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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Lord of the Rings:
SCOD: "Fingers would remember their own strength better, if they grasped your sword"

Radagast-Aiwendil
Gondor


Nov 23 2012, 10:00am

Post #1 of 6 (532 views)
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SCOD: "Fingers would remember their own strength better, if they grasped your sword" Can't Post

http://www.framecaplib.com/...ages/ttt/ttt0574.htm

Sorry about the lateness of this SCOD, has been a busy week.
The second of this week's SCODs is, for me, probably the most iconic moment in the entire TTT film. Here are a few questions about it (answer any, none or all of them):

1. How did you feel when you first saw this moment in the film? How does the soundtrack heighten your emotions here?

2. How do you feel about the differences between Theoden's two appearances? Do you think that movie Theoden looked too young?

3. How did this moment in the film shape your perception of Rohan/Theoden in general?

4. What can you see on Theoden's face in this shot? Triumph? A regained sense of identity? Realisation of what has happened to him/what Wormtongue has been up to?

5. Any other thoughts/comments?

"Radagast is, of course, a worthy wizard, a master of shapes and changes of hue, and he has much lore of herbs and beasts, and birds are especially his friends."-Gandalf, The Lord of the Rings.

(This post was edited by Radagast-Aiwendil on Nov 23 2012, 10:02am)


zarabia
Tol Eressea


Nov 25 2012, 7:28am

Post #2 of 6 (223 views)
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Another iconic moment [In reply to] Can't Post

1. How did you feel when you first saw this moment in the film? How does the soundtrack heighten your emotions here?

I loved the focus on his hand extracting the sword; hearing the slight scraping, then the "ping" when it finally gets clear of its scabbard. The music was, as always IMO, wonderful, but it was the work of those unsung heroes, the sounds effects artists (Foley artists?), who made this scene. And it didn't hurt that the sword itself was so impressive.


2. How do you feel about the differences between Theoden's two appearances? Do you think that movie Theoden looked too young?

I don't think he looked too young in the "after picture", I felt he was too zombie-like in the "before". When I read the book - I mentioned this before in another thread, so sorry for repeating - I felt that Theoden's incapacity was more the result of succumbing to Wormtongue's constant stream of poisonous words. Wormtongue had told him he was old and incapable for so long, Theoden had come to believe it. In the book, to my mind anyway, it was more a matter of psychology rather than magic that aged Theoden. Gandalf was the only one with the authority to snap him out of his delusion. I was surprised by the more obvious use of magic in the film.

3. How did this moment in the film shape your perception of Rohan/Theoden in general?

My perception of Rohan was pretty much already set. As for Theoden, I don't remember thinking anything in particular about his character from this moment. I just felt he was immediately likable and admirable. That just comes naturally from Bernard Hill.

4. What can you see on Theoden's face in this shot? Triumph? A regained sense of identity? Realisation of what has happened to him/what Wormtongue has been up to?

He seems to have just regained consciousness and is registering what has been happening. The sword has nudged memories and realizations into place. (Also, he looks a bit cross eyed. I guess that's natural as he is looking at something up close, but it's a bit distracting.)

5. Any other thoughts/comments?


I'm surprised more people haven't commented. Many have said how much they loved this scene, and especially Theoden's sword. Maybe Thanksgiving here in the U.S. has slowed participation,

Thanks, Radagast-Aiwendil Smile

"The question isn't where, Constable, but when." - Inspector Spacetime


FlyingSerkis
Rivendell

Nov 25 2012, 2:16pm

Post #3 of 6 (247 views)
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That is so true [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I loved the focus on his hand extracting the sword; hearing the slight scraping, then the "ping" when it finally gets clear of its scabbard. The music was, as always IMO, wonderful, but it was the work of those unsung heroes, the sounds effects artists (Foley artists?), who made this scene. And it didn't hurt that the sword itself was so impressive.


And it is testament to those unsung heroes that I never ever think about them - I just believe that the sounds are coming straight from the action! Thanks for pointing it out Smile


Elberbeth
Tol Eressea


Nov 26 2012, 4:22pm

Post #4 of 6 (294 views)
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I also really like the way the camera pans around him [In reply to] Can't Post

as you see the awareness come back to him.

"There are some things that it is better to begin than to refuse, even though the end may be dark."


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Nov 29 2012, 1:14am

Post #5 of 6 (105 views)
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hehe, I'm trauling through these pretty late ;) [In reply to] Can't Post

1. How did you feel when you first saw this moment in the film? How does the soundtrack heighten your emotions here?

I loved it a lot. Brilliant. And to see that glorious sword, WOW. As for the soundtrack, *checks on youtube*...... yes, great triumph in it, deep horns at first, then joined by the evocative Rohan Violin theme. It gives a great aura of culture and history, and for Thťoden, kingliness.

2. How do you feel about the differences between Theoden's two appearances? Do you think that movie Theoden looked too young?

I think it was perfect, nothing more to say tbh.

3. How did this moment in the film shape your perception of Rohan/Theoden in general?

Greatly helped shape it. Until that point, we still had little of the true essence of Rohan to go on. To feel the honour, dignity and passion of the Rohirrim here was crucial to later perception of the people.

4. What can you see on Theoden's face in this shot? Triumph? A regained sense of identity? Realisation of what has happened to him/what Wormtongue has been up to?

To me, it looks like one gigantic shock. He's just come out of sheer darkness and sees reality once more, and sees that in the sword in from of him; perfect expression IMO.

5. Any other thoughts/comments?

apart from thanks Radagast! :)


--I'm a victim of Bifurcation--
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weaver
Half-elven


Nov 29 2012, 1:44am

Post #6 of 6 (249 views)
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Theoden and his sword... [In reply to] Can't Post

I like Theoden's look here -- I see echoes of it in Eowyn's later shots when she first pulls out that sword to do a little practicing as they pack up to head out to Helm's Deep.

I think they used the swords very effectively on a metaphorical and symbolic level, as well as props -- Theoden's reintroduction to his sword is a visible way to show what's going on inside of him, as he comes out of the fog he's been in and starts to reconnect with his "old strength". Same with Eown, though in her case, it's more like she's attaching her dreams and desires to have some power over her life to something outside herself, to the world of fighting, and then to Aragorn.

I never much cared for Book Theoden; I found the film's version to be a lot more relate-able!

Weaver


 
 

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