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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Details in AUJ that are spoilers for DOS and TABA
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Kullervo
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 12:05am

Post #1 of 40 (1142 views)
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Details in AUJ that are spoilers for DOS and TABA Can't Post

Greetings everyone! Kullervo, at your service. I've been lurking anonymously here for quite a while, but decided to finally register and join in on the discussions. I've seen AUJ twice now (both times in HFR 3D, enjoyded it the first time and loved it the second time), and on my second viewing I noticed a detail that I thought was interesting. At the beginning Bilbo tells Frodo about the overflowing gold that the Sackville-Bagginses believe Bilbo is hiding, how it is "only one small chest, hardly overflowing... and it still smells of trolls!". Later we see Gloin making "a long term deposit" at the troll cave, burying a small chest in the ground. So I think it is safe to assume that this is the treasure chest that Bilbo brings back from the adventure, and we will likely visit the Trollshaws briefly on the way back home in TABA.
Have any of you (who have seen it more times than me) found any other details that are not just interesting but that reveal little tidbits of the upcoming movies?

Sorry if this has been discussed before, I looked and didn't see anything of the sort on the front page, so...


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 12:21am

Post #2 of 40 (581 views)
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Very good observation! [In reply to] Can't Post

I like details like that! Smile


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 12:33am

Post #3 of 40 (514 views)
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Thanks Simon [In reply to] Can't Post

I like little details like that too. One of the many reasons I enjoy these films, they are filled with details, and everytime you watch them you see something new. And I know there must be a lot of little things in AUJ that we will see in a new light after we've seen all of the movies. Like tiny little spoilers of the future events peppered here and there...


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 12:35am

Post #4 of 40 (611 views)
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some other observation... [In reply to] Can't Post

Its not that cool i think but its more on the characterisation level. Dori offer tea and wine to Gandalf in such an elegant manner demonstrate that Dori like comfort and he is a little more homebody than the other. To reflect that personnality, he is the one complaining about the rain and the weather at Gandalf. Another little detail appears to be the Ori big burp scene! Smile...i read somewere that is big brother Nori have a bad influence on him and he encourage him to do things that Dori (more elegant) doesnt approve. And if you have notice it, Ori big burp is right after Nori little burp! Tongue


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 12:50am

Post #5 of 40 (531 views)
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Yes, I think with details like that... [In reply to] Can't Post

...the characterisations of the dwarves are done ashtonishingly well, considering the miniscule amount of screen time and lines most of them get, and yet they feel like real individual personalities.


(This post was edited by Kullervo on Jan 6 2013, 12:55am)


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 12:56am

Post #6 of 40 (482 views)
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Yep! [In reply to] Can't Post

Smile


Ave Moria
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 1:38am

Post #7 of 40 (475 views)
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I like this too [In reply to] Can't Post

I believe the chest in the Troll cave he retrieves in the book. I am glad they included this....

-In the Darkness, a torch we hold-


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 6 2013, 1:44am

Post #8 of 40 (520 views)
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You see Frodo pick up a ... [In reply to] Can't Post

Tooth (or claw) of Smaug in the beginning. I imagine we'll see Bilbo bring back many an artifact - there's also a Dwarvish sword if I remember rightly.


Avnar
Lorien


Jan 6 2013, 1:55am

Post #9 of 40 (465 views)
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I'm wondering... [In reply to] Can't Post

What that helmet looking thing is that Bilbo picks up while he is going through the chest. Looks old and rusty...

Could be something that Thorin wears at the BO5A's ...?


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 2:04am

Post #10 of 40 (421 views)
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Oh, yes... [In reply to] Can't Post

It's been awhile since I've read the book, but I remember Bilbo getting two chests after the battle and Thorin's funeral, but you are right they did also dug up the treasure with Gandalf on their way back. I guess in the movie this is the only treasure Bilbo receives, but yes, I'm also glad they (seem to have) included this.


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 2:16am

Post #11 of 40 (425 views)
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That's interesting [In reply to] Can't Post

I didn't catch that. I do remember the sword and the helmet (maybe Bilbo wears them in the battle of five armies?). I think it will be a lot of fun to revisit AUJ after the trilogy has concluded and see all these little things in new light.


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 2:21am

Post #12 of 40 (433 views)
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Or maybe [In reply to] Can't Post

the helmet is what Bilbo wears at the battle. I think they are most likely going to have Bilbo participating in the battle.


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 6 2013, 2:55am

Post #13 of 40 (405 views)
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I had wondered about that too [In reply to] Can't Post

Makes sense if it smells like Troll, as I doubt any of the gold from Erebor would smell of Troll.


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 6 2013, 3:04am

Post #14 of 40 (437 views)
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Dori Nori Ori [In reply to] Can't Post

I hadn't noticed who burped before Ori. But it makes sense that Nori would be a bad influence, as he seems to be someone who's a bit of a trouble-maker. Wink

I wonder if Ori also got the word "jacksy" from Nori as well. Since Dori seems to be rather disgusted with Ori saying that. Because he pulled Ori back down into his chair rather quickly after the "I'm not afraid" speech.

But I think Dori is also a good influence on his little brother, as Ori is rather polite. Being the youngest, he's probably just trying to impress his older brothers in any way he can think of. I'll have to see if we get Dori's reaction to Ori's belch (I'm pretty sure that Nori thought it was great.).


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 3:12am

Post #15 of 40 (401 views)
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I'm not a big fan of the burping [In reply to] Can't Post

but it is funny to know that in this movie even burping is a character building moment.Smile


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 6 2013, 3:30am

Post #16 of 40 (374 views)
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maybe [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
but it is funny to know that in this movie even burping is a character building moment.Smile


This is just my own bizarre take of things. Can't say if that's what is actually happening in this scene.

But, hey, that's why we have discussions. To see how things are and can be interpreted. Wink


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 3:46am

Post #17 of 40 (380 views)
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From the word "Jacksy" [In reply to] Can't Post

Ori get a big smile from Nori! Smile ...so i think Nori is the influence on this!


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 6 2013, 3:50am

Post #18 of 40 (360 views)
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I'll pay close attention [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Ori get a big smile from Nori! Smile ...so i think Nori is the influence on this!


I'll be seeing it again on Wed, so I can see Nori's reaction. He might even enjoy how much is annoys Dori. Being the middle child can't be easy. So what better than to get the youngest to do and say things that'll annoy the hell out of the eldest? (I can't really say much there, as I'm the youngest of two).


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 4:02am

Post #19 of 40 (368 views)
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No, I think you are right [In reply to] Can't Post

how you describe the relationships between Dori Nori and Ori is presicely the feel I got from them as well. And I do think it is genuinely applaudable how well PJ and the actors have managed to define the dwares as relatable individuals. They are mostly in the background (just like in the book), but in the background they are constantly doing little things and giving little smiles nods and gestures to eachothers that reveal their character. I've watched the movie twice now, and on my second viewing I noticed many little things about the dwarves that I missed the first time, like when Thorin is giving his "do we seize this chance to take back Erebor-speech" Oin is looking at him with a confused expression on his face and tilts his head as if he knows that Thorin is telling them something important and inspiring but he cant quite figure out what it is.Smile I expect there are tons of these small moments in the movie that I have not yet seen, and I can't wait to watch it again and get to know these dwarves even more. :)


(This post was edited by Kullervo on Jan 6 2013, 4:06am)


ryouko
Lorien

Jan 6 2013, 4:22am

Post #20 of 40 (345 views)
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brothers [In reply to] Can't Post

Nice to see that others see the interactions between the various sets of brothers(and not just between Kili and Fili). But, then again, it might be because I have really taken a liking to Ori and Dori, so I notice the interaction between them. I read in character description that Dori keeps an eye on Ori, making sure he doesn't catch a chill and that he eats properly ("Well, just try a little bite"). Yet, you don't see a whole lot between Nori and either of his brothers. I wonder how Nori feels about Dori constantly looking after Ori. I wonder if we'll see more in the EE, or in the next movies.


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 4:32am

Post #21 of 40 (343 views)
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Yes there is... [In reply to] Can't Post

Like when Bilbo try to take back the chair in Oin hands...Oin put is hand near is ear to tell Bilbo he don't understand him because of is earing problem Smile ...They are plenty of little details like this in the background...everything breathe and exist even when we have the focus somewhere else. Its what i like the most with the Middle Earth movies...the real star of the movie...is Middle Earth because i can imagine and feel that everything is animated beyond what the heroes does and when the movie end...i really feel that the life continued in this particular place!


(This post was edited by Simon on Jan 6 2013, 4:33am)


Simon
Rivendell

Jan 6 2013, 4:41am

Post #22 of 40 (353 views)
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Thorin is very fond of Kili [In reply to] Can't Post

When he arrive at Bag-End, he smile with love and joy at Kili (the focus is on Gandalf at that moment i think)


sycorax82
Rohan

Jan 6 2013, 4:54am

Post #23 of 40 (390 views)
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I'm taking a guess at a slight spoiler for the AUJ EE... [In reply to] Can't Post

Gandalf says 'the valley of Imladris.In the common tongue it's known by another name...' to which Bilbo answers 'Rivendell'.

What I'm thinking is that this was originally meant as a callback to an earlier scene where Rivendell is mentioned. Probably in the Old Took party scene where we see Bilbo as a child. He's supposed to be more 'adventurous' in that scene so he could be bragging about going to see the Elves at Rivendell...something like that.

This, combined with the extra scenes of Bilbo in Rivendell (Narsil and talking to Elrond) are, I think, gonna make for a nice little throughline for the EE, adding more depth to his character.


Kullervo
Rivendell


Jan 6 2013, 5:23am

Post #24 of 40 (323 views)
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Could be [In reply to] Can't Post

I do wish we get more Bilbo in Rivendell in the EEs. In the theatrical cut we now only have his reaction when they arrive and his look back when they are leaving. Altough, even from those two brief moments you do get the feel that Rivendell is a special place for Bilbo. Overall I hope most of the scenes in the EE's will be character moments. Even though we do get alot of them during the first hour or hour and a half of the movie, I think we could use a few more of them, especially Bilbo moments, in the latter part of the film.


DanielLB
Immortal


Jan 6 2013, 10:39am

Post #25 of 40 (240 views)
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I like this idea [In reply to] Can't Post

And perhaps Bilbo brings back those swords that are on his wall too.

These swords

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