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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Galadriel and The Battle Of Dol Guldur
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Oct 12 2012, 3:19pm

Post #1 of 44 (4933 views)
Galadriel and The Battle Of Dol Guldur Can't Post

Hi Everyone, long time lurker but first time poster so here we go...

I'm interested to hear any theories/ideas on Galadriels involvement in the Battle Of Dol Guldur. Phillipa Boyens back at Comic Con mentioned this when asked about female involvement in the movie -

Philippa Boyens: Galadriel, as you all know, is the most powerful being in Middle Earth, at the time. And we wanted to go in there and tell that story. We worked with Cate. We talked to her about the role. She did a phenomenal job. I was… I had my total geek-out moment when she stepped up. And, the battle of Dol Guldur. Let me just say that. It’s extraordinary. So she immediately brings a very powerful feminine energy into the film, and one of the reasons… It’s interesting that you did that, because we did feel the weight of it being a “boys’ own” story.

I wonder how they'll show Galadriel's power at Dol Guldur as in Appendix B it says "They took Dol Guldur, and Galadriel threw down its walls and laid bare its pits, and the forest was cleansed". But it's important to note that this passage is talking about the battle at the end of the third age and not the one that takes place in The Hobbit. Whether Peter Jackson decides to merge these two battles together is a possibility though.

Any thoughts/ suggestions?

Mr. Arkenstone (isaac)
Tol Eressea

Oct 12 2012, 3:37pm

Post #2 of 44 (3410 views)
Wellcome! [In reply to] Can't Post

Hi BornOutOfTheWest!

Wel my take is that what you putted about the cleansen of Dol Guldur at the end of the third age is gonna be used on The Hobbit, and the way is gona be shown I can´t stop think about Luthien throwing down the walls of Dol In Gauroth with some kind of spell, so, I imagine that Gandalf, Saruman and Elrond could do the dirty job and then let Galadriel finish the job with her power

I can not guarantee his safety - understood...
Nor will I be responsible for his fate - Doh!


Oct 12 2012, 3:42pm

Post #3 of 44 (3581 views)
I'd be happy for Galadriel to destroy Dol Guldur during The Hobbit [In reply to] Can't Post

Since this is our last return to Middle-earth, then I'd be happy for PJ to shuffle history a bit, and have Galadriel destroy Dol Guldur during the time of The Hobbit.

They never mentioned any of the events (the wars in the North) in the LOTR trilogy. I'd do anything to see Lady Galadriel bring it on.

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Oct 12 2012, 4:02pm

Post #4 of 44 (3370 views)
Me too [In reply to] Can't Post

It's one of the things I actually really look forward to seeing in one of these movies. I'd really like to see Galadriel in action, even if it means some creative interpretation of the timeline we know.


Oct 12 2012, 4:29pm

Post #5 of 44 (3467 views)
This line...still not digging it [In reply to] Can't Post

Galadriel, as you all know, is the most powerful being in Middle Earth, at the time.

As we all know?really?

Nevermind, probably she wanted to say ''...Galadriel, one of the most powerful beings...''
Oh, dear Philippa, forgive and forget Smile

So, Galadriel's part in dol guldur's battle will be prominent I see. Not bad, not bad at all! Cate's Galadriel is a true beaty to behold and judging from Philippa's passionate words about her part ,we should expect to see something no less than spectacular in this battle ( hopefully not something extreme though).

We may witness a more 'magic' battle, considering the full(?) presence of the white council's members but not ala harry potter style. The three rings will be there, so I wouldn't be surprised to see their owners use their powers in some way...

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost,
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.

The Shire

Oct 12 2012, 4:49pm

Post #6 of 44 (3259 views)
Same here // [In reply to] Can't Post


"The sun will go on rising and setting, whether I fail Geometry or not."


Oct 12 2012, 4:50pm

Post #7 of 44 (3376 views)
It may have just been a blip in Boyens' memory [In reply to] Can't Post

We can't expect her to be correct all of the time. Temporary brain fart? Wink

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 12 2012, 4:50pm)


Oct 12 2012, 5:28pm

Post #8 of 44 (3308 views)
Indeed, she's excused [In reply to] Can't Post

The hobbit speculation was on it's peak at that time during comic-con, the press, the fans...and a geek like Philippa could not have been restrained Laugh .

All that is gold does not glitter,
Not all those who wander are lost,
The old that is strong does not wither,
Deep roots are not reached by the frost.


Oct 12 2012, 5:56pm

Post #9 of 44 (3372 views)
There is some mentioning in the movies [In reply to] Can't Post

In Reply To
They never mentioned any of the events (the wars in the North) in the LOTR trilogy. I'd do anything to see Lady Galadriel bring it on.

In a scene in RotK . . .

GIMLI: Horse men! I wish I could muster an army of Dwarves, fully armed and filthy.

LEGOLAS: Your kinsmen may have no need to ride to war. I fear war already marches on their own lands.

There may be one or two more subtle mentions but this is the only one I can think of off the top of my head.

EDIT: On a side note, this quote from Gimli always makes me excited for the Battle of the Five Armies . . . Wink

Don't be hasty.

(This post was edited by Beren0nehanded on Oct 12 2012, 5:59pm)


Oct 12 2012, 6:17pm

Post #10 of 44 (3233 views)
I wanted more though! [In reply to] Can't Post

It's a shame they didn't expand on Legolas' comment. Well worth more of a mention. The War of the Ring wasn't *just* about the Fellowship.

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Oct 12 2012, 6:23pm

Post #11 of 44 (3207 views)
Agreed! [In reply to] Can't Post

So much material!

But like you said, since this is the last we'll see of ME on the big screen, I too wouldn't mind Galadriel doing what she does to Dol Guldur at the end of the War of the Ring this time around in the movies even if it is off chronologically!

Don't be hasty.


Oct 12 2012, 7:35pm

Post #12 of 44 (3243 views)
I wouldn't assume that the Hobbit Trilogy (spoilers) - [In reply to] Can't Post

- is the last we'll see of Middle-Earth. Middle-Earth is quite the money-maker.

Depending on how well the 'invented' parts of the Hobbit Trilogy (Dol Guldur, White Council, etc ) are received by audiences, they just may decide to do a War in the North movie (or two).

Quite a few characters in the Hobbit (including those only in the movie version) survive until time of the War of the Ring. I would expect that a number of these characters will gain a certain amount of popularity, so the studios just may decide to jump at the chance to bring them back in a War of the Ring era film.

I would assume that a War in the North movie storyline would differ somewhat from what's written in the LOTR Appendices.

Returning characters could include:

- Thranduil.

- Celeborn.

- Galadriel.

- Dain Ironfoot.

- The surviving members of Thorin's company.

- Radagast.

- (Old) King Bain (as well as his son Brand. There could be a Bard II but film makers sometimes shy away from using characters with identical names.).

- Original Beorn (as opposed to his descendant Grimbeorn). Being a supernatural being, the shapeshifter could be assumed to have a longer lifespan than usual. (I've got this image of a grizzled old bear leading a group of others (most likely his descendants) in an ambush against Sauron's minions).

- Tauriel.

Obviously, in Tolkien's original writings, some of these characters are dead (and may actually be killed off in the movie Trilogy). But just as the opportunity was taken to bring back Galadriel, Legolas and Saruman, they could do the same with the Hobbit cast..

(Come to think of it, they can show the actual debut of the 'true' White Wizard. I wouldn't put it past Galadriel to send her Elves to retrieve Gandalf's corpse at some point, and all of a sudden, in the middle of some dramatic moment, he wakes up. That new staff of his looks quite Elven in design to me. Perhaps that's the Lady of Lórien's gift to the last member of the Fellowship of the Ring to visit her realm. That's something for 'The War in the North - Extended Edition', I think.).


(This post was edited by Hanzkaz on Oct 12 2012, 7:38pm)

Grey Havens

Oct 12 2012, 10:26pm

Post #13 of 44 (3129 views)
I think that there will be more as well, [In reply to] Can't Post

but I think it won't be Jackson directed!

Jackson may produce and maybe write some films, but he won't direct them, I am sure of this.

After The Hobbit, Jackson has two Tintin movies to direct and then the Dam Busters, and after that he got Bad Taste 2, and he probably has some more surprises (King Kong 2?)

Vocalist in the semi-progressive metal band Arctic Eclipse


Oct 12 2012, 11:23pm

Post #14 of 44 (3159 views)
Having our cake and eating it too... [In reply to] Can't Post

Who is to say that Galadriel can't destroy Dol Guldur in the timeframe of The Hobbit only to see the forces of Sauron rebuild it in time for the War of the Ring? A Noldo-woman's work is never done!

'Thus spake Ioreth, wise-woman of Gondor: The hands of the king are the hands of a healer, and so shall the rightful king be known.' - Gandalf the White

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Oct 12 2012, 11:24pm)

Tol Eressea

Oct 12 2012, 11:44pm

Post #15 of 44 (3167 views)
How to show the power of wizards and elves without making it look tacky? [In reply to] Can't Post

PJ himself said he doesn't like the flashy magic stuff. I'm really curious how they will portrait the Dol Guldur battle.

Tol Eressea

Oct 12 2012, 11:51pm

Post #16 of 44 (3146 views)
Replace these kung fu masters with Elrond, Galadriel and Gandalf [In reply to] Can't Post


(This post was edited by Carne on Oct 12 2012, 11:51pm)


Oct 13 2012, 5:38am

Post #17 of 44 (3085 views)
That's a good question [In reply to] Can't Post

If they do it (which I really, really hope they will) it'll be interesting to see how they do it. There is that risk of the magic looking tacky, but obviously Galadriel can't just start hacking at the walls with a sledge hammer either.

Maybe she'll just walk up to the gates and say: "Dol Guldur, your walls are broken." Wink


Oct 13 2012, 9:19am

Post #18 of 44 (3032 views)
tempting but no [In reply to] Can't Post

I could just about cope with compressing the two Battles of Dol Guldur (2941 and 3019) if the pay-off is seeing Galadriel the super-Noldo in action. What makes me hesitate though is what it means for the depiction of Sauron. In Middle-earth (including in Jackson's re-imagining of it), Sauron is the arch-villain / Dark Lord etc. Having the events of Dol Guldur in 2941 come across as a massive defeat, with Sauron in retreat (that bit did happen then) and his base for the last 1800 years destroyed undermines the 'Dark Lord' narrative. Sure, Sauron wasn't invincible (indeed, he was uniquely vulnerable) but if a film-goer is supposed to fear for the fate of Middle-earth in the LotR film trilogy then depicting Sauron in TH trilogy as a local wrangler down in Dol Guldur who can be crushed by the White Council has the potential to undercut that.

Welcome to the Mordorfone network, where we put the 'hai' back into Uruk


Oct 13 2012, 9:55am

Post #19 of 44 (3024 views)
That would work nicely [In reply to] Can't Post

And there might be an epilogue of sorts - leftovers from the bridge film. I might not necessarily like the idea, but the epilogue could cover these events. Though really, it deserves it's own film (or to have been shown/spoken of in ROTK).

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Oct 13 2012, 10:09am

Post #20 of 44 (3049 views)
I don't want flashy power magic either [In reply to] Can't Post

And it could probably be avoided quite easily.

Ignoring Galadriel for a second, Elrond and Gandalf would fight with their swords. We've seen them both do it in the trilogy, so there would be no need to have magic shooting out of their fingers and toes. I assume they will battle whoever's there - orcs, wargs, mewlips, wights, Bombadil and even possibly Ringwraiths.

Adding Galadriel into the battle is a bit of an unknown. She could fight with a sword, but I can't see it happening. I don't know about you, but when I think of Lady Galadriel at Dol Guldur, this image comes into my head.

So, while Elrond and Gandalf are giving it all they've got, Galadriel could enter Dol Guldur, conjure up some spell (perhaps right in front of the Necromancer), cleansing it? The Necromancer flees, and Galadriel plants an Elanor flower?

Something like that?

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Oct 13 2012, 4:34pm

Post #21 of 44 (2941 views)
And yet PJ did show a cheesy fireball [In reply to] Can't Post

..in ROTK EE. It really is mindboggling why he would show the leader of the Istari shooting a third grade non-AoE D&D fireball at the wizard who not only wears the Great Ring of Fire, but also has fire as one of his specialties, next to lightning. It really ruins a great scene. I seriously hope that side of PJ will not resurface in the Hobbit movies.. he did pretty well otherwise, showing restraint in showing cheap magic spells.

"The past tempts us, the present confuses us, and the future frightens us. And our lives slip away, moment by moment, lost in that terrible in-between."

Grey Havens

Oct 13 2012, 11:09pm

Post #22 of 44 (2867 views)
I agree... [In reply to] Can't Post

And it [flashy power magic] could probably be avoided quite easily.

It could be avoided easily, I agree. But I think they hired Peter Jackson, so subtle is out Wink

Galadriel will further her connection to the Dwarrows by wielding the long lost magic dwarf-axe known in Westron as Blundersome (or in the Neo-dwarvish tongue krakaskul ortoo).

She will set some heads flying, and get a tattoo to mark the kills.

(This post was edited by Elthir on Oct 13 2012, 11:13pm)

Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 13 2012, 11:53pm

Post #23 of 44 (2825 views)
What was it [In reply to] Can't Post

About the depiction of magic in LOTR that prompts you to label it unsubtle?


Eye's on Guard

Oct 14 2012, 12:23am

Post #24 of 44 (2844 views)
The big question is........ [In reply to] Can't Post

whether or not we will see this!
Attachments: gandalfpinecones.jpg (38.6 KB)

Tol Eressea

Oct 14 2012, 3:50am

Post #25 of 44 (2812 views)
I really liked that fireball [In reply to] Can't Post


King Arthur: Who are you who can summon fire without flint or tinder?

Tim: There are some who call me... Tim?

King Arthur: You know much that is hidden oh Tim.

Tim: Quite.

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