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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
The "friendly" Gollum from the trailer

Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Sep 24 2012, 9:16am


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The "friendly" Gollum from the trailer Can't Post

I've just gone back and re-read the Riddles in the Dark chapter and noticed something interesting. I remember the riddles game as being very tense and Gollum as being very scary, but on my re-read, I noticed that my memory was not entirely accurate The scene starts out on a much less menacing footing and then goes into a slow build throughout until the final "Baggins! We hates it forever!". Here are the general beats of the scene in the book (direct book quotes in bold):

1. Bilbo arrives at Gollum's lake and stops, unable to decide where to go next. Gollum comes up out of the darkness and startles him by whispering and hissing. "What is it, my Precious?" This is the scene from the first teaser trailer.

2. Bilbo holds out Sting and asks "Who are you?" Gollum "was not really very hungry at the moment, only curious" and asks his name. Bilbo tells him, and that he is lost. Gollum asks what he has in his hands, and Bilbo tells him it is a blade out of Gondolin. "Ssss" said Gollum, and became quite polite." He then suggests that they sit and have a chat, and perhaps a game of riddles. This is the scene from the second trailer, where Gollum is being polite and proposing a friendly-seeming game. The first riddle is asked.

3. After the first riddle, Gollum challenges Bilbo to the competition. "Does it guess easy? It must have a competition with us, my precious! If precious asks, and it doesn't answer, we eats it, my preciousss. If it asks us, and we doesn't answer, then we does what it wants, eh? We shows it the way out, yes!" "All right!" said Bilbo, not daring to disagree...." We saw a bit of this in the second trailer, though they've switched the order of the offer, beginning with showing Bilbo the way out and ending with the menace of being eaten if he loses, presumably because ending with the scary option begins to build tension.

4. As the riddle game continues, Gollum begins to lose patience and get more angry. "But these ordinary aboveground sort of everyday riddles were tiring for him. Also they reminded him of days when he had been less lonely and sneaky and nasty and that put him out of temper."

5. Both Gollum and Bilbo have some near losses, and Gollum was "getting angry", "tired of the game" and "very hungry indeed". The tension is building. He sits down right next to Bilbo, which rattles him enough that he asks what's in his pockets instead of a real riddle. Gollum gets three guesses, and loses. Bilbo's fear should be showing plainly at this point.

6. As soon as Gollum loses, Bilbo jumps up, puts his back to the wall, and holds out Sting. Gollum does not dare to be openly hostile yet, but mutters and hisses and decides to go get his Ring and come back invisible. I think we can expect a dual Smeagol/Gollum conversation at this point in the movie.

7. Gollum paddles out to his island and finds his precious gone. Bilbo waits in the dark and hears Gollum wailing, shrieking and crying. He calls out to ask what is wrong, and demands his payment. Gollum begins to suspect. Now he becomes the scary, angry Gollum most of us remember when we think of this passage.

8. Gollum comes back in a rage, Bilbo has the Ring slip onto his finger in his panic, and we get the climactic escape scene.

From reading this, paying attention to the way that Gollum is described along the way, I think that the scenes we saw in the trailer are actually quite a reasonable portrayal of that part of the game. We begin with Bilbo being startled and scared by Gollum, who comes out of nowhere, but then they strike up a fairly normal conversation. Gollum begins merely curious, becomes polite, then as the game goes on he moves through the stages of being tired, annoyed, and hungry, and when he loses he becomes treacherous and murderous. We've seen only the startling arrival and the polite stage, with one hint of the anger and treachery to come. I think there's plenty of room for the scene to get more and more tense and scary as it goes on. From comments made by Andy, the scene as shot lasted 15 minutes. If we even get most of that in the films, we have plenty of time to go through all the different stages in a slow build, followed by a great tense escape action scene.

Silverlode



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Subject User Time
The "friendly" Gollum from the trailer Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Sep 24 2012, 9:16am
    Interesting! Avnar Send a private message to Avnar Sep 24 2012, 9:44am
        Absolutely.. Bombadil Send a private message to Bombadil Sep 24 2012, 10:02am
            Could also be Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 1:57pm
                As to Light in his Cave.. Bombadil Send a private message to Bombadil Sep 24 2012, 2:18pm
    thanks! Valandil ed Imladris Send a private message to Valandil ed Imladris Sep 24 2012, 10:09am
    Great stuff, Silverlode! Kendalf Send a private message to Kendalf Sep 24 2012, 10:25am
        We did see the Smeagol-Gollum split personality in the trailer... Earl Send a private message to Earl Sep 24 2012, 11:23am
            Yes, Earl Kendalf Send a private message to Kendalf Sep 24 2012, 11:42am
                Are perfect making you sense Earl Send a private message to Earl Sep 24 2012, 11:50am
            Not only that Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 4:54pm
    The alternate trailer ending Estel78 Send a private message to Estel78 Sep 24 2012, 11:15am
        That is in the beginning of the Riddles in the Dark scene ! Gusev8 Send a private message to Gusev8 Sep 24 2012, 12:00pm
            You're probably right. Estel78 Send a private message to Estel78 Sep 24 2012, 12:44pm
                Iconic scene Gusev8 Send a private message to Gusev8 Sep 24 2012, 12:53pm
        From descriptions at comic-con (spoilers) burgahobbit Send a private message to burgahobbit Sep 24 2012, 12:03pm
            Change... Eleniel Send a private message to Eleniel Sep 24 2012, 8:22pm
                The ubiquitous question...... Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 8:34pm
                    Because they're making a film Eledhwen Send a private message to Eledhwen Sep 24 2012, 9:00pm
                        Chesterton's Fence Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 12:50am
                            Making a movie does not change the original work entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 25 2012, 12:30pm
                                You're rather missing the point Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 1:53pm
                                    I certainly didn't make that argument entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 25 2012, 2:21pm
                                        But there you go again Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 2:36pm
                                            I don't think a bunch of amateurs entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 25 2012, 2:59pm
                                                Oh, my, a variant on the argumentum ad auctoritas Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 3:17pm
                                            Adaptation paradigms Phibbus Send a private message to Phibbus Sep 25 2012, 3:42pm
                                                Most film adaptations of books are probably a mix of all those elements. // Escapist Send a private message to Escapist Sep 25 2012, 3:47pm
                                                I think it's a bit simplistic. Fardragon Send a private message to Fardragon Sep 25 2012, 4:00pm
                                                    Two contentious assertions at one go Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 5:02pm
                                                Not bad. Not bad at all Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 4:01pm
                                            I wouldn't ever push the idea that something is Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 4:42pm
                                        Just a little background for the rest of us - SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 25 2012, 6:40pm
                                    Authorial intent upon authorial intent Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 4:50pm
                                        Like Mark Twain Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 6:06pm
                                            Well I'd have to say no, not really. Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 6:42pm
                                                What you mean to say Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 6:47pm
                                                    Certainly Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 7:16pm
                                                        Oh, balderdash Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 7:32pm
                                                            Well there was me trying to be generous Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 7:37pm
                                                                Nope Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 7:43pm
                                                                    Balderdash? Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Sep 25 2012, 10:16pm
    I completely agree with you burgahobbit Send a private message to burgahobbit Sep 24 2012, 12:06pm
    The comedy was never in the book, though stoutfiles Send a private message to stoutfiles Sep 24 2012, 12:26pm
        I totally agree with you Stoutfiles Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 24 2012, 1:51pm
            Amen Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 2:08pm
                Whatever the case with Sybil may have been . . . Ălfwine Samylfin Send a private message to Ălfwine Samylfin Sep 25 2012, 12:17am
                    Yup ericmvan Send a private message to ericmvan Sep 25 2012, 4:34am
                        Given that Ălfwine Samylfin Send a private message to Ălfwine Samylfin Sep 26 2012, 2:56am
                            Oh my, that sounds horrible... SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 26 2012, 3:15am
        Excellent point Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 3:52pm
        Tolkien uses various humorous techniques in the scene Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 24 2012, 6:39pm
    You also have to realize Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Sep 24 2012, 1:26pm
    Good point Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 2:32pm
        My issue is neither politeness nor cutestiness VoronwŰ_the_Faithful Send a private message to VoronwŰ_the_Faithful Sep 24 2012, 2:41pm
            erm Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 24 2012, 2:55pm
                As PJ does far, far, far too often Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 3:25pm
                    The humor makes us Peanuts happy. Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Sep 24 2012, 3:56pm
                        It's entirely possible Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 4:09pm
                            PJ did an excellent job adapting LOTR Estel78 Send a private message to Estel78 Sep 24 2012, 5:22pm
                        I guess I'm a peanut gallery member as well Tim Send a private message to Tim Sep 24 2012, 4:36pm
                            Pass the peanuts and break out the peanut M&Ms! Arwen's daughter Send a private message to Arwen's daughter Sep 24 2012, 5:41pm
                                Peasants! Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 5:42pm
                            Me too dormouse Send a private message to dormouse Sep 24 2012, 5:55pm
                                This is different, though Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 6:35pm
                                    Well, I don't think so... dormouse Send a private message to dormouse Sep 24 2012, 7:06pm
                                        On an intellectual level Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 7:12pm
                                            It's so hard to tell with just that little clip entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 24 2012, 7:30pm
                                                Thank you Altaira Send a private message to Altaira Sep 25 2012, 3:30am
                                            But something cute.... dormouse Send a private message to dormouse Sep 24 2012, 7:50pm
                                                If they could pull that off stoutfiles Send a private message to stoutfiles Sep 24 2012, 11:17pm
                                        That was my thought also. entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 24 2012, 7:22pm
                                            You know what is to come Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 7:29pm
                                                I think the point of the trailer entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 24 2012, 7:56pm
                                                But neither does Bilbo Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Sep 25 2012, 1:22am
                                                    Seems a bit backwards Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 25 2012, 1:28am
                                                        yep exactly Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 1:40am
                                                        I expect he will be. Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Sep 25 2012, 1:58am
                                                            He still shouldn't be seen as friendly Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 2:29am
                                                                I must be missing something SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 25 2012, 3:49am
                                                                    perspective Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 7:54am
                                                                        If you don't mind me saying so ... tolktolk Send a private message to tolktolk Sep 25 2012, 9:57am
                                                                        Please step back a little and think about this.... dormouse Send a private message to dormouse Sep 25 2012, 1:17pm
                                                                        I am sure no one recognises that description Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 5:04pm
                                                                            I said what we have seen so far Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 11:17pm
                                                                                The Bright Side JWPlatt Sep 25 2012, 11:42pm
                                                                                    NO Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 11:53pm
                                                                                        Many people are pessimists and always expect the worst. Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Sep 26 2012, 12:54am
                                                                                    When frustrated Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 26 2012, 1:44am
                                                                                        Universes JWPlatt Sep 26 2012, 2:09am
                                                                                            There you are wrong Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 26 2012, 2:44am
                                                                                Well said, sir Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 26 2012, 12:37am
                                                                                No... tolktolk Send a private message to tolktolk Sep 26 2012, 8:40am
                                                                                    good advice Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 26 2012, 11:21am
                                                                                    Ive never said anyones view point is less important than mine Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 26 2012, 4:24pm
                                                                                        Witty and original macfalk Send a private message to macfalk Sep 26 2012, 5:42pm
                                                                                            well heres an idea Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 26 2012, 6:02pm
                                                                                            Oh dear Fardragon Send a private message to Fardragon Sep 26 2012, 6:19pm
                                                                                    You underestimate Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 26 2012, 7:28pm
                                                                                        Is complaining about the films really a "core aspect of Tolkien fandom"? Arwen's daughter Send a private message to Arwen's daughter Sep 26 2012, 7:35pm
                                                                                        As long as Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Sep 26 2012, 7:59pm
                                                                                        This is easily Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 26 2012, 10:28pm
                                                                                            I know its hard to believe that everyone doesn't find Peter jackson's middle earth Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 26 2012, 10:37pm
                                                                                                No, it's not Altaira Send a private message to Altaira Sep 27 2012, 3:02am
                                                                                Call me stupid, but... macfalk Send a private message to macfalk Sep 26 2012, 12:08pm
                                                                                    Toilet Humor JWPlatt Sep 26 2012, 3:15pm
                                                                                        Squirrel droppings comes close, too. ;-) / DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 26 2012, 3:18pm
                                                                                            How is squirrel droppings "crude toilet humour" macfalk Send a private message to macfalk Sep 26 2012, 5:37pm
                                                                                                Did you forget "the consistency of" part? Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Sep 26 2012, 6:11pm
                                                                                                Personally ... DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 26 2012, 6:19pm
                                                                                    A short list of crude humor Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 27 2012, 5:45am
                                                                                        Broken carrot = crude? // macfalk Send a private message to macfalk Sep 27 2012, 9:10am
                                                                                            Perhaps crude was not a good adjective for the carrot bit Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 28 2012, 1:18am
                                                                                                This is what it comes down to. Agreed. DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 28 2012, 7:38am
                                                                                        Crude? DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 27 2012, 9:14am
                                                                                            You need to look up Fardragon Send a private message to Fardragon Sep 27 2012, 2:24pm
                                                                                                I'm aware of it's alternative meaning DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 27 2012, 2:27pm
                                                                                                    You are right. Fardragon Send a private message to Fardragon Sep 27 2012, 2:30pm
                                                                                                        Who want's to take bets then, that this sentence appears in the films? DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 27 2012, 4:26pm
                                                                                                            well I wouldnt say Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 27 2012, 9:35pm
                                                                                                                and tosspot Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 27 2012, 9:37pm
                                                                                                                    It also has a very different meaning in the UK DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Sep 27 2012, 9:46pm
                                                                                        I think we should be glad that Michael Bay's not making these films. Hanzkaz Sep 27 2012, 3:35pm
                                                                        LOTR Gollum as filter SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 25 2012, 5:10pm
                                                                Alas no Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 6:58am
                                                                    Touche Altaira Send a private message to Altaira Sep 25 2012, 12:25pm
                                                                        Hannibal Lector Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 25 2012, 1:05pm
                                                                            Liver With Fava Beans JWPlatt Sep 25 2012, 1:13pm
                                                            Bilbo kills goblins? Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 2:53am
                                                                I never said kill. Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Sep 25 2012, 6:59am
                                                        I see it as an evolution entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 25 2012, 2:04am
                                                            Something Lacrimae Rerum said captures it nicely SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 25 2012, 2:12am
                                                            Bilbo starts out afraid of Gollum Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 2:34am
                                                    Silverlode Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 25 2012, 1:22pm
                                        Creepy? Sinister71 Send a private message to Sinister71 Sep 25 2012, 12:33am
                                            Youse goddit, boss Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 25 2012, 12:45am
                                                Which is of course Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 25 2012, 7:01am
                            What the heck, painjoiker Send a private message to painjoiker Sep 24 2012, 8:54pm
                    Tolkien did the same thing entmaiden Send a private message to entmaiden Sep 24 2012, 5:39pm
                Well, i laughed. Estel78 Send a private message to Estel78 Sep 24 2012, 5:17pm
                    I laughed too Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Sep 24 2012, 5:39pm
                        What's plainly needed Solicitr Send a private message to Solicitr Sep 24 2012, 5:50pm
                    I thought it was very sinister Altaira Send a private message to Altaira Sep 24 2012, 6:07pm
                    well I would Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 24 2012, 9:01pm
                        In that scene the humour derives from incongruity Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 24 2012, 9:21pm
                            Now...Class Calm..& sit Down..What we got Bombadil Send a private message to Bombadil Sep 24 2012, 9:46pm
                            do you mean Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 24 2012, 10:26pm
                                I mean incongruity as an Lacrimae Rerum Send a private message to Lacrimae Rerum Sep 24 2012, 10:29pm
                                    Eats It JWPlatt Sep 24 2012, 11:15pm
    Excellent post Silverlode. Spot on.// Gorbag Send a private message to Gorbag Sep 24 2012, 4:41pm
    Quoted for truth SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Sep 24 2012, 5:01pm
    'What has it got in its pocketses?' should be a real tense moment sycorax82 Send a private message to sycorax82 Sep 24 2012, 8:35pm
        Its probably Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Sep 24 2012, 8:49pm
    If you're following canon, Gollum can't be too threatening. ericmvan Send a private message to ericmvan Sep 25 2012, 5:36am

 
 
 

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