The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit: The Hobbit will almost certainly hold up as a bona fide chapter in a larger classic film series, despite the mixed and overly cynical reviews. . (AinurOlorin)

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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
The Hobbit will almost certainly hold up as a bona fide chapter in a larger classic film series, despite the mixed and overly cynical reviews. .

AinurOlorin
Valinor

Jan 19, 5:59am

Views: 1379
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The Hobbit will almost certainly hold up as a bona fide chapter in a larger classic film series, despite the mixed and overly cynical reviews. .	Can't Post

Why? A number of reasons, not the least of which being it is a good to great movie, in general, and is certainly a GREAT Sword & Sorcery - Action/Adventure genre movie. Is it perfect? Certainly not. It has flaws. There are moments in a few odd scenes which seem rushed. There are a few musical cue ins from already aired movies in the series which seem forced and a tad gimmicky. There are excessive displays of Pit humour (some of the eye crossing bordered on ridiculous, and some of the snot joking bordered on or became repulsive, and in both cases marred some of the surrounding humour that would have worked well without it); Jackson plainly finds a 5 year olds delight in excess expulsions of mucous and gas, which some of us (including, presumably, Tolkien who never really mentions such thinga) do not share. And, of course, there are a few glaring inaccuries and deviations from the actual history of events related in the book, some of which make it a less powerful story than it might have been. It has flaws, as I have said. Yet, the flaws do not negate the fact that it has many truly wonderful moments, and they do not stop it from being a good and possibly great film.

It is NOT The Phantom Menace by any stretch (and that movie was not as bad as some made it out to be, but it merited its rebukes far more than An Unexpected Jurney merits those it has been targeted with). It does not manage to greatly detract from the legacy of the existing films in the series, and there are many positive things which it adds to them (not the least among these being better humour, a lighter paced more charm focused opening to gradually lead into the more somber affairs of the latter installments than Fellowship could have rightly provided, Balin, Thorin, and more Gandalf the Gray {revealing more humour, more cheek, and more power], not to mention the wonderful Erebor sequence and the chilling Lonely Mountain anthem). Many critics have given less than stellar receptions to the movie. But, once you parse through all of the "it isn't what Rings was, and it doesn't live up to the hype," moaning, very FEW critics actually gave it a fundementally bad review. With a few exceptions, most said that it started off slow and had an eye afflicting frame rate (wholly optional the latter), but was a good ride with solid acting once it started moving. Mostly, the reviews read like the response of a middle-school parent whose child recieved a mixed report card of A and B grades, when the lofty expectation parent was hoping for a 3.7 to 4.0 all A brilliance display. . . the normal person who comes in and looks past the parental dissapointment and disaproval, still sees a pretty damned good report card. And, as many here and most who were not looking for something to complain about will attest, the "slow" hour of opening which many critics complained about held some of the best and most engaging material in the movie. Many have already discovered the mixed grandeur and enchantment of the first third of the film, and more will come to as time goes forward. The average viewer who generally likes this type of film, and yet is neither burdened by the hyper-critics quest to root out perceived "bloat" even where it is not present, nor by the hardore lore learned's (read purists and quasi purists. . . and I am among the latter myself) horror at changes like those made to the history of the Dwarves, will find plenty to delight them on both the front and back ends of this movie. I hope the same will be true of the two films still set to follow. I think this review, while more glowing than I would give (I am not as willing to give Jackson and crew quite as many pats on the ass as this guy does) has it largely right about the more negative critics http://www.forbes.com/...arth-is-a-triumph/3/ .

Also, the combination of returning actors and sets creates a more seamless unity than is found in many other prequels, including Star Wars. There is a much greater feeling of differnt but related stories being told in the same world and age than is the case with most other attempts of this sort. So, put a star in for continuity. And, on the topic of the actors. . . all of the leads are high quality and give good performances. There is no strain of the a lead role being left in the hands of a ham-fisted or mediocre actor. McKellen, Armitage, Freeman, Stout, Nesbit and the other more heavily featured performers all provide very authentic dramatizations, and for the most part they have pretty good lines. A few of the lines are clonkers, but then a few of them are magnificent, so it balances out.

Also, and perhaps key, these movies are going to be boxed set, and inextricably tied to a benchmark genre trilogy that has one more combined Academy Awards than virtually any other films in the history of the Academy, a Best Picture award among them. The films are a set, to which these will now belong, and the earlier instalments finale (now the series finale) managed what even The Wizard of Oz and The Ten Commandments could not, iconic as they are. They are inevitably part of a greater whole, the latter part of which has already been deemed Great. And in the future they will be considered a collective. And (barring unlikely crap exuding on the part of one or both of the remaining two films) they, and certainly An Unexpected Journey, are not bad enough to get the "skip over that part," treatment from most audiences. Indeed, it is good in its own right, and makes the Rings viewing a more hollistic experience. It will become a classic film sextet series.

"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

Subject	User	Time
The Hobbit will almost certainly hold up as a bona fide chapter in a larger classic film series, despite the mixed and overly cynical reviews. .	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 5:59am
yepper!	swordwhale	Jan 19, 6:14am
Quite true. What I think some forget (and the mixing in of Thror's fate doubtless muddied it further)	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 6:30am
Nothing to add except	SirDennisC	Jan 19, 6:40am
Yes. Unless they sold them, which seems utterly improbable. New Line was already a division of AOL/Time Warner	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 6:51am
It will hold up	imin	Jan 19, 7:57am
fine line indeed. That's what is so hard here, for us as fans to comment on... though we still have a concept of how good it was of course.	Xanaseb	Jan 19, 12:27pm
A 6-er box will definitely occur	Estel78	Jan 19, 1:00pm
Funny parts of the film	ceppault	Jan 19, 3:32pm
I am fairly confident that had this film managed to get made and released 13 years ago	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 7:15pm
Trying to make a prequel is the root of the problem	burrahobbit	Jan 19, 11:49am
Book adaptation versus written for the screen.	glor	Jan 19, 3:39pm
The threat of death is not neccessary for Drama. I don't need to fear that Margret Thatcher will be eaten by a shark	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 7:21pm
There's very little drama in the necromancer story thread	burrahobbit	Jan 19, 7:38pm
Using the length of the book as criticism of the three film format.	Black Breathalizer	Jan 21, 3:18pm
It's one of those movies	S�lim�	Jan 19, 2:45pm
Exactly my sentiment.	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 8:50pm
Pretty spot on my friend	Elessar	Jan 19, 3:26pm
Thank you, Friend	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 9:37pm
My pleasure	Elessar	Jan 20, 7:25am
I am more or less of the same mind.	AinurOlorin	Jan 20, 5:52pm
I beg to disagree	Black Breathalizer	Jan 20, 6:30pm
And yet Thror had gone mad. The movie already tells you as much. He had succumbed to "a sickness" of the mind.	AinurOlorin	Jan 20, 7:03pm
Agreed	Elessar	Jan 20, 6:37pm
And some are pretty	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 6:34pm
I guess	Elessar	Jan 20, 6:40pm
Lol!	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 6:41pm
Captain Salt,does quoting yourself make the point stronger? =)	Black Breathalizer	Jan 20, 6:54pm
Black Breathalizer, and YOUR point is what, exactly? =) //	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 7:26pm
But, art being subjective, there are no facts of good versus bad. Only matters of taste.	AinurOlorin	Jan 20, 7:15pm
Everything's subjective, and taste	Aragalen the Green	Jan 20, 8:02pm
Well, shall we count what ways that AUJ failed to impress?	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 8:03pm
a rebuttal	Black Breathalizer	Jan 20, 9:24pm
I agree thoroughly about the dwarves, and largely about the humour.	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 12:21am
Again, this is simply not the case:	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 6:14am
Aaaaaaaaaaaaallllllllllll that typing I did to specifically respond to all that your long , 7	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 6:45am
Bilbo fretting over his handkerchief is from the book.	entmaiden	Jan 20, 9:48pm
I put more stock in what was impressive.	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 12:03am
I won't refute all of your counter-arguments, as clearly we're not going to agree	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 6:57am
Fair enough	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 7:06am
Never mind, I've responsed to your considerable arguments in full (see above):	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 7:35am
Well actually, I'll just respond to your previous post in full:	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 7:34am
Thank you for the careful and thoughtful response. There remain matters on which	AinurOlorin	Jan 23, 10:58pm
There's room for everyone here	Altaira	Jan 20, 7:59pm
I was responding to this comment, actually:	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 8:08pm
The same applies to that comment	Altaira	Jan 20, 8:40pm
Your very negative comments regarding fellow posters is uncalled for.	Old Toby	Jan 21, 4:51am
Thanks very much for sharing.	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 6:42am
points to top of the board	Silverlode	Jan 21, 6:52am
I certainly hope he replies	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 6:56am
Don't agree at all...	Captain Salt	Jan 19, 4:41pm
Well, we are all entitled to our opinions, and varying tastes.	AinurOlorin	Jan 19, 9:03pm
Have the opposite reaction	IdrilofGondolin	Jan 20, 12:34am
Um, I assume you only speak for yourself	Old Toby	Jan 20, 2:27am
I agree	peace1993	Jan 19, 6:25pm
The same criticisms were said of FotR...	bborchar	Jan 19, 6:59pm
Not really, no.	Captain Salt	Jan 19, 7:09pm
I explained...	bborchar	Jan 19, 7:34pm
And I'm saying	Captain Salt	Jan 19, 7:58pm
No, many are not of that opinion...	bborchar	Jan 19, 8:18pm
In fact just the opposite...	Captain Salt	Jan 19, 8:30pm
I don't think anyone is saying...	bborchar	Jan 19, 9:01pm
bangs head on keyboard	Roheryn	Jan 19, 9:26pm
Nice way of putting it...	bborchar	Jan 19, 10:51pm
You're a breath of fresh air here!	Old Toby	Jan 20, 2:45am
I'm kind of curious if this is age related at all	Magpie	Jan 20, 3:05am
Could be...	Roheryn	Jan 20, 4:09am
Flawlessly stated.	AinurOlorin	Jan 20, 5:02am
My rants	Elessar	Jan 20, 7:41am
Maybe not an important thought	Elessar	Jan 21, 10:22pm
More like a breath of rather old air. :-)	Roheryn	Jan 20, 3:56am
Yay Ro!	entmaiden	Jan 20, 3:25am
No,	Starling	Jan 20, 3:35am
If I dig deep enough, I can find all kinds of fault with LOTR as movies.	Kimtc	Jan 20, 3:58am
bangs self on keyboard	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 6:17pm
That's not the situation	peace1993	Jan 20, 4:12am
And the echo chamber/group think/fan denial continues... //	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 6:18pm
Disagreement with an OPINION is not "denial", "group think", nor "echo chamber"//	Kirly	Jan 20, 10:47pm
at some point, you have to consider that someone is just yanking people's chains	Magpie	Jan 21, 1:30am
I have only just returned for a short time, but yes, began to think that yesterday.//	Kirly	Jan 21, 2:21am
I don't know. I don't think being indelicate or over genralizing are definite signs of a Troll.	AinurOlorin	Jan 21, 3:10am
I don't necessarily think people who like to yank chains are trolls	Magpie	Jan 21, 4:24pm
Eh, no but the kneejerk response of:	Captain Salt	Jan 21, 6:20am
Yes they were..	glor	Jan 19, 8:20pm
Thank you...	bborchar	Jan 19, 8:35pm
A film should work on its own merrits.	Captain Salt	Jan 19, 8:52pm
FotR got a good critical response...	burrahobbit	Jan 19, 9:26pm
Oscars and critics two different ball games	glor	Jan 19, 11:16pm
...	burrahobbit	Jan 19, 11:56pm
I think we may agrere to disagree on the post-modern politics of criticism but..	glor	Jan 20, 12:37am
Thank you!	Captain Salt	Jan 20, 6:21pm
Pre-release Fan Expectations for AUJ & FOTR	Black Breathalizer	Jan 20, 4:41pm
Thank you :)	bborchar	Jan 20, 5:31pm
Can't speak for everyone	Grant	Jan 19, 7:04pm
It will sit fairly well next to LOTR on a shelf, but...	jtarkey	Jan 19, 9:22pm
The only review I really care about	Kangi Ska	Jan 20, 5:21am
45 years is a long time to wait. .and PJ didn't..	Bombadil	Jan 20, 7:02am

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