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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Thought question for all TORnsibs--when 'The Hobbit' is made . .
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elf_wannabee
Lorien

Nov 14 2007, 3:31am

Post #1 of 59 (1404 views)
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Thought question for all TORnsibs--when 'The Hobbit' is made . . Can't Post

should the director cast ALL 13 dwarves or a representative group--and of the 13 which is your favorite name? Oin, Gloin,...? The trolls are no question--all three must be cast! What chapters do you think will be left on the cutting room floor?? to me none--just something to ponder about before the games begin!!


Patty
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 3:45am

Post #2 of 59 (1063 views)
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All the dwarves should be cast! [In reply to] Can't Post

they don't all have to speak (although they can make background sounds, as in the BBC audio version. Extras (no name folks, with great faces) could be used very inexpensively, heck, I know many TORNadoes who would do it for free!

For Gondor!


Draupne
Forum Admin / Moderator

Nov 14 2007, 9:07am

Post #3 of 59 (1069 views)
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Kast dem! Alle sammen! [In reply to] Can't Post

Cast (written kast but pronounced nearly the same way) means throw in Norwegian, so I saw the Hobbit as a big dwarf-tossing party for a moment.

I wouldn't mind if they cut the singing elves. I don't mind them in the book but it seem a bit too silly on screen I think, like Tom Bombadil.


Penthe
Gondor


Nov 14 2007, 9:18am

Post #4 of 59 (1078 views)
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rhubarb, rhubarb, rhubarb [In reply to] Can't Post

I can just imagine the muttering in the background. Surely they would have to have some speaking while in Bag End though?

But yes, dispense with the singing Elves, or have them doing it ethereally from the trees in the distance. One or two merry quips would surely get the idea across.

I quite like cheese, you know.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 10:58am

Post #5 of 59 (1017 views)
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*hand shoots up* Right here! dwarf wannabee ;) // [In reply to] Can't Post

 



sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists

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kareniel
Lorien

Nov 14 2007, 12:08pm

Post #6 of 59 (1080 views)
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All thirteen, please. [In reply to] Can't Post

Bag End must be packed with dwarves at the beginning of the story so Bilbo will be harried and disgruntled about having to cook for and serve all of them. The fact that he is overwhelmed by their noisy barging in and insistance on staying for meals makes his choice to go with them more interesting. It provides a little dramatic tension in the exposition. Yes, definitely thirteen.

I think singing elves could be a wonderful element of the film if Howard Shore composed the music for them. Of course, I adore the elves, and I believe they are capable of anything, so I might be a little prejudiced in their favor. Evil


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Nov 14 2007, 1:25pm

Post #7 of 59 (1027 views)
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13, or none! [In reply to] Can't Post

How can Bilbo be the "lucky number" if there aren't 13 Dwarves?

Hmm...Fili, Kili, Oin, Gloin, Ori, Nori, Dori, Balin, Dwalin, Bifur, Bofur, Bombur, Thorin. Of all those names, I have a least favorite: Oin always makes me think of a pig, I think it's because my mind tends to put a "k" on the end of his name! I like the sound of the name "Dori" best.

They can't really leave out any chapters, each one builds on the one before it! But I can see them leaving out Beorn; although they'd have to rewrite an important part of the battle scene.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"I desired dragons with a profound desire"

"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915


GaladrielTX
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 1:39pm

Post #8 of 59 (1022 views)
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I agree about the singing Elves. [In reply to] Can't Post

Singing munchkins worked in The Wizard of Oz, and it's one of the most beloved movies ever. It really all depends on if you want a children's story or a (pre-)continuation of LOTR. I would like The Hobbit as I originally experienced it as a child. Some Elves are merry, like the ones that greet the travelers at Rivendell; and some are serious, like the Elvenking or like Elrond when he reads the map and sighs for the loss of Gondolin. In LOTR, we mostly see the lordly elves (Elrond, Legolas, Galadriel), whereas, in The Hobbit, we meet a few of the less lofty ones (and in less troubled times). A lighter Hobbit might make the time of LOTR even more perilous, by contrast.

~~~~~~~~

Formerly known as GaladrielTX


Morwen
Rohan


Nov 14 2007, 1:47pm

Post #9 of 59 (1067 views)
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I hope they don't leave out a single dwarf [In reply to] Can't Post

And it would be nice if each dwarf spoke at least once. As far as parts of the story, I hate thinking of leaving anything out although I know that usually has to happen. I just hope they don't leave the Arkenstone out, as happened in the Rankin-Bass version. I'll be disappoined if Beorn goes missing, but I understand that that may have to be done for pacing.



Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you; you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 3:29pm

Post #10 of 59 (1053 views)
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There must be 13 dwarves... and that's flat! [In reply to] Can't Post

Part of Bilbo's identity is being the "lucky number" breaking the unlucky number of 13. It's something he even brings up with Smaug. The number of dwarves piling into Bag End, showing up one or several at a time (and again with Beorn) is so comical. And the image of them blundering through the forest and dangling from the trees after being captured by the spiders is also an iconic moment; and quite a feat for the hobbit to free them all.

I think keeping the dwarves as active as they are in the book (in terms of speaking, activity, etc.) is just fine. I find myself enjoying Balin the most, and he remains a friend of Bilbo's years later. He caught my attention when he cheered, "Bravo" when Bilbo came running to the Inn to join them. He always seemed to appreciate Bilbo and was there first when most needed; though Bilbo did rather mess with him when he was lookout and Bilbo slipped past him.

The Hobbit is a short story, and I don't see the need to cut anything. Even the part with Beorn can be covered in 15 minutes, and the Company needs a refuge as they pass from one danger to the next as the Fellowship did in Rivendell and Lothlorien.

Wouldn't it be a hoot if our original Fellowship members were disguised as 8 of the background dwarves? *wink* Too distracting and probably not logical, but it IS a fantasy afterall ;)



sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists

My DragonCon 07 Report


NoseOfSauron
Bree


Nov 14 2007, 3:58pm

Post #11 of 59 (1035 views)
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Leggy and Gimli [In reply to] Can't Post

I want to catch a few glimpes of good ol' Gimli and Leggy in the film :) let's see Legolas use his infamous fighting skills at the Battle of Five Armies.

And there HAS to be thirteen dwarves. Period.

I can see Beorn, the Giants, and the Elven Fires in Mirkwood being cut.

Looking from atop his great tower, he could see across the sea to the land of Middle-Earth. The sundering sea could not sunder his vision. From afar, he spoke with the mortals of the distant land. From across the sea, he stirred the fire of battle and kindled the candle of hope in the hearts of all who fought the shadow. From atop his great tower in Valinor, Manwe spoke the words to Cirdan...

"My name... is Gandalf the Grey."


JRandomRohirrim
Rohan


Nov 14 2007, 4:06pm

Post #12 of 59 (1019 views)
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I think you could have fewer than 13 dwarves [In reply to] Can't Post

Sorry, I'm just not a purist. I thought there were too many in The Hobbit. Maybe 13 visit Hobbiton, but not all of them go on the journey.


Hey, it looks like I may be able to kill the the boycottnewline.com domain in the not-too-distant future!


Morwen
Rohan


Nov 14 2007, 4:21pm

Post #13 of 59 (1029 views)
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I had forgotten the stone giants. [In reply to] Can't Post

I suppose they could cut them, although I hope they don't. They're very cool but not essential to the story.



Others dwelt here before hobbits were; and others will dwell here again when hobbits are no more. The wide world is all about you; you can fence yourselves in, but you cannot for ever fence it out.


Idril Celebrindal
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 4:23pm

Post #14 of 59 (1018 views)
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Those singing Elves! [In reply to] Can't Post

Depending on how it's handled, this sequence could be lovely or totally goofy.

I wonder if the silly Elf songs would sound better if they were sung in Sindarin? Hmmm ... anyone care to take a crack at translating "Tra-la-la-lally, way down in the valley"?

(I think it might be something along the lines of "Tra-la-la-lalad, vi Imladris dad," but I'm no Sindarin expert.)

With caffeine, all things are possible.

The pity of Bilbo will screw up the fate of many.

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Idril Celebrindal
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 4:31pm

Post #15 of 59 (1066 views)
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Can't skip Beorn ... [In reply to] Can't Post

He feeds and re-equips Gandalf, the Dwarves and Bilbo after they've lost everything in their escape from Goblin-town. With him gone, how do they prepare for the next phase of their journey?

But yes, the anomalous stone giants and extended elf feasting scenes could easily be cut. I'm sure some of the parts where the Dwarves hang out in Laketown and the skirts of the Lonely Mountain would be highly compressed, too, while others would be expanded in a film treatment. Bard, for instance, would probably have a bigger role on film than he does in the book -- the hero who kills Smaug would need to be introduced more explicitly in a movie. (Kind of like how PJ expanded Boromir's role.)

With caffeine, all things are possible.

The pity of Bilbo will screw up the fate of many.

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sherlock
Gondor


Nov 14 2007, 5:17pm

Post #16 of 59 (1030 views)
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I hope they don't cut Beorn. [In reply to] Can't Post

I've decided Clive Owen would be perfect in that role.


sherlock
Gondor


Nov 14 2007, 5:29pm

Post #17 of 59 (1046 views)
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I don't think anything need to be cut. [In reply to] Can't Post

It's a short enough story to fit in one movie and each chapter is almost a complete story by itself. I agree with others that certain parts should be shortened and others expanded but my main concern is the silly dwarf problem we had with LOTR. One silly dwarf was bad enough but thirteen?Evil


Curious
Half-elven


Nov 14 2007, 6:51pm

Post #18 of 59 (1097 views)
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The dwarves are like the Keystone Cops. All thirteen must be cast, but [In reply to] Can't Post

only a few have distinct personalities and speaking lines. As a book purist, I would stick close to the book. But I must admit that The Hobbit is not as holy to me as LotR, so I may be okay with some changes. In particular, I wonder if they will somehow work some women into the story (other than the spiders).


GaladrielTX
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 7:04pm

Post #19 of 59 (1058 views)
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The thing about the Dwarves as Tolkien wrote them that's funny [In reply to] Can't Post

is that they are so dignified but end up in ridiculous situations (falling on Bilbo's mat; having sacks pulled over them by the Trolls; trickling in, two at a time, at Beorn's home; and dangling from spiderwebs in Mirkwood). I hope this is how The Hobbit movie will approach them, with a sense of their helplessness in the face of the absurd, not with drunken antics like Jackson inflicted on poor Gimli.

~~~~~~~~

Formerly known as GaladrielTX


Patty
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 7:06pm

Post #20 of 59 (1028 views)
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Female extra elves in Rivendell? [In reply to] Can't Post

Chatty old women in Laketown?

For Gondor!


Idril Celebrindal
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 7:09pm

Post #21 of 59 (1036 views)
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Don't forget Lobelia and the spoons! [In reply to] Can't Post

Bilbo's mysteriously missing spoons is one of the things that always amused me about the ending of The Hobbit.

With caffeine, all things are possible.

The pity of Bilbo will screw up the fate of many.

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Patty
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 7:49pm

Post #22 of 59 (1014 views)
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I would love... [In reply to] Can't Post

to see more of Lobelia. That was one of my biggest joys when the Fellowship EE came out.

For Gondor!


L. Ron Halfelven
Grey Havens


Nov 14 2007, 7:50pm

Post #23 of 59 (986 views)
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"I'm just 'Dwarf Number Six.' I'm expendable."/ [In reply to] Can't Post

 




Darkstone
Immortal


Nov 14 2007, 7:53pm

Post #24 of 59 (1102 views)
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Deep Roy as the Dwarves [In reply to] Can't Post

Like he played all the Oompa Loompas in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory (2005).

******************************************
The audacious proposal stirred his heart. And the stirring became a song, and it mingled with the songs of Gil-galad and Celebrian, and with those of Feanor and Fingon. The song-weaving created a larger song, and then another, until suddenly it was as if a long forgotten memory woke and for one breathtaking moment the Music of the Ainur revealed itself in all glory. He opened his lips to sing and share this song. Then he realized that the others would not understand. Not even Mithrandir given his current state of mind. So he smiled and simply said "A diversion.



deej
Tol Eressea


Nov 14 2007, 8:51pm

Post #25 of 59 (1037 views)
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The director can put them all in red shirts. [In reply to] Can't Post

Nothing says 'geeky' like a Star Trek reference!

Sincerely, deej - The Artist Formerly Known as djdeathskiss

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