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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Music still being recorded!

tolktolk
Lorien

Nov 11 2012, 1:24am

Post #1 of 19 (1282 views)
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Music still being recorded! Can't Post

London Voices are still recording music for The Hobbit at Abbey Road Studios - as they say themselves, at the last minute!

[https://twitter.com/LDNVoices]


Magpie
Immortal


Nov 11 2012, 1:30am

Post #2 of 19 (716 views)
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some direct links [In reply to] Can't Post

https://twitter.com/...s/267257608493232128
https://twitter.com/...s/267410327610732545

thanks for the heads up. :-)

(tolktolk - I'm not sure if you were trying to make your link clickable. If you were and want help, just ask)


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Tim
Tol Eressea


Nov 11 2012, 1:34am

Post #3 of 19 (681 views)
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This is awesome [In reply to] Can't Post

Just like PJ pushing things down to the wire so he can get it all as perfect as he feels he can manage.

Smile

-Tim came by. Tim! If you had heard only a quarter of what I have heard about him, and I have only heard very little of all there is to hear, you would be prepared for any sort of remarkable tale.


tolktolk
Lorien

Nov 11 2012, 1:40am

Post #4 of 19 (634 views)
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Duh! [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes I was Magpie, I am being a real dunce about this - sorry!


Ring-Bearer
Rivendell


Nov 11 2012, 1:41am

Post #5 of 19 (649 views)
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There's something comforting in knowing [In reply to] Can't Post

That when you think that you know every blessed note of Howard's creation, he is treating us to more astonishing beauty.
It's like finding an extra box of chocolates in the cupboard.

'What are we holding on to, Sam?'
'There's good in this world, Mr. Frodo, and it's worth fighting for!'


'I can't carry it for you, but I can carry you!'



Magpie
Immortal


Nov 11 2012, 1:43am

Post #6 of 19 (704 views)
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Well, I can quote from this Shore interview again [In reply to] Can't Post

Howard Shore
Interviewed by David Garland
on the WNYC radio program: Spinning on Air
Friday, February 6, 2004



Quote
HS: You know, at first [scoring the LOTR movies] seemed daunting. But as you wrote your way into it and started to create music into it, it became more and more interesting actually. And the complexity of it became even more and more interesting. And at some point, Iím sure there were loved ones saying, ďMaybe we should take Howard away from Tolkien for a little while (DG and HS laugh) because heís seems a little obsessed by it.Ē But that was the kind of a joy of it.

DG: You felt obsessed in a personal way, not just professional?

HS: Oh yes, you became absorbed and obsessed by creating it and itís all you really wanted to do. And of course living in Middle-earth is not a bad place to live. I mean, it was with great friends and great trusts that you were there. You had great support from the people creating the film and credit should be given to NewLine and the music department at NewLine for allowing us to create the movie in as great a way as we could. And allowed us the resources to record with a 200 piece orchestra when we needed to. So, you had the great musicians of the world, [..list of solo artists...] you could choose the great artist you wanted to work with. You had an amazingly great orchestra, great technical team and an amazing movie to work on. For a composer to write music to Lord of the Rings is everything you imagined the greatness of movies is. Nothing could be finer than to write to that imagery and those ideas. And so you had all this wonderful thing to work with and you wanted to take advantage of that. And so, I think the stamina part came in because of the need for the perfection and the need to create it as good as you could. There were many times when we would create something, Peter and I... and we would look at it and we knew we could do it better so we would try to do it better.

DG: Really?

HS: Oh yes. Peter says the movie is finished only when they take it away. The movieís never finished.

DG: Hmm.

HS: Thereís just a point when they take it away, meaning that there has to be an end. You know, the studio says, ďIt must stop now. You know, you must stop working on this.Ē And thatís the way we all feel. There is that sort of delivery date, that goal, that moment when they say, ďIt must stop.Ē But you work so full on, and so completely dedicated to it to create it... because you also know youíre not going there... you know, you are creating this moment, say, of the Destruction of the Ring or describing the world of Lothlůrien that people have read about for 50 years. And you want to make sure that your imagery of those worlds is as true and as real and as well crafted as you could possibly do it.


More on this interview here: http://www.amagpiesnest.com/.../radio_interview.htm


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Magpie
Immortal


Nov 11 2012, 1:45am

Post #7 of 19 (602 views)
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Are you using advanced editor or basic [In reply to] Can't Post

are you using advanced editor (with buttons along a top tool bar) or basic editor (with no button along the top but some along the bottom)?

Instructions are different for each type.


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Tim
Tol Eressea


Nov 11 2012, 1:49am

Post #8 of 19 (595 views)
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Well worth quoting [In reply to] Can't Post

I love the enthusiasm and talent Howard Shore brings to these movies. It's like he's found a true passion for this project and that's really exciting.

-Tim came by. Tim! If you had heard only a quarter of what I have heard about him, and I have only heard very little of all there is to hear, you would be prepared for any sort of remarkable tale.


Magpie
Immortal


Nov 11 2012, 1:53am

Post #9 of 19 (599 views)
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I love the inflection in his voice so much in this section of the interview... [In reply to] Can't Post

... that I provided audio clips of a few snippets. They really move me and, being an obsessive perfectionist, I feel some kinship to Tolkien, Jackson, and Shore when they speak about their need to get it right.

Jackson just had people demanding he hand over the product - perfect in his eyes or not - where as Tolkien didn't.


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Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Nov 11 2012, 2:50am

Post #10 of 19 (579 views)
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w o w, sooo late to be doing that!!! ... ... definitely not for the next film lol? [In reply to] Can't Post

Tongue

--I'm a victim of Bifurcation--
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Tim
Tol Eressea


Nov 11 2012, 4:20am

Post #11 of 19 (498 views)
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Yes those were good points to catch that inflection [In reply to] Can't Post

Good point about Tolkien.

-Tim came by. Tim! If you had heard only a quarter of what I have heard about him, and I have only heard very little of all there is to hear, you would be prepared for any sort of remarkable tale.


DanielLB
Immortal


Nov 11 2012, 8:58am

Post #12 of 19 (432 views)
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Not surprised [In reply to] Can't Post

The film won't be finished until a few days before the premiere. It's going to be a stressful month for all involved.

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Crunchable Birdses
Rohan


Nov 11 2012, 9:27am

Post #13 of 19 (449 views)
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Unsurprising given the trilogy change... [In reply to] Can't Post

This is not at all a surprise considering the 11th hour decision to turn it into a trilogy no doubt completely butchered Howard Shore's original treatment of the film 1 score.

Think about it, before the trilogy change, Shore would have had brand new themes for Beorn, Mirkwood and Thranduil, to use in the final third of the film, and the overall arc of the music would have taken these themes into account. Now, with these major themes gone, there needs to be a lot of stuff redone, not to mention music for all the extra scenes that had to be upgraded from "Leave-for-the-EE" status to "Oh-sh#%-this-has-to-be-in-the-theatrical-now" status.

I'm not surpised Trailer 2 didn't have Howard Shore music, I can't imagine he's got even one second to spare on anything that's not essential to the actual movie.

* crunch *


sycorax82
Rohan

Nov 11 2012, 2:07pm

Post #14 of 19 (353 views)
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I would guess this is for the film's climax [In reply to] Can't Post

Moving the end of film 1 to an earlier point it probably needed a beefing up in the 'epicness' stakes, so they're doing some extra recording.

Either that or a sequence that wasn't in the movie until VERY recently had to be scored, pretty sharpish! We have heard of the running time changing, right?


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Nov 11 2012, 5:43pm

Post #15 of 19 (299 views)
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I really hope that there isn't a significant amount of material missing from the score [In reply to] Can't Post

for which we'll have to wait years for release, ALA the LotR recordings. I doubt it (the recent soundtrack info makes it seem pretty complete), but the new material being recorded probably won't be on the soundtrack.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2012, 1:03am

Post #16 of 19 (250 views)
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Oh yeah! Good point!! :s :s.... .... luckily the decision was made just before they had started recording right? ? .. [In reply to] Can't Post

... gave Shore at least some time to re-look and stuff like that

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Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!
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DanielLB
Immortal


Nov 12 2012, 8:42am

Post #17 of 19 (185 views)
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How much pre-preparation is involved? [In reply to] Can't Post

A slightly ignorant question, but does it really make a difference to Shore whether the film series comprised of 2 or 3 films?

Surely he can't do too much pre-preparation without the film anyway?

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Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Nov 12 2012, 2:28pm

Post #18 of 19 (167 views)
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I don't know too much on this myself, but I'm pretty sure he can and did do quite a bit of prep... [In reply to] Can't Post

.. He could experiment and come up with themes, motif etc. well before seeing anything
Seeing stuff is of course vital though . . .
but I dunno lol

--I'm a victim of Bifurcation--
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Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!
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Magpie
Immortal


Nov 12 2012, 4:29pm

Post #19 of 19 (161 views)
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The creative process is interesting... [In reply to] Can't Post

and surely different for everyone. I have done a lot of reading (and listening) to what Shore has said about his creative process for LOTR. And I've dabbled in it myself (Wink both personally and professionally)

Here's what I think, mostly informed by my own experiences but also a bit by what I've read about Shore's experience.

For large projects, one must find some sense of consistency over the whole thing. And within that consistency there needs to be room for different sorts of applications and needs.

It's almost impossible to achieve that if one just picks a place and starts. You really need to think about all the sorts of situations and applications that will arise. And you need to understand the project as a whole - the tone, the setting, the audience, the resources you have available, the time line, etc.

Some of this stuff might happen before you ever put pen to paper (or what ever initial 'start' action is involved in any creative endeavor). You think about it. You study. You talk to people... consult.

And then you might create concepts. A concept of what a book page might look like before you ever get any text (that's what lorem ipsum is for).

I think Howard does a lot of this pre-work. And I think some of it happens very early in the process. So, that is done. That work (which can be lengthy... especially if one is trying to judge it by how much actual product is achieved) doesn't have to be redone - or redone much - to fit three films rather than two.

(side note, sometimes I'll work on a new graphic concept for hours and then lose it because something happened with my computer and I had stupidly not saved my work. thankfully I've found that I can often get to the spot I was in before I lost the work in considerably less time... perhaps less than 15 minutes because most of what I spent those 2 and half hours on was developing a concept or playing with ideas and now that I know what I want, it's not that hard to get to it)

Howard speaks often about dream work. Here's one excerpt from an interview I referenced a few days ago:

Quote
...a lot of the composition itís done away from the film. A lot of... particularly with Davidís movies, I would watch the film as a spectator. I wanted to have that feeling that it was fresh and new and Iíd watch it for the first time and then Iíd put the film away and say, ďOkay, now... what do you feel about that? Express what you feel about that film.Ē And, as a writer, you could do that.

And Iím sure everybody whoís watched a film or has ideas about it and they can write them down or express them to a friend or do it verbally. You know, thereís some expression about what they felt when they watched the film.

Iím essentially doing the same thing except Iím expressing it in music. And I like to go through... that a very, very, important process. Thatís a very quiet process. Thatís putting it all away and in the case of a book, you want to absorb the book as much as you can. I mean, in Tolkien, I spent four or five months just reading and studying the books, studying ring mythology, studying influence of Tolkien.. you know, what may have influenced Tolkien. Professor Tolkien spent 14 years writing the Lord of the Rings, you know. What influences the book had after it was published in 1953.

I needed to know that stuff intellectually. And then I need to put it all away. And just think emotionally. Because music is an emotional language. Youíre saying to yourself, ďWell, what do you feel about that? What do you feel about Burroughsís book or Ballardís book or Tolkienís book? Whatís your expression of that in music?Ē

And then you go on this discovery. And that process a very quiet process, very introspective. Itís very dreamy. Because essentially youíre dealing with ideas. Itís a very internal process. And itís a creative process because anythingís possible. And youíre allowing your mind to kind of free associate. And frankly, thereís a lot of napping involved. (interviewer laughs) There is, because I like to use the nap as a source of intuitiveness. Because the nap places you into somewhat of a dream state. Right? Youíre kind of.. you know, a napping in the afternoon is somewhat a half awake kind of thing. Youíre not really soundly asleep, although I do get a good night sleep. But this allows you to go into a somewhat state of semi-consciousness and dream. And what Iím trying to do is put myself into that dream state so that I can get in touch with some feelings and ideas about what I feel about this piece.


I am positive (and I won't say certain because I'd need to hunt down a bunch of quote to assure myself and you that I had it right) that he wrote little suites of music to represent cultures or maybe concepts or situations before seeing any of the film. He drew from these to create the music and themes he would use later when the visuals and scenes came.

From the FOTR audio commentary:

Quote
The Shire theme was written quite early, I mean even after the visit to New Zealand the first time. And I think it was based more on the beauty of New Zealand. Cause Hobbiton is just so inherently... I just had a feel of New Zealand, of that rural beauty to it. And I wrote the Shire theme pretty early on and then related the Shire theme to Frodo.


Those quotes are from transcriptions on my website.

to read more:
http://www.filmscoremonthly.com/...nterview_Excerpt.asp
http://www.soundtrack.net/content/article/?id=89

So, that sort of work is likely done. At least in regards to what he knew would be in the project when it was two films.

That said, I'm sure it does make a difference that there are three films instead of two. How much and in what way, remains to be seen. Well hear about it (perhaps) in interviews he gives, in audio commentaries or features on the DVDs, in articles written on the web or in print (there was a whole issue of one magazine devoted to the score for LOTR), and in Doug's book The Music of The Hobbit Films.


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