
(435 views)
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The only problem with the Thorin device,
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Is that if it gets stuck, it could cause a major panic attack on female viewers!
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julia0925
The Shire
Feb 5 2013, 4:04pm
Post #24 of 39
(389 views)
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I go into each viewing determined to pay more attention to what music is playing when, but usually get caught up myself. I have noticed, though, that there are some discrepancies. The music that's playing when Thorin strides down the tree to face Azog is not on the soundtrack. There's also a theme during "Out of the Frying-Pan" that I can't seem to locate in the movie itself. I thought it was when Dwalin, Fili, and Kili come to Bilbo and Thorin's rescue but it isn't, that's the Dwarves Theme. Hmm. Well, I'll have to wait for the DVD now, it's out of my area. 7 times is pretty respectable, though.
-----
Lotr: You know it's been a bad day when even the elf is smudged.
TH: when the going gets tough, the tough call the eagles.
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Roheryn
Grey Havens
Feb 5 2013, 10:20pm
Post #25 of 39
(355 views)
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To be perfectly fair, there *is* no change...
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at least as far as I can find right now without re-reading the entire book. Dwarvish beards may be described elsewhere by Tolkien, but not in The Hobbit (again, as far as I have found with a bit of skimming just now).
In the book: Dwalin has a blue beard tucked into a golden belt (thus, presumably, fairly long).
Balin has a white beard.
Fili and Kili have yellow beards.
I see no mention of anyone else's beard, no further mentions of color, and no mentions whatsoever of beard length (other than that Dwalin's is long enough to tuck into a belt). So Dwarf beards in the movie could be any length whatsoever (except, perhaps, Dwalin's) and it would not be a change from the book.
Now, in our heads, we may all have a vision of the archetypical Dwarf as having a long beard -- but this vision does not come from this text. I'll stand corrected if someone can point out a relevant passage to me, of course!
Thus, I think it's fairly pointless to argue about whether or not PJ did well or poorly with regards to beard lengths being the same or different from how they are in the book. PJ had pretty much a blank slate to work with, and I think his choices have been reasonably well explained. You are, of course, free to disagree with him -- but I suggest that disagreeing with him on the grounds that he should have stuck more closely to the book is a bit misguided!
(This post was edited by Roheryn on Feb 5 2013, 10:29pm)
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