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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Benedict Cumberbatch on The Necromancer
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Oleander Took
Rivendell


Oct 7 2012, 7:58pm

Post #1 of 66 (3829 views)
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Benedict Cumberbatch on The Necromancer Can't Post

Seems we can finally confirm that he will be both giving him his voice AND Mo-capping him.

Yesterday he had an interview at The 2012 Cheltenham Literature Festival about Sherlock and he talked briefly about several other works including The Hobbit.

According to Sherlockology's (main Sherlock fan website) report this is what he said:

"- First news that Benedict has performed motion capture for The Necromancer in The Hobbit trilogy - previously it was only stated that he was voicing the character.
This emerged from an expression of his frustration that most media outlets report that he is only providing the voice for Smaug the dragon in the films, whereas he will actually portray the entire physical onscreen performance for the gigantic creature through motion capture, which he performed during an intense couple of days of work in New Zealand earlier in the year."

Source http://www.sherlockology.com/...am-festival-07102012

This interview was recorded by Sky Arts, no airing date though

"There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something."


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 7 2012, 8:01pm

Post #2 of 66 (1595 views)
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What about Nathaniel Lees? [In reply to] Can't Post

Guess he's either out or plays another role.


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 7 2012, 8:03pm

Post #3 of 66 (1460 views)
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I thought it was common knowledge he was mo-capping Smaug? [In reply to] Can't Post

He said an interview a while back about slinking across the floor? I'll try and dig it up. Strange he got "frustrated".

Want Hobbit Movie News? Hobbit Headlines of the Week!



Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Oct 7 2012, 8:09pm

Post #4 of 66 (1438 views)
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It is among us, but media only mentions the voice acting part. [In reply to] Can't Post

"...Benedict Cumberbatch, who will voice Smaug the dragon in the Hobbit, a prequel to the Lord of the Rings trilogy..." etc etc. It annoys me too. Seems like Benny will have to fight for his full credit, just like Andy has had to.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


Faenoriel
Tol Eressea


Oct 7 2012, 8:10pm

Post #5 of 66 (1517 views)
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Perhaps they re-learned you can't separate the body and the voice? [In reply to] Can't Post

No sense to make two different actors act the same character, if it doesn't serve any story/artistic purpose.

But every word you say today
Gets twisted 'round some other way
And they'll hurt you if they think you've lied


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 7 2012, 8:13pm

Post #6 of 66 (1459 views)
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The media always mess up/fail to research properly ... [In reply to] Can't Post

I can see how it would get annoying. Frown

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Oleander Took
Rivendell


Oct 7 2012, 8:20pm

Post #7 of 66 (1372 views)
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Absolutely [In reply to] Can't Post

Just last week i saw a couple of articles where they had just learnt he was in The Hobbit. Just last week.... Hope he gets a proper promotion for DoS

"There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something."


jtarkey
Rohan

Oct 7 2012, 8:24pm

Post #8 of 66 (1392 views)
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Hmm... [In reply to] Can't Post

I still don't really understand why they would have him mo-cap Smaug. I understand the benefits of doing it if you're creating a creature with a human form (King Kong, Gollum). But a Dragon? How is that supposed to help make the dragon more realistic? I remember watching the special features on Jurassic Park, and they studied the ways birds and different animals move in order to get the dinosaurs right. Seemed to work pretty well.

I'm sure I'm just ignorant as to how this sort of thing works, I'm just interested to see how they'll do it. Will Smaug have four long and slender limbs like a person?


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 7 2012, 8:37pm

Post #9 of 66 (1380 views)
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I imagine a large part of the mo-capping is around the face [In reply to] Can't Post

They'll want to get the facial expressions spot on.

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Fardragon
Rohan

Oct 7 2012, 8:48pm

Post #10 of 66 (1367 views)
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Catch Dragonheart [In reply to] Can't Post

Now, that's so old, I don't think it was actually mo-capped, the animators just matched the CGI dragon to the actor's face. But that dragon is still physically recognisable as Sean Connnery.

A Far Dragon is the best kind...


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Oct 7 2012, 9:48pm

Post #11 of 66 (1243 views)
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We dubbed them "neekerbreekers" [In reply to] Can't Post

during the run-up to the LOTR films, because poorly-researched articles were everywhere. What do they do when they can't get Hobbit? Wink

Silverlode






Baggins Babe
Registered User

Oct 7 2012, 10:00pm

Post #12 of 66 (1273 views)
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There was a newspaper article last December.... [In reply to] Can't Post

....which said that Peter Jackson (and Ian McKellen) were so impressed with Benedict's audition tape that it was decided to do it as motion capture rather than just the voice. Apparently he had been studying snakes and komodo dragons at London Zoo and "....went a little reptile on it..."

I can't wait!

"It was said to me by Elrond Halfelven that I should find friendship upon the way, secret and unlooked for. To have found it turns evil to great good."

***************************************
I used to have a handle on life - but it fell off.


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 7 2012, 10:09pm

Post #13 of 66 (1269 views)
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Lees probably had the part until they got a better known actor... [In reply to] Can't Post

After cutting half of his performance as Ugluk from the theatrical edition (and wasn't he originally supposed to survive to be one of the Uruk-Hai fighting Eowyn in the glittering caves?), that would seem quite crappy if true.

I hope they've at least given him another role, which is possible given all the cast reshuffling.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!

(This post was edited by Captain Salt on Oct 7 2012, 10:10pm)


Elenorflower
Gondor


Oct 7 2012, 10:25pm

Post #14 of 66 (1227 views)
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first of all [In reply to] Can't Post

I think its weird that a human could mo-cap for a dragon, surely the movements are completely different? Last time I met a dragon he was not flapping about in a long overcoat with the collar turned up. and secondly Cumberbutch gives his snippy soundbites to the press about how much he hasnt a cluuuuuuuue whats going on, and now he is all of a sudden 'frustrated' when they dont get their facts straight. hmmmmmm! poor luvvy.


Lieutenant of Dol Guldur
Gondor


Oct 7 2012, 10:30pm

Post #15 of 66 (1304 views)
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Sauron in a physical form? [In reply to] Can't Post

If "Benedict has performed motion capture for The Necromancer in The Hobbit trilogy"... and it seems to be that way, we will see a kind of physical appearance of Sauron in The Hobbit. That meens he'll be there "in person" not just a spirit without a body. We'll not just hear his voice, we actually will see him and that makes it interesting. Great news!!

I also think it is kind of strange that Smaug and Sauron are played and voiced by the same guy. I love Benedict! He's a great actor and has a great voice, and sure he got the parts because of his voice BUT Smaug and Sauron won't have the same voice what means, that either Saurons or Smaugs voice by Cumberbatch will be highly changed. Question: Why didn't they just took another actor? Or are they going to have a similar voice and that's why one actor plays both parts? Or is Sauron going to speak with Smaugs voice to frighten/unsettle his enemies?


"There is only one Lord of the Ring, only one who can bend it to his will. And he does not share power."


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 7 2012, 10:35pm

Post #16 of 66 (1274 views)
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Visible isn't necessarily physical [In reply to] Can't Post

It may be worth making the point.

I'm not sure the fact he is voicing two characters tells us any more than that.

LR


Elenorflower
Gondor


Oct 7 2012, 10:40pm

Post #17 of 66 (1210 views)
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if its not physical [In reply to] Can't Post

it wont be visible. if its visible it has to be physical or its just spooky. Crazy


stoutfiles
Rohan

Oct 7 2012, 10:52pm

Post #18 of 66 (1193 views)
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John Rhys-Davies voiced Gimli and Treebeard [In reply to] Can't Post

And it was fine. I'm pretty critical about some things I've seen so far, but the voice acting is the least of my concerns. The Necromancer and Smaug will not sound the same, they will make alterations.


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 7 2012, 10:59pm

Post #19 of 66 (1175 views)
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Not sure I follow [In reply to] Can't Post

Why does visible have to be "physical" (in the sense of possessing a physical body)?

There are several of Tolkien's characters who would not conform to this idea, at least in their trilogy film portrayals (Nazgul - both in the shadow world and ME, Sauron, Army of the Dead)

LR


Oleander Took
Rivendell


Oct 7 2012, 11:27pm

Post #20 of 66 (1271 views)
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Updated Quote [In reply to] Can't Post

From http://www.benedictcumberbatch.co.uk/benedict-cumberbatch-and-louise-brealey-discuss-sherlock-at-cheltenham-literary-festival/

"On playing Smaug. Does it get really hot and sweaty in the motion capture suit?

It does, it does itís a brilliant thing to do. Motion Capture is the most ridiculously fun thing to do as an actor. Youíre utterly utterly free to do what you want as an actor especially as Iím a reptile and not a mammal and so there are things that arenít quite possible such as a tail and wings. It was such good fun. It was just as good fun as doing the voice.
What is so frustrating is some publicist who wanted to get my business in the US released this thing saying that I was voicing Smaug and itís followed me around everywhere. Iím doing the movements! I worked for two days solid doing the motion capture for those scenes and Iím voicing it as well. And I did the motion capture for the Necromancer as well."

"There is nothing like looking, if you want to find something."


EyeRock
Bree


Oct 7 2012, 11:34pm

Post #21 of 66 (1152 views)
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Fun fact [In reply to] Can't Post

The banshees in avatar (also done by weta) were motion-captured by Terry Notary; the Hobbit's movement choreographer.
They do not capture the motions of a tail, wings or an elongated neck which will be added and animated later on, but the weight, physical expression and energy of the actor serves as a base for the rest of the animation process and helps the animators giving soul to the final character or creature we see on screen.

The trained body of an actor is capable of extraordinary feats, and creatures that are motion-captured benefits greatly from the sense of gravity the performers give them.
WHile watching Rise of the Planet of the Apes it astounded me how the apes that were 100% key-frame animated looked so much faker than the ones played by actors.

I am maybe a bit biased as I have a huge passion for this use of technology and physical acting, but I have no doubt that a mo-capped Smaug will look ten times better than a fully animated one.


(This post was edited by EyeRock on Oct 7 2012, 11:38pm)


Elenorflower
Gondor


Oct 7 2012, 11:46pm

Post #22 of 66 (1161 views)
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I didnt mean physical as in [In reply to] Can't Post

having a body, but physically visible, even the Nazgul needed physical robes to take shape otherwise they were invisible.
Wink


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Oct 8 2012, 12:25am

Post #23 of 66 (1177 views)
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Nathaniel Lees voicing Necromancer? [In reply to] Can't Post

Cumberbatch isn't clear about whether he is acually voicing the Necromancer. Perhaps he is only doing motion capture for that role with Lees providing the Necromancer's voice.

'Thus spake Ioreth, wise-woman of Gondor: The hands of the king are the hands of a healer, and so shall the rightful king be known.' - Gandalf the White


Ziggy Stardust
Gondor


Oct 8 2012, 1:05am

Post #24 of 66 (1046 views)
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Perhaps [In reply to] Can't Post

it's because, despite them both being reptiles, dinosaurs and dragons are very different. It would make sense to study birds and animals for dinosaurs. But dragons are majestic, fantastic and glorious. To have the dragon mo-capped makes sense because he will move in a more glorious and, for want of a better word, graceful way, something dinosaurs don't do.


Ziggy Stardust
Gondor


Oct 8 2012, 1:09am

Post #25 of 66 (1078 views)
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I'm thinking [In reply to] Can't Post

they will probably use a vocoder to make the voices sounds different. Smaug might have a more rumbly sound, and the Necromancer might have a hissy and ethereal and eerie sound to the voice.

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