Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Off Topic: Off Topic:
Director for the new "Star Wars" Movie announced
First page Previous page 1 2 3 Next page Last page  View All

zarabia
Grey Havens


Jan 26 2013, 6:58am

Post #26 of 66 (214 views)
Shortcut
I humbly bow to your SW knowledge, but... [In reply to] Can't Post

Splinter of the Mind's Eye came out much earlier.


Quote

All fell silent from Lucasfilm in the late 80's and SW went off the radar. The cult classic "Splinter of the Mind's Eye" came out,


I was a huuuuge SW fan early on (I was an official fan club member and even had a SW fan club pen pal Smile), and I definitely remember reading Splinter of the Mind's Eye between A New Hope (to me, that one will always be Star Wars) and ESB.

http://en.wikipedia.org/..._of_the_Mind%27s_Eye

Sorry to be nit picky Tongue

"The question isn't where, Constable, but when." - Inspector Spacetime


Sunflower
Valinor

Jan 26 2013, 7:24am

Post #27 of 66 (230 views)
Shortcut
Okay, for a beginner [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, I've read the Dune sequels as well, (as well as some of the modern "prequels" by Kevin Anderson and Herbert' s son) and I have to agree with you on the Dune sequels. My fault with them is that they come across as more emotionally cold and cyncal than the origional; as well as less well-written. I feel that Herber basically said everything he wanted to say in the first one, and had exhausted himself by the third. The whole thing of gholas the first time went right over my head, for example. But "Dune" had, buried in all the layered interospection and scientific theory and convulted politics, a beautiful core of emotion and spirituality and great, great HEART. I still remember the exact point in the novel I first broke down in tears (Jamis's funeral..who can forget that?) It was like the "sam in Mordor" moment.
Remember Herbert's Dedication in the book? "To the Dry-Land Ecologists, wherever they may be, in whatever time they are, this little attempt at prophecy is for you.."
I remember the character of Liet-Kynes, who he started out as and what he became, and what he dedicated his life to...I contemplate what Herbert meant by "who is a Dry-land Ecologist", it isn't just a scientist, it is something also deeply spiritual... and it still moves me to tears. Turns out Dune was much more than prophetic....I wish world leaders could read or re-read it now!

Earth (our own little Terra) will need its own "Liet" in near future, if not NOW...

Anyway, just to pique your interest. I suggest, then, starting with something you haven't read from my list. The Han Solo Trilogy by AC Crispin. This is a lot of fans' favorite or near the top of the list. The one dealing with Han Solo as a child and young adult. Besides being well-written and with great unforgettable characters (it's what you call an old-fashioned juicy read, with long descriptive paragraphs and great dialogue) it is a great introduction to the SW Universe as a PLACE. You don't zip around, you spend several chapters in a setting getting to know the locale and its people. And it's what many of the other novels are not--a huge amount of FUN. And I guaruntee you will really fall in kove with Han all over again, you see how he started out as an innocent young kid, a loveable type who had his heart broken and you watch him turn into the "scoundrel"/shoot-first kind of guy but he still talks like a wide-eyed youth (he calls even Chewie's wookie friend "hey, guy, so great to meet ya!" and he's an adult by then) . But underneath all that he still has a heart of gold.

Among other great places we get to see is a big chunk of the 2nd novel takes place on Chewbacca's home planet, Kashyyk, which Crispin presents as..well to give an idea, it looks like Peter's Lorien, specifically the huge trees/flet scene as seen in FOTR. HUGE titanic trees. This got fans really excited when the prequels came out and fans begged him to put Kashyyk onscreen in film 3. But in an instance like a cited above where Lucas HAD to get the last word and tell us "MY way is how it is", he put Kashyyk onscreen in the last film, but it looked completely different. It was just a piddly forest planet..no great trees. You'd think that Lucas could stoop to something innocous for once like giving us a taste of a PLACE from the novels that could look the same...not like it would interfere with the plot! (After all, he had no problem responding to a wish to see Yoda swing a lightsaber, even though Yoda looked...well,I can't decide whether that scene was ridiculous, cool, or both!

PS. Go ahead and nit-pick....I am quoting from memory here. I know I read Splinter much earlier tha the 9o's, I was lazy there. And thanks for linking to that list. The chronological timelime will help a lot. I see much has been published in the past few yrs....Zahn has written more! And Watson too. I'll try to find the time in future months to hit the libraries and get up to date with what I have missed....(so I can see what will be "refuted":),

And now..it's late...really must go!


(This post was edited by Sunflower on Jan 26 2013, 7:34am)


Aragalen the Green
Gondor


Jan 26 2013, 2:06pm

Post #28 of 66 (222 views)
Shortcut
Believable! [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Since I'd say roughly HALF of the dozens and dozens of SW novels, and comics, both for adults and for children, deal with the spouse and progeny of Luke, Han and Leia, you do not know what a unbelievable sense of anger this is is going to cause among fans...

My husband is an avid Star Wars fan, and has nearly all of the novelizations (not to mention Star Trek and Babylon 5 novels as well); and his first reaction was certainly disappointment, and yes, anger. All the characters and storylines he's grown to enjoy are now "apocryphal" as he puts it. His reasoning is, now that SW VII,VIII and IX will be made, if Lucas had given his tacit blessing on all the novels, then why will it all be thrown away now?

Before the announcement that the last 3 movies will be made, he used to feel sorry for "all you Tolkien fans" who couldn't get new stories based on Tolkien's works from independent authors. Personally I never felt the loss, as even after decades of reading what was allowed to be published I still enjoy re-reading Tolkien's works, and still find new things I didn't catch before. But I do understand his point of view, he's really come to view the SW novels as part of the official universe.

There it is: dwarves are not heroes, but calculating folk with a great idea of the value of money; some are tricky and treacherous and pretty bad lots; some are not, but are decent enough people like Thorin and Company, if you don't expect too much.


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 26 2013, 4:38pm

Post #29 of 66 (193 views)
Shortcut
Shaky cam [In reply to] Can't Post

doesn't give me that feel, though, it just makes it hard to see. There are other ways of "hiding" things without making it a blurry mess. My eyes don't just naturally roll around in my head - they focus on something at all times (unless I'm just so tired I'm zoning out lol).

I honestly think that Abrams's early denial was just a way to throw people off. It's possible that he did a 180 after being offered more money, but it's equally possible that he just wasn't allowed to say anything at the time because they were still negotiating. And from what I've read, he's a Star Wars buff, so I'm looking forward to him working on it.

I'm equally excited to see Mark, Carrie, and Harrison return, if they do return. I don't want to see them as the main characters, but I do what to see them as secondary characters. If that entails Han running around corridors, so be it! I'll take that any day. But the new trilogy really needs to focus mainly on the new generation just as the other two trilogies were about separate generations.

Uh, where are you seeing this as already been a labor of reasons other than love? And why are you worried about Lucas's role in the matter? They are his creations after all. It's perfectly acceptable for him to do whatever he wants with them. If you don't like the end result, that's perfectly fine, but at this stage when we know nothing other than director and screenwriter, I think it's a little early to write them off.

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Eruonen
Tol Eressea


Jan 26 2013, 4:41pm

Post #30 of 66 (183 views)
Shortcut
Thank you for the highly detailed review of the SW novels history [In reply to] Can't Post

and recommendations!

So many books on the to read list and so little time!

My guess is that most of these novels are pretty quick reads and not epic tomes that take 200 pages to get into before anything interesting happens. More Sci Fi pulp fiction than weighty material with a cast of thousands and hundreds of subplots.


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 26 2013, 4:42pm

Post #31 of 66 (187 views)
Shortcut
It's not so much that I get sick [In reply to] Can't Post

It's that I can't focus on anything and so I'm pulled out of the movie. That's not really something I'll get over, I don't think.

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 26 2013, 4:45pm

Post #32 of 66 (186 views)
Shortcut
I've not seen Little Miss Sunshine [In reply to] Can't Post

But the fact that it won an Oscar certainly has me feeling pretty secure Smile

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 26 2013, 4:45pm

Post #33 of 66 (181 views)
Shortcut
Very much agreed, Sunflower! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Aragalen the Green
Gondor


Jan 26 2013, 4:55pm

Post #34 of 66 (203 views)
Shortcut
Star Wars novels [In reply to] Can't Post

My husband has a nearly complete collection of the Star Wars novels that he has purchased over the years. He very much enjoys them, and I've read a few. They are actually well written, more than pulp fiction but not too complex; although I would recommend reading a series from the beginning than start in the middle. I tried to do that once and got hopelessly lost.

He is also not too hopeful about Abrams directing. We've seen the newer Star Trek movie and he didn't care for it very much. I think in particular it's the change in timeline that he doesn't like, but he doesn't like the style either. I'm OK with it, and interested in seeing how events end up in the next ST movies.

There it is: dwarves are not heroes, but calculating folk with a great idea of the value of money; some are tricky and treacherous and pretty bad lots; some are not, but are decent enough people like Thorin and Company, if you don't expect too much.


Eruonen
Tol Eressea


Jan 26 2013, 6:29pm

Post #35 of 66 (185 views)
Shortcut
It is interesting that in the lifetime of the author others are [In reply to] Can't Post

able to write books adding to the universe. I sense that Lucas may feel overshadowed by superior writers and has changed things on purpose to try and reassert his authoritative canon...just a guess. However, in the world of ideas, once the work is public the author in a way loses control as his "sub-creation" takes on a life of its own. I would think that if I had read all of the novels and if they were essentially consistent, then they would become "my SW canon" and the movies almost become aberrations. The reverse of JRRT. His books remain canon and the movies are PJ's version. IF Lucas had started off with the novels first he would have more "canon" authority but the public can choose betrween the extensive literature developed by others as their primary SW world.

Q: Have the novels been relatively consistent with the various authors or do they all deal with independent characters and story lines?


(This post was edited by Eruonen on Jan 26 2013, 6:32pm)


Ruxendil_Thoorg
Grey Havens


Jan 26 2013, 6:59pm

Post #36 of 66 (168 views)
Shortcut
Sounds ok to me. i wish it were a KOTOR adaptation though. [In reply to] Can't Post

I'll probably want to see it.

BTW, you know what I'd *really* like to see? A movie adaptation of Star Wars:Knights of the Old Republic (SW:KOTOR) the RPG videogame. That might be worth an entire movie trilogy. It had all the qualities that made the original trilogy successful (including a big ESB-style twist), with the added benefit of having lots and lots of Jedi and Sith around. Therefore, lots of lightsaber duels. (The more of those the better, sez me)

That game had a character named HK-47 who alone is reason enough for a movie adaptation. He/ it may be the best (or at least the darkly funniest) character in the SW universe, including the Expanded Universe. Advisement :get that bloodthirsty assassin-protocol droid with a secret and killer punchlines a movie already! (That's a reference to HK's speech pattern for those who don't know).

Or I'd settle for anything that takes place during that setting period.

A bag is like a hole that you can carry with you.

http://newboards.theonering.net/...forum_view_expanded;


MediaMalable
Bree


Jan 26 2013, 7:00pm

Post #37 of 66 (178 views)
Shortcut
JJ [In reply to] Can't Post

Come on guys, as a huge fan of Star Wars since I was 9 years old, our beloved franchise has been thrown in the dirt and kicked in the face for a long, long time. Having someone of JJ's caliber on this film is the best thing that could possibly happen to this franchise. Personally I feel that we'll see Star Wars finally come alive again.

Here's why.

1. The best Star Wars movie (certainly a great movie, even if you don't agree it was the best) was written by Lawrence Kasden, and directed by Irvin Kershner. A writer with a great handle on characters first and foremost, and a strong director. Here with Michael Arndt and JJ we have the same thing. I love Star Trek 09, the few problems I had with it were script problems, and I blame Orci/Kurtzman for their often cliche ridden approach to character (they wrote transformers). They won't be involved in this film, thank god (a lot of people hate on Damon Lindelof, but I think the fact he has a writing credit on the next Star Trek bodes well for the film, as Orci/Kurtzman aren't of his caliber).

2. J.J. won't make a green screen movie. He just doesn't shoot that way. The way he blends effects, stunts, and reality, is fantastic. Proof? The pilot episode of LOST is full of incredible things happening, and yet you never feel aware of digital effects, and the focus is totally on the characters. And he did that on a TV budget. This will definitely be his biggest budget yet.

3. Kathleen Kennedy is running Lucasfilm, and as a producer she's spent her whole career with Steven Spielberg. This says to me that this film won't suffer from (as much as any movie of this size can avoid) the studio whitewashing the forces the artist's hand. She's spent her whole career trusting artists to do what they do best.

4. This choice reveals that they don't just want to make a film for children or teenagers. Imagine the kind of directors they could so easily have a made a totally saleable/commercial movie with, one totally created to sell toys, not tell a story. Whatever you think of JJ, you can't accuse him of having that approach.

5. The man loves Star Wars. Passionately. It seems like Lucas by the time he was making the prequels really kind of despised his own creation. It'll be fantastic to have someone as thrilled to be working in this world as Lucas was when he made the original Star Wars.

6. J.J. is not a Michael Bay style slickster. He likes complex sets, real stunts, and a sense of reality in his films. He takes genre movies as seriously as he possibly can, which in my opinion is the approach that made Empire so great.

7. His lens flare phase is over. There are no lens flares in the Into Darkness trailer.


Aragalen the Green
Gondor


Jan 26 2013, 7:03pm

Post #38 of 66 (169 views)
Shortcut
The books are published by Del Rey and LucasBooks [In reply to] Can't Post

George Lucas retains artistic control of the Expanded Universe, which covers the novels and comics. Here is a link to Wikipedia about Star Wars; if you scroll down to "Expanded Universe" it explains quite a bit about the novels. In the front pages of each novel there is a timeline placing the books within the chronological order of the movies. Some of the books are standalone, others are series such as The Thrawn Trilogy, The New Jedi Order, The Han Solo Trilogy, etc.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars


Quote
Q: Have the novels been relatively consistent with the various authors or do they all deal with independent characters and story lines?

I think there is both, some crossover, others with independent storylines. I really need to ask Mr. the Green when he comes home from work, and get his perspective as the expert, as I have only read a couple.

There it is: dwarves are not heroes, but calculating folk with a great idea of the value of money; some are tricky and treacherous and pretty bad lots; some are not, but are decent enough people like Thorin and Company, if you don't expect too much.


Sunflower
Valinor

Jan 26 2013, 7:19pm

Post #39 of 66 (161 views)
Shortcut
An example [In reply to] Can't Post

A large part of the earliest novels and comics, the stuff written in the mid-90's, mines Ben Kenobi's famous phrase in the 1977 SW film: "For over a thousand generations the Jedi Knights were the guardians of peace and justice in the Old Republic." Everybody remembers that iconic scene, from Ben's hut on Tatooine. Well, straight from the horses's mouth, right? So all kinds of interesting stories evolved from this supposedly "canon" statement. Lucas didn't have Ben give us any names dates and places, so we assumed we were safe. There are plotlines dealing with the earliest inhabitants of the capital of the Galactic Republic, Coruscant, as well as the birth of the Jedi Order--assuming a "generation" in the modern sense, so it was fantastic, going back to the "colonization" phase of the Old Republic, 20-25,000 yrs ago. There is, for example, a graphic novel series that deal with the brother-sister pair who founded the Jedi order and assisted the explorers who colonized the first star systems and began to invent SW technology such as hyperspace travel. Real fun stuff, it was a strange mixture of the SW universe and Babylon or ancient Egypt, and the artwork was some of the best I'd seen in comics to that date, of course I forget who the artists were, but it was clearly inspired by Frank Franzetta's Conan series, that level of quality and detail in the drawing, it really pulled you into an "ancient time", lost civilzations, planets, etc....but unlike Franzetta's Ron Howard-inspired lurid worlds, the stories were family-friendly, of courseSmile.

NOW ALONG CAME LUCAS in the Prequels, a few times in the course of the films characters say make it clear that "A thousand years this Republic has stood..." I remember seeing AOTC, I said to myself, "I know I cleaned my ears. That was 'a thousand yrs", what happened to 'a thousand generations of the Old Republic'? He's not going prematurely senile is he, has he forgotten his own work?" I'm sure I wasn't the only fan to catch this glaring timely wrench in the timeline. The only plausable explantation can be that Lucas was deliberately willing to go all-out to "refute" periods of time where the fans had "taken precidence" in the absence of input from him, (as he must have seen it) and he was there to assert HIS rights...even if he refuted his OWN WORK and made himself look ridiculous in the process. WHY he wanted to do this is absoluely beyond me. As I said before, it could have been so easy to just not MAKE AN ISSUE of it by having Prequel charafters make no such statements at all, and we fans could go along in our illusion that "what we wrote COULD have happened,' you know, that maybe Lucas could throw us a bone that he appreciated fan efforts...it'snot like we were asking him to confirm any of it was true!
WHY can't we have a "Don't ask, don't tell" policy here?!?

Now, going along that link, I see recent novels and comics dealing with the Sith that appear to go back 10,-25,000 yrs. I never cared for the Sith muchSmile so I haven't been interested in that timeframe of the EU, so I might have to go back and see how continuity isses are. Authors are willing to take the histroy of the Sith Order (the "dark Jedi") back to a timeframe camparable to the other late 90's "ancient universe" timeline, and Continuity issues are still there, each author has to make sure his or her work doesn't overlap or conflict, so I wonder if authors have linked the Sith to other old plotlines of the Jedi Order/Old Republic that Lucas's scripts in the Prequels have supposedly refuted? if the Sith are 20,000 yrs old then the Jedi still have to be, too? If other authors have in effect told Lucas "go to heck" how free will they feel to work around his film "refutations" now that they know he willno longer be in control?

That's why I have mixed feelings....for the series' creative lifeblood, it was perhaps best that he is out; now authors and illustrators will have the freedom to explore, free of the onus of "refutation." I wonder if Disney is allowing Lucas's Continuity Editor at Lucasfilm Publishing to keep their job or if they will hire their own (do they even know or appreciate at this early stage who and what the CEs role is, anyway?). And if the same person stays on, will Disney oversee this or just have a "hands-off" approach and not care? Ideally, the latter would be the case, since in the future I assume they wouldn't care if a future director takes a script based on one of the more poplar novels, they want anything that makes money.

On the other hand...as I said...this is the Igor/Icahn era, NOT the Katzenberg era, so the overall quality of Diney-approved product has decreased. This could go either way, but at this point I'm not getting my hopes up. I hope to God this will be a case of feeling anxious about the director of HC getting LOTR and suprising us all. But I won't count on it. After Trek we have an idea what to expect.

Thats interesting that yr husband feels the same way. I knew I wasn't crazy when I wrote about fan anger. You can't understand ow dear t us some of these characters have come to be to us over the yrs. B/c Lucas said nothing, we assumed he'd allowed them to be "real"....Mara Jade, Luke's wife, (basically described as a red-headed Angelina Jolie,she was the Emperor's favorite asassin, and when her Master was killed in ROTJ she spent 10 yrs hunting down and trying to kill Luke--she was a Dark Jedi, of course--she ends up coming to respect Luke, they stop trying to kill each other, then they become friends and she ends up falling in love with him, this happens slowly over the course of another 10 yrs...she NEVER addresses him by his first name, not even after they marry, she always calls him "Skywalker" and you can tell Luke loves it...only when they're having a "heart to heart" she calls him "Luke"...personality-wise, they're polar opposites...she fiery and he, quiet and...well, you remember Luke. So that's the source of a lot of romatic tension. (Oh, and it should be said that Luke had a couple of flings of his own during the course of Mara's string of assasination atttempts...one of his relationships is with a girl named Callista who may have clues to his mother's whereabouts or legend. Lucas never stepped in and said, "Don't write about Luke's mother, I address that in the prequels." Luckily, the "Callista trilogy" author is able to wriggle out of this one by having that story go nowhere, both on terms of the "mother" character being a lie that Callista used for her own ends, and it leads to Luke and Callista endng their relationship. And that, as they say, could still be that....UNLESS...UNLESS...a line in the script of the New Movies makes it clear that Luke has never had a relationship. Will Lucas really have the guts to take this "Jedi form no ties" thing and imply that Luke Skywalker will die a virgin? I mean, we still are free to assume that Obi-wan may have had romantic encounters, but think about it (if you dare)--it would have been hard to pick up a girl after haivng a drink at the bar when your young Padawan has to tag along all the time, right?

According to the books, Han, Leia and Luke do NOT led very happy lives...in fact, their lives in the New Republic are filled with tragedy. Some of the plotlines involving their children are VERY very dark (much darker than any studio would allow a director to go) but at least, for example, Luke finds some modicum of satisfaction in at least his son, Ben. When I last left Luke, he was raising a fractous preteen Ben. Luke as the parent of a teen, how can you not smile. Sometimes you get that "Being the founder of the New Jedi Order is easy next to this" feeling...wonderful.

I mean, you get to not only love these characers, you feel they are as real as any Lucas creation and it's only a matter of time before they show up onscreen. And now, they won't liely ever be. It will be itersting how continity issues play out here...it'll tear the Universe apart. It is a lot easier to work the Prequels back into an already existing Old Republic storyline than this!


Eruonen
Tol Eressea


Jan 26 2013, 10:08pm

Post #40 of 66 (168 views)
Shortcut
I had no idea the timeline was this long... [In reply to] Can't Post

http://starwars.wikia.com/..._of_galactic_history


It seems toooo long for the technology tree you would expect. For example, to go from present day Earth technology to the technology of A New Hope....say 100,000 BBY.....to 60 BBY when the Millenium Falcom was built....to 41 BBY when Anakin was born....19 BBY Luke is born.


(This post was edited by Eruonen on Jan 26 2013, 10:17pm)


Arandiel
Grey Havens

Jan 26 2013, 10:35pm

Post #41 of 66 (180 views)
Shortcut
Hence [In reply to] Can't Post

this post in Feedback right after. sigh.


Walk to Rivendell: There and Back Again Challenge - traveling through Middle Earth with thirteen rowdy Dwarves, one grumpy Wizard, and a beleaguered Hobbit

Join us, Thursdays on Main!


kiwifan
Rohan

Jan 26 2013, 11:30pm

Post #42 of 66 (153 views)
Shortcut
There are some so-called mini-series in that Expanded Universe [In reply to] Can't Post

which of course need to be read in sequence. However, it makes sense to read the books in chronological order, following the timeline.

The first novels published after the original film trilogy all were set after 'Return of the Jedi' (except for 'Splinter in the Mind's Eye' and Brian Daley's Han Solo trilogy --- which all stick out a bit when compared to the rest of them, stylistically). 'A Truce at Bakura' by Kathy Tyers begins actually on the day following the battle at Endor where Darth Vader and the Emperor died.

And yes, there is a myriad of new characters, and lots to keep track of (names, characteristics, stories etc.)

The problem is, by now the timeline is at a point so far removed from the end of Episode VI that I (not having read the last 25 or so books yet) don't even know if Han, Leia and Luke are still alive. So how are they going to have three more films make any sense to the fans who have been buying and reading the books? They would have to feature Harrison Ford, Mark Hamill and Carrie Fisher at least (apart from secondary characters such as Lando Calrissian and Wedge Antilles), and they're are the grandparents' generation now. Since Chewbacca was killed off in the first of the 'New Jedi Order' series books, are they reviving him?

I'm not sure whether I'm even interested in any new SW films because I've been through a lot with all these people in all the SW novels and would find it impossible to disregard their stories as written in these books, only to have some sort of weird alternative thrust upon me in new movies.


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jan 26 2013, 11:41pm

Post #43 of 66 (200 views)
Shortcut
Not enough emoticons I guess [In reply to] Can't Post

I saw your post on Feedback before I replied here... I was just kidding around with you! Hence > Laugh Angelic

Sorry about the dry delivery (made drier by virtue of this medium). Smile


kiwifan
Rohan

Jan 27 2013, 12:54am

Post #44 of 66 (147 views)
Shortcut
I completely agree with your husband! [In reply to] Can't Post

First they make us buy a couple of hundred novels and then they declare those stories invalid --- hello???!!! 'They' meaning George Lucas and Disney and whoever else is involved in this scam. I may end up boycotting these movies if and when they come out!


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 27 2013, 2:15am

Post #45 of 66 (133 views)
Shortcut
Where has it been said that the EU has been scrapped? // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Aragalen the Green
Gondor


Jan 27 2013, 2:23am

Post #46 of 66 (136 views)
Shortcut
It has not been said! [In reply to] Can't Post

It was only what my husband was worried might happen, as I stated in my previous post. Blush

There it is: dwarves are not heroes, but calculating folk with a great idea of the value of money; some are tricky and treacherous and pretty bad lots; some are not, but are decent enough people like Thorin and Company, if you don't expect too much.


Arandiel
Grey Havens

Jan 27 2013, 2:57am

Post #47 of 66 (158 views)
Shortcut
Well, it doesn't really help that I'm [In reply to] Can't Post

a bit slow on the uptake when it comes to humorous replies. You got me again, SirDennis! BlushTongue


Walk to Rivendell: There and Back Again Challenge - traveling through Middle Earth with thirteen rowdy Dwarves, one grumpy Wizard, and a beleaguered Hobbit

Join us, Thursdays on Main!


Ardamírë
Valinor


Jan 27 2013, 2:05pm

Post #48 of 66 (125 views)
Shortcut
I don't think it's going to be scrapped [In reply to] Can't Post

They hired a guy to research all that stuff. Pablo Hidalgo was his name I think. Regardless of the name, I know they hired someone so I wouldn't think they'd go through that and then just scrap all the EU.

There's a sad sort of clanging from the clock in the hall and the bells in the steeple, too.
And up in the nursery an absurd little bird is popping out to say coo-coo (coo-coo, coo-coo).


Malveth
Rivendell

Jan 27 2013, 6:32pm

Post #49 of 66 (115 views)
Shortcut
Mixed Feelings [In reply to] Can't Post

Not my first choice (Andrew Stanton was my hopeful) but I'm sure it'll be a good movie.


Sunflower
Valinor

Jan 27 2013, 6:36pm

Post #50 of 66 (122 views)
Shortcut
The problem is [In reply to] Can't Post

that I don't see any "big revelation" here.

Pablo Hidalgo is a name that goes back with Lucasfilm for decades. I think. That name rings a bell. I used to have a subscription to the SW Fan Club Magazine (might have to do this again) and his name pops up frequently, and I'm not going to do a Google search now. If his role is anything other than a sop to fans to give the illusion that "yes, we did research and we decided that, so sorry, the post-ROTJ EU doesn't compute with our intended script" so Lucas can go back to his obsession with what I am calling "visible refutation" in the films, and not have the fans get too upset, this time, it may not wash.

Kiwifan, you hit the nail right on the head. As usual, somebody else manages to say in 2 sentences what it takes me a paragraph to hash outSly, but it's only b/c I write in case fans who aren't familar with the the EU can understand the conundrum. This isn't just a case of "fanfic" or even fiction composed while the author was still alive. As I wrote in my first post, 1) it was AUTHORIZED (or so they were advertised at the time, and fans took Lucasfilm at its word) stories taking place in the post-ROTJ period that re-ignited global interest in the SW franchise, and led to the existence of the Prequels. And Lucas didn't exactly just stand back and allow this stuff to be written without input from him (indirectly). He created a publishing division at Lucasfilm to "shepherd" the creation of the EU, in effect, and the role of Continuity Editor has remained unchangd for 20+ yrs. And there were subjects and periods of time that Lucas specifically forbade authors to write about, and the fans didn't even attempt to, not bc they were afraid they might be sued, but b/c they respected Lucas and his creation.

The problem is, in the abscence of any "refutation" from Lucas on any of the storylines (until the Prequels) the Eu began to take on a life of its own, and authors continued to labor under the illusion that there was a kind of "don't ask, don't tell" situation, so fans were free to indulge in their illusions that these characters could exist. As a result, as Kiwifan said, we fans developed an emotional involement and investment in these people to the point where we could see them onscreen as their stories unfolded before us. we knew we'd probably never see most of them onscreen, but there was no chance that Lucas would step in, for example, declare Timothy Zahn's work a lie. We could continue to indulge in a happy Limbo where these creations remained ours and not HIS. It was OK to have "2 parallel Universes" as long as Lucas didn't declare the other one null and void.

It isn't a case of "owning" the SW Universe as being under the impression that Lucas allowed his fans to share it. As you all have said, this is a unique situation in fandom b/c not only is the author still alive, but we are working now in the Internet Age and as a result, as has been documented, attitudes about the role between artist and their audiences are changing. Alternate endings, interactive experiences, etc are beginning to chip away at the traditional role of the artist. On the whole this is not a welcome development IMO, I still resepct the role of an artist and his or her creation. On the other hand, this is perhaps a unique case where, as Eruonen said, some of the fans write really is superior to what the author writes. And in this case, it's like Trek, where the World is being built from screen to literature, it really is like Tolkien in reverse. Now, I don't imagine for one nanosecond that any fan worth their salt could imagine that the best of what they came up with could hold a match to the blazing sun of what Tolkien wrote. But that is not the case of the EU. I can think of a dozen alien species in the novels that trump the Ewoks, the Gungans, or the Nemiodians any day, and as for the plots...

.let me give you an example. In Jude Watson's "Jedi Apprentice" series, Qui-Gon and his 14-yr old Padawan, Obi-Wan, are sent to a planet to mediate a solution to a conflict that was clearly inspired by the Israeli-Palestinian conflict, with both sides having valid historical claims on the place that go back milennia, and each has suffered persecution at the hands of the other and also from third parties at some point. However, an already dire situation (the 2 parties have wreaked so much damage to the planet that its food supply and environment are collapsing, and large parts of the cities are rubble) has become even worse when the surviving children attempted to form a political party and bow out of the conflict. Since this involved the younger ones boycotting miltiary training by both sides, the parents turned on their children and began killing them. Then the children decided that rather than a peaceful solution to the millenia-long conflict being possible, the only solution was to wipe out the older generation completely and declare a New World Order where the old hatreds were dead, and there would finally be unity and peace. (Sometimes this sounds like a solution to the Middle East right?!) Qui_gon and Obi-wan arrive on the planet and attend seperate conferences of the warring parties and discover that they have temporarily suspended their own war in order to attempt a "divide and conquer" strategy over their rebellious children by finding the strongholds of the rebels and starving them out. However, rather than such tactics weakening the resistance, it only makes the "childrens crusade" stronger and more unified. While Qui-Gon continues to try to mediate a soltuion to the parent conflict up above, he gives Obi-Wan permission to seek out the children and find out their situation. Obi-wan goes down into the sewers, gets to know the kids, and ends up falling head over teen heels in love with the 16-yr old female leader of the opposition. As the conflict threatens to spiral out of control on both fronts, he ends up siding with the children in the position that the older generation are the planet's incurable evil and they need to wiped out in order for things to begin anew. Qui-Gon also finds out about the relationship between Obi-wan and the girl, and decides that Obi-wan is not fit to be a jedi if he stays, and decided to leave Qbi-Wan behnd on the planet to teach him a lesson. Don't ask me how this ends b/c it's been 15 yrs since I read this and I forgot, but obviusly their relationship survives.
And this is in a kid's book. Not a "teen/young adult" like HUnger Games type of book, but Jude Watson's stories are Scholastic Readers, for 9-12 yr olds!
Sounds as cerebral as Trek, right?

The reason that a lot of fans feel that an annoncement of an "origional story" sends up a red flag that we're in for a repeat of the Prequels situation is that the squabble over the EU is just another instance in a deteriorating relationship between Lucas and his fans over the yrs. Along with such sore spots as issues over Old Trilogy DVD releases, changes to the Old Trilogy in re-releases, merchandising licenses or ending of old prodct lines, and a general overall feeling over the yrs that Lucas is at odds or even hostile to his fandom at times, it really has led to a feeling of "well, who expects the old man to change his ways now?" The fact that Lucas sold off his whole 4+ bil Empire, including the house he lives in, it seems, but retaines control over works of fiction he didn't write, only reinforces this feeling.


(This post was edited by Sunflower on Jan 27 2013, 6:43pm)

First page Previous page 1 2 3 Next page Last page  View All
 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.