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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Dwarves in the second film
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Radagast's Lead Bunny
Rivendell

Jan 13 2013, 8:14pm

Post #1 of 29 (2107 views)
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Dwarves in the second film Can't Post

OK so the first film put focus on :

Thorin
Balin
Fili/Kili
Bofur : has a little scene in the cave before Goblin Town

So who is going to have more screen time ?

We already know :

Bombur : As he falls in the river
Gloin : Speaks with Legolas after the spider scene

Others ?


FlyingSerkis
Rivendell


Jan 13 2013, 8:18pm

Post #2 of 29 (1471 views)
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Hopefully some Nori! [In reply to] Can't Post

We need to find out what Nori's really about... Wink

Then Manwė and Yavanna parted for that time, and Yavanna returned to Aulė; and he was in his smithy, pouring molten metal into a mould. 'Eru is bountiful,' she said. 'Now let thy children beware! For there shall walk a power in the forests whose wrath they will arouse at their peril.'

'Nonetheless they will have need of wood,' said Aulė, and he went on with his smith-work.


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 13 2013, 8:22pm

Post #3 of 29 (1455 views)
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YES!! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
We need to find out what Nori's really about... Wink



I want to see of the his nefarious actions. We've seen some with the burying of the treasure in the Troll Cave. You notice that he's the first one Gloin calls. I wonder why? Wink

And I'd like to hear Bifur speak some more.


Radagast's Lead Bunny
Rivendell

Jan 13 2013, 8:41pm

Post #4 of 29 (1326 views)
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Nori [In reply to] Can't Post

I have a theory about Nori.

He seems to be some kind of thief/robber at least it is implied that he has problems with dwarven justice.

Maybe after Bilbo speaks with Smaug we will have a scene where Nori, during the night, when all the company is sleeping, ventures in the cave and try to steal the Arkenstone for himself. He awakes Smaug but manages to escape. The dragon is angry and attacks Lacktown.


Calenheniel
Bree


Jan 13 2013, 8:43pm

Post #5 of 29 (1348 views)
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I think I remember from Empire... [In reply to] Can't Post

...that Nori is supposed to be the bad influence on younger brother Ori, with Dori attempting to mediate that. Gramma made mention of this in the big Geeky observations list, where she noted how Ori has that rather loud burp after Nori does it.

So I'm guessing that's why Gloin, when thinking of someone to help him be a bit sneaky with the gold, got a hold of Nori. Just a guess, though.

'I do not know what is happening. The reason of my waking mind tells me that great evil has befallen and we stand at the end of days. But my heart says nay; and all my limbs are light, and a hope and joy are come to me that no reason can deny. Eowyn, Eowyn, White Lady of Rohan, in this hour I do not believe that any darkness will endure!' And he stooped and kissed her brow.


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 13 2013, 9:04pm

Post #6 of 29 (1278 views)
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I think it was in the same thread [In reply to] Can't Post

that I mentioned that when Ori does the "I'm not afraid" speech, Dori gives Nori a withering look. Nori, on the other hand, is smiling.

You also notice that Nori doesn't really talk much. As if he doesn't want to draw too much attention to himself, so that no one notices what he's doing.

And I wouldn't be surprised if Bilbo had a few missing items from his house when the Dwarves left. Lobelia probably isn't the only one to take some of the silver. Wink


In Reply To
...that Nori is supposed to be the bad influence on younger brother Ori, with Dori attempting to mediate that. Gramma made mention of this in the big Geeky observations list, where she noted how Ori has that rather loud burp after Nori does it.

So I'm guessing that's why Gloin, when thinking of someone to help him be a bit sneaky with the gold, got a hold of Nori. Just a guess, though.



Radagast-Aiwendil
Gondor


Jan 13 2013, 9:49pm

Post #7 of 29 (1240 views)
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Let's just evaluate how much screen time each of them got in order to work this one out.. [In reply to] Can't Post

Thorin: Plenty of chance to develop and lots of screen time (befitting the head honcho).
Balin: Lots, and a wonderful character. The confirmation of his death in FOTR is already harder to swallow.
Fili & Kili: A good amount of screen time
Bofur: A reasonably good amount of screen time and nice scene pre-Goblin-Town
Dwalin: An at least noticable amount of screen time
Ori: Far too much screen time given his awful dialogue and character in general.
Gloin: A few lines

The other five had a woeful amount. Bifur had one line in Khuzdul at the beginning, Dori got a couple of lines, Nori got a bit near the end, and Oin got a bit about the prophecy at the beginning.

Bombur, although the butt of a few jokes didn't get a single line, which I felt was a real waste given his prominence in the book. Not allowing him to speak or develop meant that some immature kids in the theatre just snickered at "The Fat One" every time he appeared. I somehow doubt we'll see the stream in the second film (unless they link it to the black magic hinted at in the Radagast/Sebastian scene). I really hope that Bombur gets at least one thing to say in the EE of AUJ.

"These are Gundabad Wargs! They will outrun you!"

"THESE are Rhosgobel Rabbits! I'd like to see them try...."



(This post was edited by Radagast-Aiwendil on Jan 13 2013, 9:50pm)


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Jan 13 2013, 11:37pm

Post #8 of 29 (1135 views)
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There is a scene where Nori is taking too much of some item (cannot tell if it is food or something more inappropriate to "borrow" [In reply to] Can't Post

and Bofur starts snatching it back from him, in Bag End.

Maybe he will try to lift something from Beorn's house, and a concerned and displeased Gandalf will make it pop back out of his pockets (a la Saruman shutting the doors of his chamber), and give a startled Nori a stern look of warning. lol

In Reply To
that I mentioned that when Ori does the "I'm not afraid" speech, Dori gives Nori a withering look. Nori, on the other hand, is smiling.

You also notice that Nori doesn't really talk much. As if he doesn't want to draw too much attention to himself, so that no one notices what he's doing.

And I wouldn't be surprised if Bilbo had a few missing items from his house when the Dwarves left. Lobelia probably isn't the only one to take some of the silver. Wink


In Reply To
...that Nori is supposed to be the bad influence on younger brother Ori, with Dori attempting to mediate that. Gramma made mention of this in the big Geeky observations list, where she noted how Ori has that rather loud burp after Nori does it.

So I'm guessing that's why Gloin, when thinking of someone to help him be a bit sneaky with the gold, got a hold of Nori. Just a guess, though.



"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Mooseboy018
Gondor


Jan 14 2013, 1:49am

Post #9 of 29 (1101 views)
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stream [In reply to] Can't Post

I think there's a brief glimpse of the dwarves carrying Bombur in Mirkwood in one of the production blogs, so that scene might be in. Or at least it was shot.


Nevrast
Bree

Jan 14 2013, 1:56am

Post #10 of 29 (1007 views)
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Bombur is ONLY the fat one in the book [In reply to] Can't Post

Tolkien only ever refers to Bombur when something arises where his weight is either comical or a comical burden for the dwarves. In my current re-read of The Hobbit I'm counting how many times Bombur is called "fat" or some other reference to his weight is made.

Smaug has just attacked Laketown and I'm at 12 so far. I think that may be almost all the mentions Bombur has total. I should have done that count too.


Calenheniel
Bree


Jan 14 2013, 10:56am

Post #11 of 29 (929 views)
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I can see that becoming a motif [In reply to] Can't Post

in all three of TH films. Nori always trying to steal something from every new place they go to. Tongue

'I do not know what is happening. The reason of my waking mind tells me that great evil has befallen and we stand at the end of days. But my heart says nay; and all my limbs are light, and a hope and joy are come to me that no reason can deny. Eowyn, Eowyn, White Lady of Rohan, in this hour I do not believe that any darkness will endure!' And he stooped and kissed her brow.


Radagast's Lead Bunny
Rivendell

Jan 14 2013, 11:12am

Post #12 of 29 (905 views)
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dori [In reply to] Can't Post

so what about dori ?


Rostron2
Gondor


Jan 14 2013, 4:31pm

Post #13 of 29 (923 views)
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This is a good approach [In reply to] Can't Post

Fili and Kili will get more action and lines for certain as they journey through the forest. None of the other dwarves (sans Thorin), other than Bombur, have more than a token mention, or a line here or there. Balin has some more dialogue with Bilbo.

I think where this will matter is in the escape from the Elvenking's halls. We might see some of the other dwarves get some action when Bilbo visits them. It really depends on how close the escape hones to the book. They're not going to take a lot of time whispering at keyholes, I'm sure.


Radagast-Aiwendil
Gondor


Jan 14 2013, 5:24pm

Post #14 of 29 (836 views)
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Obviously when I said he was a prominent character [In reply to] Can't Post

I meant that he was given more to do than most of the Dwarves, who on the whole had no further descriptions or personalities whatsoever. I did not mean that he was a main character by any stretch of the imagination. Regardless of the exact amount of references he gets in the novel, it is more than most of the other members of the company (yes, I know again only because of his weight).

What I meant was that he was the ONLY dwarf not to get even a single line in AUJ, which is what is disappointing.

"These are Gundabad Wargs! They will outrun you!"

"THESE are Rhosgobel Rabbits! I'd like to see them try...."



swordwhale
Tol Eressea


Jan 14 2013, 7:01pm

Post #15 of 29 (780 views)
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sausssagesssss [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
and Bofur starts snatching it back from him, in Bag End.

Maybe he will try to lift something from Beorn's house, and a concerned and displeased Gandalf will make it pop back out of his pockets (a la Saruman shutting the doors of his chamber), and give a startled Nori a stern look of warning. lol

In Reply To
that I mentioned that when Ori does the "I'm not afraid" speech, Dori gives Nori a withering look. Nori, on the other hand, is smiling.

You also notice that Nori doesn't really talk much. As if he doesn't want to draw too much attention to himself, so that no one notices what he's doing.

And I wouldn't be surprised if Bilbo had a few missing items from his house when the Dwarves left. Lobelia probably isn't the only one to take some of the silver. Wink


In Reply To
...that Nori is supposed to be the bad influence on younger brother Ori, with Dori attempting to mediate that. Gramma made mention of this in the big Geeky observations list, where she noted how Ori has that rather loud burp after Nori does it.

So I'm guessing that's why Gloin, when thinking of someone to help him be a bit sneaky with the gold, got a hold of Nori. Just a guess, though.




There's a lovely tug of war between Bofur and Nori over sausages in Bag End. I just thought of it as a comic moment... though you could read "Nori steals far too many sausages, Bofur is better at sharing..." into that.

As for Bombur... Tolkien, sadly, seemed to have been channelling some sort of cultural/time period tendency to find humor in obesity. Someone listed all the tiems (book) where poor Bombur is referred to as fat.

We should have better character development all around in the films... a short book told in a fast moving oral faerie tale style is three films. There will be more detail (there already is: for instance, the couple of lines that describe the stone giants is now a whole scene!). Just wait for film 2 and 3.

Go outside and play...


FiliSonOfDis
Rivendell


Jan 14 2013, 8:46pm

Post #16 of 29 (872 views)
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in DOS my guess is: [In reply to] Can't Post

Throin - continued amount of screen time.
Fili/Kili- a lot of screen time, more then AUJ since I believe this will be a more action oriented film and what i've seen of mirkwood/barrels etc... seems to be fili kili heavy (they also get mentioned a lot here in the book).
Balin- slightly less, only because I think a lot of his big moments are passed, will probably come back into prominence after they reach lonely mountain
Dwalin- I'd assume more screen time because DOS will probably be a lot of action...which is where dwalin seems to shine.
Bofur- continued amount of screen time, he makes light of situations and keeps the tone of a lot of scenes so i feel he'll be used just as much everywhere they go.

less used dwarves-

Gloin- probably more once legolas comes on screen and theres chances to mirror gimli/ remind the audience of gimli mention gimli etc...
Oin- probably about the same, not much but enough so he's the one with the hearing problem
Bombur- more, he will have to be carried, we've seen its been filmed, though he may remain silent (might be his thing at this point) could be cool to have him talk once or something when bilbo takes over his night watch as a kind of "silent bob" thing, he'd have one important line of dialogue between him and bilbo and thats it, could be interesting. either way more bombur im sure.
Nori- I assume he'll have lines/actions when they finally get to the treasure hoard, and i think it could make for a funny scene if bilbo notices the plate hes using some night is from bag end.
Ori- I'm gonna assume more actually, just because i've seen him at the front of a lot of scenes in the blogs that take place in mirkwood.
Dori- hopefully more as well
Bifur- Would love to hear more from him, im expecting more from the extended edition of AUJ, honestly if I hadn't already been reading up on this movie before it came out i wouldn't have even noticed he had an axe in his head from just the film alone, i feel like they down played him after the backlash when people realised he had an axe in his head and tried to "hide" it in the theatrical release... we'll see if they continue to hide him or what.

to be honest i feel like DOS will get a lot more screen time from all the dwarves since there's less to be established with the plot and main characters and more time to get to know the less important characters.


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Jan 14 2013, 11:41pm

Post #17 of 29 (930 views)
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Definitely. [In reply to] Can't Post

little things repeated can define as well as a few big moments. lol

In Reply To
in all three of TH films. Nori always trying to steal something from every new place they go to. Tongue


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


Loresilme
Valinor


Jan 15 2013, 2:05am

Post #18 of 29 (870 views)
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Good assessment [In reply to] Can't Post

on how the dialogue might be spread out. And also, I don't think I would have noticed that that was an axe either, if I hadn't known already.


Loresilme
Valinor


Jan 15 2013, 2:08am

Post #19 of 29 (867 views)
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We might be surprised [In reply to] Can't Post

They're not going to take a lot of time whispering at keyholes
___________________________


With the way they've spent time on details so far, we may get a fair amount of that whispering :-)!







(This post was edited by Loresilme on Jan 15 2013, 2:09am)


swordwhale
Tol Eressea


Jan 15 2013, 4:09am

Post #20 of 29 (716 views)
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fan time [In reply to] Can't Post

If tumblr is any way to judge, it is not only Majestic and the hot nephews who have caught the attention of the fangirls... Bofur (and his hat, an insane amount of devotion to finding out how to build The Hat) and Ori have garnered some fannish addiction. Yep, Ori. Nerdly, lovely, geeky Ori. Various folks posting sad pics from LOTR of the knitwear clad Ori skellington in Balin's tomb too.

And of course, lots of posts about the impending demise of Fili and Kili.... followed by lots of art of them as kids with a doting uncle.

I'm guessing the films won't let them down.

Do not let your kids keyword search Hobbit on tumblr... the, um, non-PG stuff is out of hand...

Go outside and play...


AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Jan 15 2013, 6:50am

Post #21 of 29 (810 views)
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My inner perverse teen will [In reply to] Can't Post

soon be off to tumblr then. *Rolling the dice on seeing the deleted scenes between Gandalf and Galadriel." Lmao.

Lol. One can imagine how fangirls and ladies might be charmed by Bofur and Ori. . . and the rougish Nori, should he ever get a word in edgewise. I wouldn't be surprised if a couple goth gals even go end for that brawny beast Azog Shocked. Not many for us fellas to oggle sadly. . . Galadriel, clearly. The Elf lass on the harp. . . Thranduil, I suppose, if we are willing to put our standards and pride a bit to the side, I suppose. . . Tongue lol

In Reply To
If tumblr is any way to judge, it is not only Majestic and the hot nephews who have caught the attention of the fangirls... Bofur (and his hat, an insane amount of devotion to finding out how to build The Hat) and Ori have garnered some fannish addiction. Yep, Ori. Nerdly, lovely, geeky Ori. Various folks posting sad pics from LOTR of the knitwear clad Ori skellington in Balin's tomb too.

And of course, lots of posts about the impending demise of Fili and Kili.... followed by lots of art of them as kids with a doting uncle.

I'm guessing the films won't let them down.

Do not let your kids keyword search Hobbit on tumblr... the, um, non-PG stuff is out of hand...


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 15 2013, 10:29am

Post #22 of 29 (904 views)
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Why isn't Nori the burglar then? ;-) / [In reply to] Can't Post

 


Calenheniel
Bree


Jan 15 2013, 12:59pm

Post #23 of 29 (990 views)
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He only wishes he had an invisibility ring ;-) // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

'I do not know what is happening. The reason of my waking mind tells me that great evil has befallen and we stand at the end of days. But my heart says nay; and all my limbs are light, and a hope and joy are come to me that no reason can deny. Eowyn, Eowyn, White Lady of Rohan, in this hour I do not believe that any darkness will endure!' And he stooped and kissed her brow.


arithmancer
Grey Havens

Jan 15 2013, 1:12pm

Post #24 of 29 (706 views)
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He reeks of Dwarf! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 15 2013, 2:04pm

Post #25 of 29 (847 views)
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He could roll around in something smellier than Dwarf, before he goes down the Tunnel ;-) / [In reply to] Can't Post

 

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