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I like your conclusion

CuriousG
Valinor


Jan 28 2013, 4:45pm


Views: 166
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I like your conclusion [In reply to] Can't Post

"Loyal evil" makes a lot of sense to me in explaining the ring's influence and actions. I think of it as only partially sentient, the way Turin's sword from Beleg seemed to serve him until it perked up and spoke up when it got a chance to kill Turin and avenge its original owner along with other innocent blood. It wasn't a sword that spoke otherwise or had conversations with Turin, and it never betrayed him in battle, but it had a conscience and consciousness of some kind. That didn't mean it was a living thing or had an active, aware mind all the time, just that it was more than a piece of metal.

Similarly, the Ring doesn't act like a living being all the time, and its attempts to get home to Master don't seem that bright, but as you say, it doggedly tries to return to Sauron. Maybe it's loyal like a mean and rather dumb dog. (I'm a dog lover, by the way.)

For your question #1, I think the Ring definitely has a pyschic, non-physical influence. Look at what happened to the lifespan of Gollum and Bilbo who didn't wear it all the time, and how it gnawed at Frodo even though he had only worn it briefly a few times. Frodo told Sam the Ring was always on his mind, yet it was only around his neck, and as far as we know, Frodo wasn't tempted to use it for any reason, not even to get home to Bag End.

If he wasn't tempted by its promise, as Boromir and others were, and he didn't wear it, how could it have had such a destructive effect on him unless it had an intangible influence? He was certainly much weaker than Sam as they journeyed through Mordor, and I don't think that's entirely because of Shelob's poison, though I'll admit I can't prove that with a text reference, other than Frodo repeatedly complaining of the Ring's effect on him, and never mentioning Shelob's bite. There is no, "I can't go much further, Sam. Her poison is still within me."

For question #2, the Ring certainly grew stronger once it was in Mordor. Maybe that gave it more powers of deceit than it had before, and that's why it gave Sam that vision? But I don't really know. When I think of Frodo being tempted by heroism, there's his defiance of the Nazgul at the Ford of Bruinen where he attempts to be a hero, but the Ring doesn't support any vision of great power to command the Nazgul there or on Weathertop, it just wants him to put it on so it can betray him in their world. Which brings us back to it being loyal to evil. The Nazgul want Frodo to put on the Ring, and it plays its part in urging him. (Or maybe it plays no part at all and the urging comes purely from the Nazgul.)

Subject User Time
How The Ring tempts noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Jan 27 2013, 5:02pm
    Get thee behind me, Ring! CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Jan 28 2013, 12:36am
    Loyal evil Mim Send a private message to Mim Jan 28 2013, 1:54pm
        I like your conclusion CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Jan 28 2013, 4:45pm
        How "intelligent" is the Ring? noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Jan 28 2013, 5:07pm
            The power of the ring... elevorn Send a private message to elevorn Jan 28 2013, 6:06pm
                There was only One Ring, but CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Jan 28 2013, 6:50pm
            Not so sure about the Palantir. Elizabeth Send a private message to Elizabeth Jan 28 2013, 10:42pm
                Corrupted palantirs, an insight into Sauron's powers and methods? noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Jan 29 2013, 1:05pm
                    still not sure about the palantir... telain Send a private message to telain Jan 30 2013, 7:09pm
                        Imbued vs contaminated? CuriousG Send a private message to CuriousG Jan 30 2013, 9:11pm
                            "When can an object be evil?" May be a promising question noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Jan 31 2013, 11:05am
                                Some objects are "evil" in Tolkien's world, but he explains what that means in terms of his story. squire Send a private message to squire Jan 31 2013, 2:37pm
                                    Very interesting answer: thanks! // noWizardme Send a private message to noWizardme Jan 31 2013, 2:40pm
                                    Very well said! // Voronwë_the_Faithful Send a private message to Voronwë_the_Faithful Jan 31 2013, 2:52pm

 
 
 

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