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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
I had a blurry HFR 3D viewing the other day, after three great viewings.
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entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 10 2013, 2:29am

Post #1 of 31 (697 views)
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I had a blurry HFR 3D viewing the other day, after three great viewings. Can't Post

On Sunday I went to a different theater that I've been attending because the movie times worked better with my schedule. For the first time, I "saw" the blurry unnaturalness that others have complained about. I know that 3D doesn't work for some people, but I've been puzzled by reports that some people were distracted by the HFR and that it took them out of the movie. Until Sunday, HFR allowed me to immerse myself in Middle-earth, but that viewing was highly distracting.

Was it just the theater? Or was something else causing the problem. A couple differences for this past Sunday: I normally put in my contact lenses because I'll be wearing the 3D glasses, but I was in a hurry and forgot to do that, so I would have to wear the 3D glasses over my regular glasses. In addition, on Sunday I forgot my fun Hobbit 3D glasses that I got in Wellington, so I had to use the theater's glasses.

So today, in the interest of science, naturally Wink, I went to another viewing back at my regular theater, but I wore my regular glasses. I brought my Hobbit 3D glasses, but also took the theater's free ones so I could compare. I replicated the situation on Sunday as closely as I could, sitting in approximately the same spot; the only difference was this was a theater where I had fully enjoyed the HFR 3D version.

During the Sunday viewing, there was a moment when I was particularly made aware of the poor picture. It's when Bilbo and Frodo are standing outside Bag End, right before Frodo leaves to meet Gandalf. The background looked really fake, and it appeared that Bilbo (Ian Holm) was standing in front of a green screen. When that moment came today, back at my regular theater, I switched to the theater's 3D glasses, but the scene looked perfectly fine to me.

So I wonder if the HFR experience might be different depending on the theater. My bad experience was at a different theater chain that the chain where I enjoyed HFR, so maybe different movie chains get different equipment to show HFR?

I don't want to get into a discussion over whether HFR is better or worse. I realize that the experience is different for everyone, but it surprised me that one viewing of HFR could be so different for me from the other viewings.


TheBladeGlowsBlue
Rivendell


Jan 10 2013, 2:36am

Post #2 of 31 (431 views)
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I think you may be onto something [In reply to] Can't Post

I have watched the movie twice, both times in 3D and 48fps (allegedly) and the first time was wonderful, the second time I got a lot of blurriness and scenes often looked fake...

The two cinemas where different, the second was a 'VMAX' cinema with a screen twice the size of what I had previously seen... was it the screen size, or the cinema, or both?

Either way, I will be going back to the original (independent as it happens) cinema for future viewings...

Food for thought...

Maegnas aen estar nin dagnir in yngyl im


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 10 2013, 2:53am

Post #3 of 31 (409 views)
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saw it for the second time in HFR today [In reply to] Can't Post

I haven't noticed any blurriness either time. Then again, I watch it without my glasses(too much of a bother to wear the 3D glasses over them). Now my eyesight is not horrendous, and I can easily read the words of the subtitles. But my eyesight might just be enough to keep me from noticing any blurring.


Magpie
Immortal


Jan 10 2013, 2:53am

Post #4 of 31 (406 views)
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I speculated this could be the case a few weeks back [In reply to] Can't Post

I knew that Ebert had complaints about theater projection standards years ago and when I searched, I found a more recent complaint he had.

http://blogs.suntimes.com/...ng_of_the_light.html

Now, I don't know that what Ebert is talking about is as play here, but if one thing can be messed up by the theater's policy and practices, then another thing can be, too.


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Ave Moria
Rivendell


Jan 10 2013, 5:30am

Post #5 of 31 (348 views)
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RealD 3D [In reply to] Can't Post

I have heard that RealD 3D HFR is pretty much the only one to see. I saw it, and it was flawless.

-In the Darkness, a torch we hold-


TheBladeGlowsBlue
Rivendell


Jan 10 2013, 5:36am

Post #6 of 31 (327 views)
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Interesting... [In reply to] Can't Post

...the format is rarely divulged (here in Australia), is that a trend world-wide?

Maegnas aen estar nin dagnir in yngyl im


imin
Valinor


Jan 10 2013, 5:44am

Post #7 of 31 (329 views)
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I saw it in real 3d [In reply to] Can't Post

and it was terrible, colour was way off, and much darker than when i went to see it in IMAX. So bad i think something was wrong with it.

I do think though some cinemas are more set up for one type than another - the IMAX screen has had loads of money pumped into it so they take the time to make sure the film looks good on that screen at this cinema - real 3d is more an afterthought! Probably different for your cinema Smile


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 10 2013, 5:46am

Post #8 of 31 (335 views)
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You mean...theaters vary in quality as much as Denny's? [In reply to] Can't Post

Tongue *runs away*

Silverlode






Nienna
Rohan


Jan 10 2013, 7:01am

Post #9 of 31 (308 views)
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I too had two different experiences - at the same cinema [In reply to] Can't Post

My first HFR viewing was disappointing with some of it appearing to be quite amateurish.

A week later I was in the same cinema but it was much better. The only difference was where I was sitting. For the first viewing which was disappointing, I was sitting towards the side of the cinema. The second time, which was most enjoyable, I was directly in front.

Where were you seated Entmaiden?


Rolfina
Rivendell


Jan 10 2013, 8:31am

Post #10 of 31 (264 views)
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Interesting [In reply to] Can't Post

All I know is that at least where I'm from, the cinemas weren't allowed to show the HFR version until after Warner themselves inspected the result and gave them the green light. This was why many cinemas didn't advertise the HFR screenings until very late, they had the equipment, but they hadn't gotten the permission yet to show the HFR version.
Personally I had no blurriness in my HFR experience, it was bright, clear, and I'm sure exactly as it was supposed to look, but it still took me out of the movie constantly. It's a great technique (would have worked great on Life of Pi for me), but I won't watch another Hobbit in HFR, I want to be able to concentrate on the story and the emotions, without constantly being awed and by that getting distracted by the technology.


Lightice
Lorien

Jan 10 2013, 8:32am

Post #11 of 31 (270 views)
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Interesting... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
A week later I was in the same cinema but it was much better. The only difference was where I was sitting. For the first viewing which was disappointing, I was sitting towards the side of the cinema. The second time, which was most enjoyable, I was directly in front.


I was sitting to the side of the theatre, but I had a perfectly good viewing experience with the HFR. It wasn't spectacular as I might have hoped, but it also didn't hamper my viewing experience in any way, and the reduced motion blur was a positive quality when I noticed it.

I wonder; my theatre was using the newer type of passive 3D with polarising lenses and special, reflective screen, as opposed to the active 3D where the glasses themselves shut each lense every fraction of a second. Which type of 3D did your theatre use, and do you think it might have had something to do with how well the effect worked?


Starling
Half-elven


Jan 10 2013, 8:34am

Post #12 of 31 (265 views)
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Goodness [In reply to] Can't Post

They might have to start making movie theatres that have one row (or should that be column) of seating, all facing the exact middle!


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 10 2013, 10:31am

Post #13 of 31 (246 views)
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I had a similar experience [In reply to] Can't Post

My second HFR viewing of the film clearly had a "ghosting" problem - to me, it looked like the projection system wasn't aligned properly. It was distracting when there was something light, next to something dark (enhancing the effect).

I haven't had that problem since (in different cinemas), so I've it entirely down to the projection system (and perhaps the inexperience of staff to make sure everything is perfect?).


Arannir
Valinor

Jan 10 2013, 10:43am

Post #14 of 31 (240 views)
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Question [In reply to] Can't Post

May some cinemas have tried to update their tech last minute to jump the wagon and now it is not working 100%?


From the 25.000 screens the Hobbit is screened, according to PJ, in only 1000 48fps should have been shown. But still I hear back from cinemas showing it 3D HFR that really surprise me (remote areas etc.).

But pure speculation, of course.


Rolfina
Rivendell


Jan 10 2013, 11:02am

Post #15 of 31 (262 views)
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Well, the only way for them to show it in 48FPS [In reply to] Can't Post

is if they get their hands on a 48FPS copy of the film, and Warner doesn't give it out unless they have checked the setup themselves. I have to conclude that they are doing a poor job checking the screens.
Btw, do they have the distribution rights for the UK this time around? I know they didn't there for he LOTR films. (As a matter of fact I think only the US and Germany Warner had/have the rights for the LOTR ones, I think all other countries had another distributor?).


Arannir
Valinor

Jan 10 2013, 11:35am

Post #16 of 31 (211 views)
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Depends on what "checking" means... [In reply to] Can't Post

... is it enough for the cinemas to send in a proof that they have the necessary equipment?

Warner surely cannot make sure that it is set up right at every screening.

For me, then it is clearly the responsibility of the cinemas.


Chainsaw Charlie
Bree


Jan 10 2013, 3:31pm

Post #17 of 31 (170 views)
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That's the format I saw. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I have heard that RealD 3D HFR is pretty much the only one to see. I saw it, and it was flawless.


And like yourself - the pic was perfect.


entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 10 2013, 4:07pm

Post #18 of 31 (155 views)
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I love it too, but both theaters were Real 3D [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't know yet if it's different chains, or just different theaters, but there was a distinct reduction in quality for my viewing last Sunday.


entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 10 2013, 4:09pm

Post #19 of 31 (156 views)
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Both times, directly in front [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm about 1/3 of the way back.


Rostron2
Gondor


Jan 10 2013, 4:18pm

Post #20 of 31 (147 views)
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Yup, that's the version I saw [In reply to] Can't Post

It worked perfectly, and the depth of field was very subtle most of the time.


entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Jan 10 2013, 4:21pm

Post #21 of 31 (155 views)
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Good point [In reply to] Can't Post

I do wonder if the staff experience and/or the specific equipment was a factor.


Owain
Tol Eressea


Jan 10 2013, 4:46pm

Post #22 of 31 (146 views)
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Projection systems do vary... [In reply to] Can't Post

so thus the experience will vary.

While many of them are based upon the same tech... they aren't all properly maintained...

And... wearing 3D glasses over your regular glasses is definitely going to inhibit your experience... your putting to sets of lenses together with different optical planes and polarizations... that will definitely affect the imagery.

Middle Earth is New Zealand!

"Question everything, embrace the bad, and hold on to the good."


dormouse
Half-elven


Jan 10 2013, 5:00pm

Post #23 of 31 (157 views)
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I've just come back from seeing it in HFR 3D... [In reply to] Can't Post

...having seen it twice in 2D.

I was on the point of not going today, having seen so much negative comment. After all, I don't even like 3D, it makes my eyes feel weird. I've been in the anti-3D camp from the beginning. To date I've only managed to sit through one 3D film, and didn't find the effect very effective, so I wasn't expecting much this afternoon. I was afraid it was a waste of time and money, but I just wanted to see the HFR for myself.

And it was beautiful. So clear and so natural - it sounds corny, but it really did feel like being there and made a tremendous difference, particularly to the Erebor sequence at the beginning, to Bag End, the battle before the gates of Moria, to the landscape shots, to Goblin town, to the moth - and the eagles were breathtaking.

All of which leaves me feeling slightly baffled by some of the comments I've read. It takes time to get used to? As someone whose eyes don't cope well with ordinary 3D, this took no time at all, it looked natural from the beginning. It looked fake? Not to me. I can only think that either we all see things differently, or some cinemas aren't projecting the HFR very well or - well, I don't know, really. I'm just glad I gave it a try!


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 10 2013, 5:08pm

Post #24 of 31 (139 views)
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I'm glad you enjoyed your HFR screening dormouse! [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree that it worked beautifully in the landscape shots, but I didn't like it any other time. I didn't really get the feeling of being there.

I wonder if it has anything to do with the fact you have avoided 3D films in the past? I think it was the combination of 3D-CGI-HFR that "cheapened" many parts of the film for me. Perhaps going in with "fresh eyes" gives you are more unique experience? I dun't know ... just throwing ideas out there.

We'll all get used to it in the end. Some of us just take a bit longer than others. Wink


Kassandros
Rohan


Jan 10 2013, 6:13pm

Post #25 of 31 (119 views)
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I've never had a problem with glasses on glasses. [In reply to] Can't Post

I have always worn 3D glasses over my regular glasses and I'm pretty positive about 3D overall.

all we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us...

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