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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
New Yazneg information
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dave_lf
Gondor

Oct 6 2012, 7:30pm

Post #26 of 76 (5163 views)
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The wargs come from Dol Guldur [In reply to] Can't Post

I've been beating that drum for a long time, but now I think the matter is settled. Wink


triptrap
Lorien

Oct 6 2012, 7:33pm

Post #27 of 76 (5099 views)
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wood-man? [In reply to] Can't Post

taking a look at that picture http://www.tolkiendrim.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/10/Yazneg.jpg

he looks a lot like any regular orc to me


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 7:33pm

Post #28 of 76 (5149 views)
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It's quite a distance [In reply to] Can't Post

How would the message travel that they (the golbins) have captured the Dwarves, and then subsequently escaped?

And they chase the Company for killing the Great Goblin. Dol Guldur has nothing to do with it, really. Smile

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(This post was edited by DanielLB on Oct 6 2012, 7:34pm)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 7:36pm

Post #29 of 76 (5115 views)
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He could be [In reply to] Can't Post

Full man, full orc, half orc half man, mutant man, mutant orc etc. Wink

I only say "man" because of this picture. To me, he looks more man than orc.

Smile

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Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 6 2012, 7:42pm

Post #30 of 76 (5230 views)
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Azog and Fimbul come from Dol Guldur and ride Wargs... [In reply to] Can't Post

This seems possible to me. Perhaps both the Misty Mountain Goblins and Dol Guldur Orcs are present for Out of the Frying Pan...? However, it IS quite a distance for the Necro's Orcs to travel in a short span of time...unless they're already in the area?

Possible scenario: The Necro is made aware that Gandalf and a Company of Dwarves are passing through the Misty Mountains...he orders the Goblin King to capture them, and sends some Orcs from Dol Guldur to pick them up? After Thorin & Co. escape, they flee from the Goblins, only to run right into Azog's Orcs?

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!

(This post was edited by Captain Salt on Oct 6 2012, 7:47pm)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 7:45pm

Post #31 of 76 (5303 views)
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We know that most of them come from Goblintown [In reply to] Can't Post

Assuming these are Wargs, I can't tell Wink

Screencap

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Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 6 2012, 7:50pm

Post #32 of 76 (5129 views)
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They LOOK to me like a tide of Goblins and Wargs...some appear to be bipedal [In reply to] Can't Post

Quite an evocative image, in any case. Wink

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 6 2012, 7:52pm

Post #33 of 76 (5262 views)
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Fimbul description: [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
The exceedingly cruel orc Fimbul is one of Azog’s master hunters. He commands a horde of warg riders who trace their victims in the saddle of their gigantic wolf beasts. Fimbul has taken up the scent of Thorin Oakenshield & Co. and will catch the dwarves before they reach the Lonely Mountain.


So yes, the wargs most likely come from Dol Guldur.


burgahobbit
Rohan


Oct 6 2012, 8:12pm

Post #34 of 76 (5171 views)
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A lego man wearing purple in Goblin town (possible spoilers) [In reply to] Can't Post

Is being held by the goblin king. He is no dwarf, for his legs are normal sized, whereas the dwarf legs are smaller. My prediction, (and it's kind of gross) is that the goblin king will, as the company is approaching him...eat this poor man whole...I'm serious.

After all in the books the Great Goblin was about to eat Thorin before Gandalf killed him wasn't he? This is going to be a completely horrific scene if it turns out to be true, but all grossness aside, where did this man come from? How did he come to the Great Goblin? "There are no travelers in this land" to quote Faramir. A captive of one of the goblins' recent raids on the men? That would be my bet.


(This post was edited by burgahobbit on Oct 6 2012, 8:14pm)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 8:13pm

Post #35 of 76 (5102 views)
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This doesn't sound like they go to the clearing, to me? / [In reply to] Can't Post

 

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Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 6 2012, 8:20pm

Post #36 of 76 (5107 views)
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But hold on [In reply to] Can't Post

Yazneg isn't associated with anything. Azog and Fimbul aren't associated with Dol Guldur other than Azog's son works there and Gandalf wants to figure out the connection between Azog and DG.

Have I missed the step where Yazneg being in Out of the Fire implies forces from Dol Guldur there?

It might be just that but I'm not sure we can leap to that conclusion.

LR


Carne
Tol Eressea

Oct 6 2012, 8:27pm

Post #37 of 76 (5239 views)
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Found this picture of the dwarves and their lego doubles :) [In reply to] Can't Post

http://i46.tinypic.com/343p75k.png


(This post was edited by Carne on Oct 6 2012, 8:27pm)


burgahobbit
Rohan


Oct 6 2012, 8:29pm

Post #38 of 76 (5111 views)
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Oops! At first look I thought it was a man! [In reply to] Can't Post

Turns out his legs ARE short. Evil

Oh well! I'm glad I'm not right, that would have been disturbing...


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 6 2012, 8:31pm

Post #39 of 76 (5154 views)
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Surely they are multicoloured flaming pinecones, wouldn't you say? [In reply to] Can't Post

 


burgahobbit
Rohan


Oct 6 2012, 8:32pm

Post #40 of 76 (5047 views)
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That's not Thorin! [In reply to] Can't Post

Mad

But otherwise the picture is cool. Bifur is one of the best! Looks just like the real Bifur! Smile


Eye's on Guard
Lorien


Oct 6 2012, 8:43pm

Post #41 of 76 (5086 views)
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What if there are two races of wargs... [In reply to] Can't Post

...to justify why there is a third type in The Two Towers

Fimbul's warg looks very different from the other ones we've seen. I would like it if this were the case because the goblin-allied wargs need to be more independent (especially if they have their own language) than Dol Guldur bred wargs, who are ridden.

Pictures of the types below.
Attachments: TTwarg.jpg (9.70 KB)
  trailerwarg1.jpg (30.7 KB)
  trailerwarg2.jpg (42.9 KB)
  tshirtwargs.jpg (27.9 KB)
  fimbulwarg.jpg (46.1 KB)


DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 8:54pm

Post #42 of 76 (5017 views)
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That's what I thought, and hope. [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't want to jump the gun and be disappointed. Wink

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DanielLB
Immortal


Oct 6 2012, 9:13pm

Post #43 of 76 (5004 views)
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Looking at the picture Carne posted [In reply to] Can't Post

It looks like it is Ori being held by the Great Goblin. I wonder if this happens in the film.

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Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 6 2012, 9:30pm

Post #44 of 76 (5033 views)
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The connection between Azog and Dol Guldur/Bolg working there [In reply to] Can't Post

seems to imply that Azog works for Sauron as well (in addition to the speculation that he's been...necromanced). Fimbul is Azog's "master hunter", and Yazneg looks much more likely to be on the Necromancer's minions (ala Bolg and Fimbul, all three wearing armor made of bodily remains), than a Misty Mountain Goblin which have totally difference outfits, basically comprised of loincloths and straps over the upper torso. Hence, the working assumption (which I THINK is pretty widely-spread at this point) that Azog, Bolg, Fimbul, and Yazneg are all minions of Sauron and/or are based out of Dol Guldur.

Yes, obviously it is speculation, but it fits and we don't have anything else concerning these characters thus far.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 6 2012, 9:32pm

Post #45 of 76 (4959 views)
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I like the idea someone posted a little while back [In reply to] Can't Post

that the Wargs in LotR were hybrids, having been bred with some hyena-like animal from Far Harad, while the Wargs in TH are purebreds originating from Angband.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 6 2012, 9:45pm

Post #46 of 76 (4930 views)
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Hmmm I think there is a leap in there. [In reply to] Can't Post

There is a reasonably strong reading of the text that the Misty Mountain Orcs (as a broader group than just the Goblin King's goblins) were under the influence of Sauron. But I think the idea that Azog (and Fimbul) were based out of Dol Guldur is currently a bit of guesswork - they could just as easily be based out of Mt Gundabad etc. (whilst still, ultimately, having a connection to Sauron).

I would actually read the character description as potentially against an ostensible connection in the first instance:

"It was said that Azog the Desecrator fell many years ago in the great battle between the Orcs and the Dwarves. But now he appears again at the top of a deadly horde of killer orcs. For Gandalf begins a race against time because he has to figure out the connection between the most dangerous orc commander and the growing evil, which takes shape in the ruins of the fortress of Dol Guldur."

If Azog and or Azog's forces are living at Dol Gudur and serving The Necromancer - what would Gandalf have to work out?

LR


DarkJackal
Rohan


Oct 6 2012, 9:55pm

Post #47 of 76 (4867 views)
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English description [In reply to] Can't Post

Just a note that all the German translations of the character descriptions have been nearly the same for all the toys revealed so far, which means the really odd ones like Azog are also probably accurate.

This is the Fimbul description from the figure box:

"One of Azog's master hunters, Fimbul is a particularly vicious Orc. Leader of the pack of Warg riders who hunt down their victims astride giant wolf-beasts Fimbul has picked up the scent of the Company of Thorin Oakenshield and is intent on tracking down the Dwarves before they can reach the Lonely Mountain."



The Hobbit Photo Gallery

(This post was edited by DarkJackal on Oct 6 2012, 9:58pm)


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 6 2012, 10:09pm

Post #48 of 76 (4924 views)
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All we have is guesswork and speculation right now, but to simplify what we're discussing [In reply to] Can't Post

It seems likely Yazneg will not hail from the Misty Mountains, thus, Yazneg's presence at Out of the Frying Pan would suggest Dol Guldur/the Necromancer's forces playing into the plot at this point.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!

(This post was edited by Captain Salt on Oct 6 2012, 10:10pm)


Lacrimae Rerum
Grey Havens

Oct 6 2012, 10:25pm

Post #49 of 76 (4910 views)
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Could be but who knows? [In reply to] Can't Post

Yazneg might hail from Dol Guldur and be with troops. He might be a sole emissary from DG there on his own. He could be from Mt Gundabad. He could be Azog's spirit in another body. He might look much more ordinary prior to a confrontation with Gandalf's pyro-technics. He might be one of Sauron's servants who has been searching the Gladden Fields for the ring. There are an awful lot of options.

The other intriguing element is from the Wargs' character descriptions.

WARGS
The huge, fierce, wolf-like monsters are among the most fearsome predators in whole Middle-earth. The Orcs breed the Wargs to hunt in packs and to ride on their backs into battle. The most dangerous of these beings is the White Warg, a giant she-wolf, which the huge pale orc Azog the Desecrator is riding.

So more than one White Warg, Yazneg dies and Azog takes his wolf, Azog somehow is Yazneg or this is just the same as the mounted Nazgul in the Lego Weathertop set?

LR


(This post was edited by Lacrimae Rerum on Oct 6 2012, 10:32pm)


Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Oct 7 2012, 1:00am

Post #50 of 76 (4774 views)
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Yes, intriguing ideas as to how this is going to pan out... [In reply to] Can't Post

Azog's spirirt placed into another vessel seems possible...hence why John Rawls was at first cast as Azog and Manu Bennett's performance seems to be (at least partially) motion capture? So, Bennett for Azog in flashback and as a disembodied spirit, John Rawls as the host for Azog's spirit (Yazneg)? It could work if PJ went down this road...though it does seem as if they refer to Azog as a distinct entity having "returned" as a huge pale Orc riding a White Warg (presumably not in flashback) and not as "Yazneg" here.

IMO, it's quite possible we won't see Yazneg riding the albino Warg (as depicted here) unless he is in fact host to Azog in some form.

My Top 5 Wish List for "The Hobbit"
5. Legolas will surf down Smaug's neck
4. Bilbo will be revealed to a Robot
3. Naked PJ cameo as Ghan-Buri-Ghan
2. Use of not only 3D, but smell-o-vision, plus the inclusion of axes coming out of the seats and poking the audience when appropriate
1. Not only keep the claim that Thorin & Co. ran amok in Mirkwood "molesting people", but depict said incident in vivid detail!!!!!

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