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**Geeky Observations List update -- not a full list
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Jan 15 2013, 3:39am

Post #1 of 53 (5431 views)
**Geeky Observations List update -- not a full list Can't Post


First, I want to thank everyone from the bottom of my fuzzy toes for your incredible attention, contributions, and patience when it comes to this list. I've been working through the amazing treasure-trove of Observations (Obs) non-stop. I was hoping to have an updated list for you tonight so you could have it while The Hobbit is still at the theatre, and I still am; but it's not gonna happen right now. So in the meantime, I wanted to give you a list of the changes/additions I've found since I posted my first draft on January 8th.

THIS IS A ROUGH update of additions up to last Friday night, Saturday morning. I have not proofed it yet. I'm now working on what was added over the weekend.

I'm going to have some fun at the Pollantir with those Obs that have @@@ in front of them. These are some we just can't seem to nail down yet :D

There are also links from the posts where I've gathered these Obs with many thanks to Magpie and SirDennisC for helping pull them together!

Remember, this is a partial list of additions and changes to my original draft from January 8. THANKS LOTS! And keep bringing on your contributions, editing, and help! This is TORn's Geeky Observations List and belongs to all of us :)

Jan 1, Roheryn: Some geeky (or otherwise) observations, and questions that need answering
Jan 4, Roheryn: A few more Ro-thoughts-and-observations
Jan 7, Loresilme: Some more geeky observations
Jan 8, grammaboodawg: My Geeky Observations... it's a start :)
Jan 4, Azaghâl: The (not so) unique dwarven weaponry and Azanulbizar, and some weaponry observations in general.
Jan 12, Magpie: The continuing saga of Geeky Observations

Jan 26, 2012, Mooseboy018: connections, parallels, and other fun details
Feb 20, 2012, Malickfan: Anyone else noticed all the links between the different cast members?
July 2, 2012, Magpie: Entertainment Weekly Hobbit cover
Oct 12, 2012 gramma: **The Hobbit Geeky Observation Lists** call for contributions!!
Dec 29, 2012, Rostron2: Favorite Small Details

AND SO IT BEGINS – Bilbo's study will be set up exactly as it was in FotR since it's the same day for Fellowship of the Ring as in The Hobbit.

1. Two swords are mounted on the wall behind Bilbo’s desk appear to be the same ones from LOTR, one looking very much like Strider's Ranger Sword, the other like the Asian Dao that may have been an inspiration for the shape of Orcrist. it couldn't be Strider's sword. But then, it could be an anachronism. Seems I only remember those swords being there when Frodo was using the study at the end of LOTR.
2. There are two pictures: one a painting of the Green Dragon (?), and the other a floor plan of Bag End on the left and right wall. Both pictures are present in AUJ, FOTR and ROTK,
3. When Frodo talks to Bilbo in his study, over his shoulder there is a large pine cone, just sitting on a shelf.

@@@ In the chest:
.....1) Scrolls
.....2) Helm (from Troll's hoard? -– Erebor Dwarvish?) From the front From the side S helmet we haven't seen yet. Dain? Lake-town? Troll horde? It looks like it has a bit of a fantail that's perched from ear to ear... like a peacock tail.
.....3) Sting in its sheath
.....4) String-tied wrapping (Mithril Shirt?)
.....5) Short, dark, broad iron blade (Fili's? / Troll ? / yet to come?)
.....6) Quills
.....7) Red Book
.....8) Giant claw or dragon tooth


4. There are bearded dwarf women in both the Dale street scene before the dragon comes. One of them is a richly dressed dwarf woman selling things off a tray she has hanging on her shoulders.
5. Dwarf women beards are whispy, short, and grow mainly along their jawlines... not easy to see.
6. The society of Dale is orderly and refined as displayed by something as simple as a doll with earrings. They are very multicultural and multi-colourful, jovial and diverse.
7. There are human children riding on a little carousel of sculpted metal animals for them to ride. Perhaps a whimsical something the dwarves would have made for their neighbors.
8. The soldiers of Dale have arrows with alternating dark and light feathers. Their helms resemble a Turkish or Mongolian design.
9. The horns that sound the alarm are long and thin with wide openings/flairs. It looks like there are 4 of them side-by-side on the tower facing in all but one direction.
10. There are 6 giant dwarven statues flanking each side of the great hall leading to Thrór's throne
11. Thorin stands to Thror's right with a dwarf holding a chest (for Thranduil?), while Thráin and another stands to Thror's left.
12. Thror´s armor is made up of scales, as if it was foreshadowing Smaug
13. Thrain's left eye is missing.
14. Thranduil comes to Erebor flanked by 4 of his emissaries
15. The chains holding up the dwarves in the finding of the Arkenstone scene look pretty similar to the abandoned chains in the mines of Moria.
16. The treasure trove of gold is beautiful. The color of the gold looked heavy and solid, like that much gold and trinkets should. It wasn't sparkly and fake looking
17. The dragon's long red tail, gator-type legs/feet, large bat-like wings and spiked head are apparent during his attack.
18. Thror´s armor is made up of scales, as if it was foreshadowing Smaug


19. Bilbo seems frustrated and secretive with Frodo. Could it be Frodo's always very inquisitive and into everything?
20. A piece of parchment on Bilbo's desk is filled with writing; the first line is "There was a merry messenger...": this is the first line of Tolkien's poem "Errantry", which eventually evolved into "The Lay of Earendil" in LOTR.
21. The treasure Bilbo brought back was the gold buried in the troll cave, not treasure from Erebor.


22. REMOVE [used in list with other clothing observations] Bilbo is wearing a yellow, 5-button vest with light flowered patterns, white collarless shirt, brown pants and a pale, sage-green scarf.
23. There's a thatched roof birdhouse outside near Bilbo's walkway.
24. Bilbo always points when he's about the protest.
25. When Bilbo is startled after dealing with Gandalf and the Good Mornings, he ducks to the side of the interior door just like he does in FOTR EE when the SBs come knocking.
26. Bilbo shows 'startle' actions and being 'rabbity.' He even wiggled his nose at one point.
27. A Bounder in the Shire making his patrol/"beating the bounds."
28. Bilbo's dinner has pan-fried trout, cooked greens, carrots and taters. On the table is a bowl of lemon wedges, a jug of honey, another small bowl of salt and one of pepper, and a drink.


29. Dwalin has left crumbs spread all over Bilbo's table.
30. On the floor lower left a set of three "recycle bins" three woven baskets one had paper, one glass and one with tin cans. (???)
31. When Balin arrives at Bag End, Dwalin is just trying to get hold of the contents of a big cookie-jar. Without success though, as his dwarven hands are too big.
32. When Bilbo opens the door, Fili has an open, friendly look, while Kili looks very serious or to be judging Bilbo, even giving him a once over while they introduce themselves.
33. Kili smiles broadly and calls Bilbo, "Mr. Boggins".
34. Kili is the only one who greeted Bilbo by name.

35. Heirlooms and things Bilbo tries to save
..... 1. "Excuse me! That's my mother's West Farthing crockery. It's over a hundred years old!"
..... 2. Bilbo tells Oin to put back "Grandpa Mungo's chair". Oin points to his ear and says to Bilbo that he can not hear what he is saying.
..... 3. His Mother's Glory Box when Kili wipes his feet on it.

36. Many of the dwarves have elements of their clothes reflecting the colour of their hoods mentioned in the books.
37. The candles in Bag End all have soot marks above them on the ceiling.
38. During the dinner preparations, Kili and Fili take it upon themselves to move the keg of ale closer to the dining room, but before they do, Fili appears to take a long drink right from the tap.
39. The dwarves behave so atrociously in Bag End. Aside from the fact that they're 12 rowdy old friends to begin with, and it's a reunion, and you get a bunch of these types of males together under these circumstances, they'll act this way. And the food and drink is free.
40. REMOVE Bombur resembles Friar Tuck from Robin Hood.
41. Ori is very polite when he interrupts Bilbo and his frustrated conversation with Gandalf.
42. Thorin is the only one of Bilbo's unexpected guests who knocks at the door (and not very gently). All the others use the doorbell.
43. When Thorin enters Bag End, Dori and Ori lightly bows to him, but not Dwalin
44. Twelve of the dwarves eat like unsophisticated heathens at Bilbo's house, but Thorin eats his soup with manners befitting a king. Was soup all that was left at that point, or does Thorin just have more refined taste?
45. When Thorin says to the Dwarves, "If we have read these signs, do you not think others will have read them too... ...Do we sit back while others claim what is rightfully ours, or do we seize this chance to take back Erebor?" He then stands and cries, "Shazara!" which means "Silence!", and then again says "Du Bekâr! Du Bekâr!" meaning "To arms! To arms!"
46. During the meeting at Bilbo's table, every Dwarf is fairly - or very - attentive to Thorin. But Bifur never looks at him or anyone else. He just sits there staring blankly in front of him.
47. Gandalf getting all blown up and wizardry imposing with the Dwarves at Bag End when they reject Bilbo as their burglar. Gandalf: “Enough! If I say Bilbo Baggins is a burglar, then a burglar he is.”
48. Bofur calls the "beast" "Smaug the Terrible, Chiefest and greatest calamity" of our age. These are 2 of the names Bilbo calls Smaug in the book.
49. The sketch of Bullroarer Took in Bag End looks really familiar. Was it in Bag End during LOTR??? Where???
50. Nori has a string of sausages around his neck (like Sam) that Bofur grabs hold of and pulls Ori out of the room.
51. As Thorin talks with Balin about these dwarves who came to his call, we can see Bombur bringing food to a silent Bifur sitting down the hall. P'raps Bifur has had enough excitement and has withdrawn for a spell.
52. Balin nods down at Bifur and Bombur when he talks to Thorin about tinkers and toy-makers being the ones who came when Thorin called.
53. Ori is looking through and writing or drawing in it a book in the dining room when Gandalf is talking to Bilbo about being a Took. Gloin and Oin are with him.
54. Ori is still holding a book while they're singing. A nod to him being the future author of the Book of Mazarbul that's shown in LOTR.


55. Thorin's pipe is short wood with a squared bowl.
56. Gloin's pipe short stemmed wooden


57. When Bilbo wakes the next morning, the candle in his room is still smoking.
58. Bag End is spotless, empty and quiet. He even checks up the chimney.
59. Bilbo slept in his clothes.
60. Bilbo jumps over the steps at the end of his lane instead of trying to step down.
61. As he is running from Bag End, Bilbo has to jump over a wheelbarrow carrying a huge pumpkin
62. Bilbo scatters several chickens as he's running down The Hill. Two of them are Golden-laced Wyandotte and Blue Orpington hens. These are considered rare, or heritage, breeds in New Zealand -- appropriate to have these older breeds in the Shire instead of newer commercial varieties.
63. @@@ When Bilbo is running to catch the dwarves, a hobbit (Mr. Worrywort) says, "Mr. Bilbo, where are you off to?" and behind him is a younger man with curly reddish-brown or light brown hair - looking very much like Sam in LOTR - working in a garden with a rake. Could that be Sam's father, Ham Gamgee, the "Gaffer", who was a gardener before Sam? The same Hobbit who is seen in FOTR picking wax out of his ear?

.....@@@ For more detailed Tidbit List:
"No one had a more attentive audience than old Ham Gamgee, commonly known as the Gaffer. He held forth at The Ivy Bush, a small inn on the Bywater road; and he spoke with some authority, for he had tended the garden at Bag End for forty years, and had helped old Holman in the same job before that. Now that he was himself growing old and stiff in the joints, the job was mainly carried on by his youngest son, Sam Gamgee." FOTR Ch1
Dates thanks to the Tolkien Gateway: http://tolkiengateway.net/...t_Gamgee#cite_note-0
TA2926 (Hamfast born, Bilbo is 36 years old)
TA2942 auction at Bilbo's house; Ham and his boss, Holman Greenhand, protect Bilbo's garden (FOTR Ch1 - Ham is 16, Bilbo 52) Perhaps it is Greenhand who asks where Bilbo is off to(?)
In Trailer #2 and Production video #5, the man who looks like Sam/Ham shows up for about 2 seconds just before or just after Bilbo says "I'm going on an adventure". If Ham and Greenhand are working as gardeners together, they could be in someone else's garden.

64. When Balin received Bilbo’s signed contract, he has a loupe. (a small magnifier glass to read it).
65. Three of the Company bet that Bilbo would come with them. Gandalf was one of them. Oin and Fili or Kili.
66. Gloin has pony troubles at the beginning of their adventure. Just like his son had trouble with riding horses in LotR.
67. REMOVE Gloin snores as loud as Gimli does in Lorien (Aragorn cracks him to shut him up)
68. Seven moths don’t mind being sucked into Bombur’s mouth and blown out again as he sleeps in their first camp.
69. Bilbo's pony is named Myrtle. She's one of the Company's 2 pack ponies carrying a large canvas bag and kettle... and now a Hobbit. She's light chestnut with flaxen mane and tail; the same color as Bill in FOTR... and she likes apples.


70. At Azanulbizar (Dimrill Dale: Moria) Thorin's beard is cut short oppose to the longer beard he has in the prologue
71. @@@ Dwalin puts his axes/hammer in the back of Bolg as the dwarves turn the battle around before the gates of Moria.
72. When Balin recounts the battle of Moria at one point he says that Azog swore to wipe out the line of Durin. When he says that, the camera stays on Kili and Fili. They are Thorin's nephews, and this moment points out that they are from the line of Durin.
73. Dwalin and Balin touching foreheads after the battle of Moria
74. After Balin finishes his tale, Thorin turns around, and all the Dwarves are standing, looking at him. You see that Balin isn't the only one who "can call him king".


75. The opposite end of the trident-thingy on Azog's shortened arm, which sticks out of the tricep part of his upper arm.


76. Gandalf has grey scarf over right shoulder. Thrown around his neck when riding in the rain and talking to Bilbo about the other wizards.
77. Gandalf says there are 5 wizards. Saruman the White is the leader, there are 2 Bluesies…but couldn't remember their names. An acknowledgement that no copyright is allowed for use of their names. And Radagast the Brown.


78. There is an actual bird's nest in Radagast's hair... which explains the other bird product on his face.
79. Radagast's House - Expected to be all full of items from nature, but no items from nature (other than the animals and some hanging herbs) were prevalent. They were all potion jars and equipment for making potions. I saw two different retorts which is a device used for distillation or dry distillation of substances. Here's a crop of it from this image.


80. The Trolls speak in thick Cockney accents.
81. The Trolls are played (in voice and motion capture) by 3 of the Dwarves: Bert is played by Mark Hadlow (Dori), Tom is played William Kircher (Bifur) and William (Bill) is played by Peter Hambleton (Glóin).
82. Flurgerburber hobbit knows about seasoning and cooking Dwarves. Bilbo gives lesson on how to cook dwarves to stall for time.
83. Bilbo resents being called a "ferret" by the Troll.
84. The trolls ended up in the same positions that they appear in in FOTR
85. There's a sword of Rohan amongst the troll´s treasure


86. As Radagast speeds into the clearing, he’s crying “Thieves! Fire! Murder!” ... which, in the book, is what Smaug declares when he realizes a piece of his treasure is missing.
87. Radagast describing the spiders of Mirkwood as spawn of Ungoliant.
88. Radagast crosses the bridge into Dol Guldur in quick frightened-looking steps while he clutches his staff.
89. Most of Radagast's movements and mannerisms are very quick, like a small animal.
90. The statue holding the sword comes to life and flexes its grip on the hilt of its down-turned sword.
91. The spirit Radagast fights is the same Lord of the Nazgul, the Witch-king of Angmar, that attacked Frodo at Weathertop
92. The Witch-king is returning from the dead as Sauron's power grows and the nine men wearing his rings are summoned to him.
93. Radagast sees the necromancer; Sauron taking shape again and growing in power.
94. The Necromancer says "Radagast" in a kind of loud whisper: It was Benedict Cumberbatch's voice [from Dutch subtitled viewing].
95. When Radagast take a puff of Gandalf's Old Toby and 'let's go' the smoke comes out his nose AND ears
96. There are several offhand references to places in Middle-earth -- Ered Luin, the Ettenmoors, Frogmorton, Mt. Gundabad, Rhosgobel, the Lone-lands, the Bruinen, etc. Those of us who have pored over the maps in the books get a whole other level of enjoyment from those lines.
97. Kili is almost always next to Thorin when they're under threat or attack.
98. Gloin's axe is the same as one of the axes Gimli wields in LotR


99. Elrond carrying Hadhafang when he is in his amour.
100. The Dwarves sit for dinner at two tables while Elrond, Thorin and Gandalf sit together at another.
101. Elrond shows his support of the dwarves when he offers them food (instead of insult) and when he gives Orcrist ("made by my kin") to Thorin and says, "...May it serve you well..." like a blessing. Later, he does not try to dissuade Thorin from going to the mountain after reading the map.
102. The handle of Orcrist is a dragon tooth.

103. A fire has been made from broken furniture that the Dwarves use for cooking meat, except for Bifur's silverbeet (green food).
104. There is elven armor in a room behind Elrond when Gandalf talks about the secret map and says it is academic.


105. Galadriel is no long wearing the blue/grey cover. She's wearing a shimmering white gown with a low cowl, and Elrond has also removed his cloak.
106. When the Council meeting begins, the moon is up, but in the next shot (when Gandalf looks really tired and exasperated), the sun is coming up, meaning no wonder he's like that, they've been at it all night.
107. Galadriel's power is evident even when she does little. She also seems to shimmer - not just her dress but her whole being.
108. Saruman saying that Radagast was suffering from an excessive consumption of mushrooms was a nod to his comment about Gandalf's love the Hobbit pipeweed dulling his mind.

109. The Dwarves travel from left to right as the Fellowship did in FotR. Travelling from West to the East.
110. REMOVE The music as the Company travels resembles the grandeur of when the full Fellowship begins their Quest.
111. The heroic use of the Misty Mountain theme while the Company walked along the crest of a mountain ridge was a nod to the Fellowship walking over the crest of a ridge to a heroic version of the Fellowship theme.
112. Thorin, for all his gruffness, was constantly watching out and taking responsibility for the others


113. @@@Thorin, Oin, Dori, Gloin, Balin and Fili/Kili (needs more checking) jump to the rocky cliff face as the Giants fight. The others are still stranded. Still on the rock-wall after jumping clear are

114. @@@ The Stone Giant's left leg (needs more checking)
.....1) Thorin
.....2) Gloin
.....3) Fili
.....4) Oin
.....5) Dori ?
.....6) Balin
.....7) Bifur
The Stone Giant's right leg (needs more checking)
.....8) Kili (Thorin cries out to Kili)
.....9) Bofur
.....10) Bilbo
.....11) Dwalin
.....12) Bombur
.....13) Nori
.....14) Ori

115. @@@ When the Stone Giants are fighting, one has its head knocked off, Kili, Bofur, Bilbo, Dwalin, Bombur, Nori and Ori (needs more checking) are still on the legs of that Giant and are dropped/jump onto the rock-wall path when it crashes into the rockwall as it falls forward before dropping into the chasm.
116. When the Stone Giant crashes with a muddle of dwarves on it, and it appears that all those dwarves have been killed, Thorin screams out for Fili/Kili ? His thoughts are most on his nephew even though a number of other dwarves appear to be lost too.


117. Bilbo can take a hit. The goblin he's fighting gives him a sound punch to the face, but Bilbo isn't affected.
118. These goblins are the only orcs in the film that speak common tongue.
119. While the Great Goblin is singing, 2 pieces of torture equipment are being brought in the Mangler & Bone Breaker he called for when the Dwarves were first brought to him.
120. After Gandalf rescues them and the company begin to throw their weapons to each other, Nori is lying on his back holding the sheathed Orcrist and calls out "Thorin!" just in time for Thorin to take Orcrist from it's sheath and deflect the great goblins skull-club.
121. Some of the dwarves lose their weapons in goblin town. Bofur loses his mattock and obtains an orc axe. Nori loses his staff/mace and seems to be carrying an orc sword from that point on. Ori still has his slingshot, but he is carrying Dwalin's warhammer all the way through goblin town and until they climb the trees.


122. In FotR when Gollum first peeks over the edge on the ladder in the Mines of Moria, his eyes do that weird refraction effect almost like they glow. When we first see Gollum in AUJ, his eyes do it again.
123. When Gollum drops the ring.....it "crashes" to the stones with a LOUD rumble
124. There are nasty cuts and scratches on Bilbo's knuckles after he falls down the crevice
125. Sting stops glowing blue when the goblin dies; which tells Bilbo in this way that Gollum is capable of kililng, and that Gollum is not an orc/goblin.
126. Gollum has less control over Smeagol here and has to tell Smeagol to shut up 4 separate times. (As he drags the fallen goblin away; telling how to get out; guesses one of the riddles but doesn't give answer; gives wrong answer in last 3-tries for last "question")
127. @@@ After Bilbo's vest buttons pop off, he's left with just one of 5 (second from the top). Pops off 4 of the 5 buttons on his vest. But it looks like the top button that remains to me. The four bottom buttons....all in a row.,.pop off at Gollum. Later, when Bilbo takes off the ring and joins the company...he has buttoned his vest....but puts the top button in the second button hole, not the top hole where it should be. Makes him appear even more disheveled then just missing buttons. The button second from the bottom remains So his vest is only buttoned at that point. I just returned from #6 and saw it pretty clearly


128. From overhead, we see Oin fighting the goblins on a platform between bridges wielding a long staff or iron-quarterstaff, twirling it all around him as he turns in circles and knocking goblins left and right.
129. Balin turns in circles, like Oin, hitting and knocking goblins off as he artfully swings his sword.
130. Gandalf's sword and staff are flying as he spins and pivots taking out goblins as fast as they come at him.
131. Dwalin seems to give Ori his hammer at some time in Goblin Town. He can be seen wielding it in this screenshot http://cdn.mos.totalfilm.com/...23192-00-810-100.jpg
132. Bofur loses his mattock at some point during the escape and uses an Orc two handed axe instead.
133. Nori loses his mace and replaces it with a orc sword.
134. You can see Bilbo's shadow on the wall when he leaves Gollum's cave, though he is still invisible, just like in the book.


135. The word "lost' is being used a lot in regards to Bilbo:
..... 1. [Dwalin:] “I thought we’d lost our burglar.”
..... 2. [Thorin:] “He’s been lost ever since he left home....”
..... 3. [Bilbo:] “...show me the way to get out of here...” [Gollum:] “Why, is it lost?” [Bilbo:] “Yes... ...I want to get unlost....”
..... 4. [Gandalf counts rescued Company:] “Where’s Bilbo? Where is our Hobbit? WHERE IS OUR HOBBIT?” [Dwalin:] “Curse the halfling! Now he’s lost?!”

136. @@@ Bofur steps on Dwalin's head to boost himself into a tree. It is not Bofur but Nori who steps on Dwalins head to reach the tree. This can be seen by the goblin sabre, that Nori picked up in goblin town, dangling from his side.
137. Kili pulling Fili up in the trees near the end
138. When the eagles are flying to the Carrock, the rock is shaped like the head of a roaring bear.

139. When Thorin is on the Carrock just before embracing Bilbo, you can see his fat lip. Armitage had his lip bashed during filming and he and Andy Serkis decided to keep shooting, because the make up people would have a hard time duplicating the fat lip.
140. Bifur throws his arms up in the background when Thorin hugs Bilbo.
141. When the thrush is first hitting the stone with the snail that there is a snail further down that rock who pulls back into his shell. The snail has a yellow shell and a blotchy brown body.
142. There's a tiny puff of smoke/steam from Smaug's nostril as he wakes.

143. In the opening with the MGM lion, they finish by focusing in on his yellow eye. Then the final shot of the film is of another yellow eye.

WHAT TIME IS IT? Half-way through film APPROXIMATE -- with the credits is when Radagast is in Dol Guldur; without the credits is when Thorin and Gandalf find their swords in the Trolls' hoard.

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes

(This post was edited by grammaboodawg on Jan 15 2013, 3:39am)


Jan 15 2013, 5:24am

Post #2 of 53 (3441 views)
You rule! [In reply to] Can't Post

This simply reinforces just how much detail is infused. Thank you, grammagoodawg and all. Will find mysel looking at the DVD ever so close.

Production Locations on Google Maps
The Hobbit
The Return of the King
The Two Towers
The Fellowship of the Ring


Jan 15 2013, 6:29am

Post #3 of 53 (3419 views)
Thank you, Gramma! [In reply to] Can't Post

What a wonderful, wonderful list!!

"Look! There is light, and beauty up there, that no Shadow can touch!"

Forum Admin / Moderator

Jan 15 2013, 6:33am

Post #4 of 53 (3463 views)
That's beyond awesome... and I have one teensy observation to add... [In reply to] Can't Post

The very first shot of AUJ is that of a flame against darkness - it's Bilbo lighting a candle.

The very first shot of FOTR is also that of a flame against darkness - it's that of an Elven forge.

I found this very evocative (for some reason) Smile

Tol Eressea

Jan 15 2013, 9:28am

Post #5 of 53 (3419 views)
You're awesome, gramma! [In reply to] Can't Post

I so love reading through these. Thank you ever so much for taking the time to compile such a massive list!

I just snuck out today for viewing #9 today (I still have some catching up to do to match you, though!) and have a couple more things to add.

During the Unexpected Party when Dori offers Gandalf the tea, several Dwarves are in the background putting food on the table. Bofur picks up what looks like a scone, thoughtfully takes a large bite, gives an approving nod, and puts the scone with the large bite out of it back on the communal plate.

After the Dwarves lose their ponies, the Dwarves have to carry all their gear themselves. Fili carries, amongst other things, a large shovel on his back. This makes me giggle: just why does a Dwarf prince need a large shovel on such a quest?

I know I had a couple of others but I'll just have to go to #10 to refresh my memory. Smile


Jan 15 2013, 10:21am

Post #6 of 53 (3388 views)
You're brilliant gramma [In reply to] Can't Post


Thank you for this. There's so many of these that I've missed.

What number are you now on?


Jan 15 2013, 10:49am

Post #7 of 53 (3383 views)
Scone Coolness! [In reply to] Can't Post

I started to giggle as I imagine you sneaking out for #9 *wild applause* let alone getting to do ANYTHING for 3 hours without getting busted by your boys. Very Impressive!

LOVE the scone snag! AND the pony gear! A d'uh moment fersher! I was surprised the ponies didn't have their gear lashed to them... so the Company was definitely on a long rest, if not ready to camp, if they unloaded their gear. I saw the shovel, too! Sam carries pans, dwarves carry dirt-tool-things ;)

You're obs from your other lists are toe-curlers, Woman! Fantastic! :D

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 12:53pm

Post #8 of 53 (3381 views)
I think this if my favorite from the list [In reply to] Can't Post

'15. The chains holding up the dwarves in the finding of the Arkenstone scene look pretty similar to the abandoned chains in the mines of Moria.'

You are amazing, and so poetic in your descriptions. I didn't notice this at all in four viewings, so I believe this observation warrants a fifth. Cool

'I do not know what is happening. The reason of my waking mind tells me that great evil has befallen and we stand at the end of days. But my heart says nay; and all my limbs are light, and a hope and joy are come to me that no reason can deny. Eowyn, Eowyn, White Lady of Rohan, in this hour I do not believe that any darkness will endure!' And he stooped and kissed her brow.

Aragalen the Green

Jan 15 2013, 3:32pm

Post #9 of 53 (3334 views)
This is wonderful! [In reply to] Can't Post

You must have taken a lot of time to go through all these posts! I love reading through and recognizing people's comments and additions (I even saw a couple of my own Smile). Thank you so much for taking the time and sharing with us!!

" Well well!", said a voice. "Just look! Bilbo the hobbit on a pony, my dear! Isn't it delicious!"
"Most astonishing wonderful!"

Oleander Took

Jan 15 2013, 4:21pm

Post #10 of 53 (3347 views)
May be nothing important [In reply to] Can't Post

but one of the things that caught my attention is that we never see Bilbo actually eating. We see him drinking a tea? but never never really eat.

"There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something."


Jan 15 2013, 4:23pm

Post #11 of 53 (3343 views)
What about Radagast's.. Beaver Tooth? [In reply to] Can't Post

Made him look really neat and goofy.

Aragalen the Green

Jan 15 2013, 4:33pm

Post #12 of 53 (3330 views)
I like it! [In reply to] Can't Post

He does look goofy at first, but when he says "These are Rhosgobel rabbits...I'd like to see them try!" he doesn't look goofy at all, at all. Quite a serious Wizard at that point.

" Well well!", said a voice. "Just look! Bilbo the hobbit on a pony, my dear! Isn't it delicious!"
"Most astonishing wonderful!"


Jan 15 2013, 5:22pm

Post #13 of 53 (3324 views)
I thought that was pretty funny. [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To
He does look goofy at first, but when he says "These are Rhosgobel rabbits...I'd like to see them try!" he doesn't look goofy at all, at all. Quite a serious Wizard at that point.

In fact, it was one of the few moments where I thought that the humour should have been out of place, but still somehow worked. On the other hand, the scene where he cures the hedgehog and drives away the spiders was a very good show of just how powerful and smart Radagast is, and it was nicely demonstrated by going from silly and goofy to dead serious. "It's not like it's witchcraft!" *pause* "Oh but it is! Dark and powerful witchcraft!" That point sold Sylvester McCoy's performance to me.

Aragalen the Green

Jan 15 2013, 5:44pm

Post #14 of 53 (3322 views)
Wizard powers! [In reply to] Can't Post

Me too! He went from worrying about the poor animals and frantically and emotionally trying to help, to sensing the Dark Powers at work, like a Wizard. Once he has identified the problem he could heal Sebastian with his own Powers.

Radagast seems to get frantic and distracted easily, but is powerful in his own way. Fighting off the wraith he was quite powerful and strong, I get the idea the wraith could have done some serious damage to Radagast. He is also quick to avoid the sword, and does defend himself quite adequately against the weapon, which gives his nervous-seeming movements an advantage, sort of a hyper-vigilance.

I'm really looking forward to seeing him in the next 2 movies. There has been some speculation about him dying or being killed--Gandalf apparently ends up with Radagast's staff--but I don't think so. It takes a lot to kill a Wizard at their full power (see:Gandalf and the Balrog!), and I suspect he willingly gives up the staff to aid Gandalf.

" Well well!", said a voice. "Just look! Bilbo the hobbit on a pony, my dear! Isn't it delicious!"
"Most astonishing wonderful!"


Jan 15 2013, 6:00pm

Post #15 of 53 (3306 views)
Ah, the praise goes to all of you! [In reply to] Can't Post

I'll admit to doing a bit of editing here and there to maintain a flow and keep the Obs short without losing its originator's words... but my goal is to keep them as they were submitted. Lots of very good writers here!

This is all so much fun!! :D


gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:01pm

Post #16 of 53 (3307 views)
Tonight... [In reply to] Can't Post

#21. I should stay home and work on this, but I JUST CAN'T! ;)

How many for you?

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:03pm

Post #17 of 53 (3321 views)
Goofy tooth and all [In reply to] Can't Post

I get goosebumps just thinking about his saying that with such craftiness and pride! LOVE IT!

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:04pm

Post #18 of 53 (3312 views)
You're right! [In reply to] Can't Post

*adds to list* GREAT :) THANKS!

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:05pm

Post #19 of 53 (3323 views)
Flame on!! [In reply to] Can't Post


gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:07pm

Post #20 of 53 (3313 views)
He doesn't even worry [In reply to] Can't Post

about the spiders trying to break in. All his focus and power go to healing Sebastian. BUT the spiders run away as soon as that power is used!

gramma's The Hobbit: Unexpected Journey Line Party Report & Review
and first draught of TH:AUJ Geeky Observation List


I'm SO HAPPY these new films take me back to that magical world!!

TORn's Observations Lists
Unused Scenes


Jan 15 2013, 6:20pm

Post #21 of 53 (3320 views)
Goullum's eyeshine [In reply to] Can't Post

"122. In FotR when Gollum first peeks over the edge on the ladder in the Mines of Moria, his eyes do that weird refraction effect almost like they glow. When we first see Gollum in AUJ, his eyes do it again."

This is eyeshine. It's an adaptation of many nocturnal creatures, like cats, that helps them see in the dark.


all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...

Aragalen the Green

Jan 15 2013, 6:32pm

Post #22 of 53 (3313 views)
I love Gandalf's reaction [In reply to] Can't Post

When Radagast says "these are Rhosgobel rabbits!". Gandalf gives Radagast a look like, "what, really? Are you serious?" Radagast responds, very seriously, "I'd like to see them try"...and off he goes, no second thoughts or turning back. "Come and get me!"

And now I have to roll on the floor laughing again at the Warg chase! Oh, I know others think it's over the top but it gets me every time. Perhaps I'm easily amused.

" Well well!", said a voice. "Just look! Bilbo the hobbit on a pony, my dear! Isn't it delicious!"
"Most astonishing wonderful!"

The Prancing Pony

Jan 15 2013, 6:42pm

Post #23 of 53 (3294 views)
May the hair on your toes never fall out! [In reply to] Can't Post


"If more of us valued food and cheer and song above hoarded gold, it would be a merrier world."


Jan 15 2013, 6:46pm

Post #24 of 53 (3286 views)
I'm still on 9. [In reply to] Can't Post

No more for me, until I'm back. I hope it's still being shown by then.

You deserve an award for your dedication. Cool


Jan 15 2013, 7:42pm

Post #25 of 53 (3281 views)
Wonderful list [In reply to] Can't Post

I´m sure there´re a lot of people like me who are feeling overjoyed from watching this richly detailed list. I just can´t imagine all the sweat and hard work involved, but brilliant things always require great effort.Smile

I remember reading your lotr list and getting astonished just from the start, seeing all that dedication put on to it just stunned me. In a way, I see this like a second journey, a fan journey in which we discover new details and aspects of the film at every turn, analyzing it from different point of views, just enjoying ourselves with the magic world of Tolkien and PJ, and the sheer amount of little things that you can find here and there, purposely left there by the cast and crew.

In addition, aside from this boring monologue Tongue I have a few more details that i would like to share with you. Do with them as you please:

In the Erebor prologue, when the dwarves are exiting their kingdom, you can see a dwarf soldier carrying two dwarf children in his arms, and, being an armor geek myself, i feel the need to point out that there IS a royal dwarf guard, you can see them in the background during the Elves scene, and more clearly during the exiting scene. They have black cloaks and red clothes underneath the chain mail.

I believe this has already been mentioned, but in the battle of Moria´s first shot, Thror, Thrain and Thorin are standing together.

Finally, when Bilbo wakes up after the reunion, everything is cleaned and correctly organized in their proper places, showing the dwarves love of order and symmetry, even though they might appear unorganized at first glance (sorry for my poor englishUnimpressed)

Thank you for this magnificent list, looking forward to the complete one

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