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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
3 Hobbit Films Confirmed
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Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:22pm

Post #151 of 378 (2138 views)
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I am betting the rough cut was 10 hours plus. [In reply to] Can't Post

That means the three movies are allready in memory. What did the guy say in Vlog 8? The equivalant of 23 million feet of film. All they need is pick up shots and CG work.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
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(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Jul 30 2012, 5:22pm)


Rostron2
Gondor


Jul 30 2012, 5:25pm

Post #152 of 378 (1930 views)
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Well, that keep the people employed longer [In reply to] Can't Post

And gives us more to talk about for sure.


bookgirl13
Lorien


Jul 30 2012, 5:26pm

Post #153 of 378 (1954 views)
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Meant to only be two films [In reply to] Can't Post

IIRC the first studio wanted LotR to be one film, conflating Rohan and Gondor, Battle of Helm's Deep and Pelennor Fields etc. Then it went up to three films, perhaps he found it difficult to incorporate all that stuff he'd cut out from the first two-film script.

I hope it works without too many scenes of cheesy dialogue and 'bridge' elements.


Eowyn of Penns Woods
Valinor


Jul 30 2012, 5:26pm

Post #154 of 378 (1908 views)
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You speak for me as well! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

**********************************


NABOUF
Not a TORns*b!
Certified Curmudgeon
Knitting Knerd
NARF: NWtS Chapter Member since June 17,2011


MouthofSauron
Tol Eressea


Jul 30 2012, 5:27pm

Post #155 of 378 (1926 views)
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I TOLD YOU... [In reply to] Can't Post

So.... Wink




Maiarmike
Grey Havens


Jul 30 2012, 5:28pm

Post #156 of 378 (1915 views)
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No offense, but if one is not a filmmaker, how would one know how many films it takes to thoroughly tell a story? [In reply to] Can't Post

I only ask because two brilliant filmmakers, Guillermo del Toro, and Peter Jackson have deemed it impossible on different occasions. I only trust them, because they both said it couldn't be done.

Let's say for example they did make a single Hobbit film from just what is in the book. You'd have a solid story for Bilbo Baggins and Thorin, and then a bunch of dwarves the audience wouldn't care for, because they never speak, and have zero development. That would go over well. That's only one of the problems you'd have.

"I warn you, if you bore me, I shall take my revenge"
--J.R.R. Tolkien


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 30 2012, 5:28pm

Post #157 of 378 (1874 views)
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I wouldn't take that post as a confirmation [In reply to] Can't Post

It doesn't seem to have been proof-read properly it says that Zane Weiner is one of the producers of the film, which isn't strictly true.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:32pm

Post #158 of 378 (1861 views)
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It would make sence to develop the new film in the middle [In reply to] Can't Post

rather than on the end. They would be keeping "An Unexpected Journey" and "There & Back Again.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Jul 30 2012, 5:33pm)


SirDennisC
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:33pm

Post #159 of 378 (1903 views)
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Yes "Desolation of Smaug" for film 2 [In reply to] Can't Post

"Riddles in the Dark" for film one and simply "The Battle of Five Armies" or "A Gathering Storm" for film 3.

"There and Back Again" is secondary title for the entire trilogy (oi that is going to take some getting used to!), certainly it is the alternate title of The Hobbit book.

So here's what it could look like

The Hobbit Trilogy, or There and Back Again:

Episode I: Riddles in the Dark
Episode II: The Desolation of Smaug
Episode III: A Gathering Storm (or The Battle of Five Armies)

(just kidding about the "Episode" bits)

Though looking at those titles, the story in total would appear to have quite a different complexion than the book.

They would be similar in tone and structure to the LOTR movies:

FOTR: light and optimistic
TTT: dark and brooding
ROTK: epic and triumphant

Whatever it is, this news changes everything.


duats
Grey Havens

Jul 30 2012, 5:35pm

Post #160 of 378 (1834 views)
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simple [In reply to] Can't Post

The Lord of the Rings was, for all intents and purposes, successfully adapted into three films, when there was enough canon material in there to allow for six films.

The Hobbit is one book, and shorter than any single volume in LoTR. You're right. I'm no filmmaker, but I am familiar enough with this story to be 100% certain that this simpler, linear narrative does not need the same amount of screentime as the entire LoTR trilogy in order to be adapted faithfully.


(This post was edited by duats on Jul 30 2012, 5:37pm)


Bran
Lorien


Jul 30 2012, 5:36pm

Post #161 of 378 (1835 views)
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A cautious welcome [In reply to] Can't Post

If we're getting more Tolkien, more from the original backstory as written by the man himself, I'm all in favour.

If we're getting more padding, more 'female elves because there aren't enough female parts' and so on, I'll be very much against.

I was so looking forward to watching two thetrical versions, and then enjoying greater depth in the EEs. Hope that doesn't go out the window.

Mawr yw ein braint i berthyn i'r gwm Llynfi


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 30 2012, 5:37pm

Post #162 of 378 (1838 views)
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An Unexpected Journery should remain the title of film 1 [In reply to] Can't Post

Whether there are 2 films, 3 films or 79 films, film 1 begins with an unexpected journey. No need to change it at all to "Riddles in the Dark".


One Ringer
Tol Eressea


Jul 30 2012, 5:37pm

Post #163 of 378 (1904 views)
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By this logic... [In reply to] Can't Post

The Lord of the Rings should be atleast 12 movies. Honestly, this makes me hate the fact that they're including the Necromancer even more. The Hobbit is a standalone story that shouldn't touch base with LotR, and it should be a lone film.

FOTR 10th Anniversary Music Video - http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=33xJU3AIwsg

"You do not let your eyes see nor your ears hear, and that which is outside your daily life is not of account to you. Ah, it is the fault of our science that it wants to explain all; and if it explain not, then it says there is nothing to explain."


TheRealBeren
Rivendell

Jul 30 2012, 5:38pm

Post #164 of 378 (1880 views)
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To the big house! [In reply to] Can't Post

Somebody needs to put PJ in a nursing home along with all of his bandwagon fans and take away those films from him.Kiddin' admins.How about a poll?


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:41pm

Post #165 of 378 (1954 views)
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That breakdown doesn't seem to leave much for the third film... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
the Dol Guldur plot would still be the climax of film 1, the death of Smaug film 2, and the BO5A film 3.



I would reorder An Unexpected Journey so that it ends at either Beorn's house or at the edge of Mirkwood. The second movie would end at Lake-town, but would contain most of the Dol Guldur subplot as well as the company's adventures with spiders and Wood-elves. The third film would be There and Back Again.

Although I still don't see an overwhelming need to break the book into three films.

"Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house." - Aragorn

(This post was edited by Otaku-sempai on Jul 30 2012, 5:44pm)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:42pm

Post #166 of 378 (1873 views)
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I think Peter wil cut each movie to just under 3 hours (Think Dark Knight Rises). [In reply to] Can't Post

Extended cuts will be three hours plus. As I said elswhere, I would bet the rough cut was ten hours plus given the amount of equivalant footage they shot.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Jul 30 2012, 5:43pm)


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 30 2012, 5:43pm

Post #167 of 378 (1913 views)
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Does that not leave too much for film 3? [In reply to] Can't Post

Why have the death of Smaug and the BO5A in the same film, when you can spread it over two?


Stupid Fat Hobbitses
The Shire


Jul 30 2012, 5:45pm

Post #168 of 378 (1885 views)
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Domain registrations... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
According to Slashfilm.com, domain registrations for the titles include...The Hobbit: The Desolation of Smaug, and The Hobbit: Riddles in the Dark.

I wonder if they are renaming a 2nd film, and keeping the third film as There and Back Again?...


Hmm...maybe it's time to start considering a quadrilogy:

Part One: An Unexpected Journey
Part Two: Riddles In The Dark
Part Three: The Desolation Of Smaug
Part Four: There And Back Again

I guess I better get to work on my new proposal! I kid...I kid...Wink

Wow! How much changes after a night's sleep? I'm not surprised by this sudden announcement though...I knew that time was of the essence if rumors of a third film were to materialize. Pete needed a decision quickly, in order to properly edit and assemble the first film to support a trilogy. After submitting my three film sketch on The Hobbit on this forum a few days ago, I must admit that I'm quite pleased with this announcement, as I felt confident that this possibility existed and could be pulled off to great effect.

With regards to titles, obviously they'll keep An Unexpected Journey as the title of the first film, as the marketing campaign is already in full swing with the release of the first trailer and all. As I surmised in my musings for a possible Hobbit trilogy, a logical title for the second film would be The Desolation Of Smaug, as my breakdown for the end of the second film consisted of Smaug's death. I believe the title of There And Back Again will remain and be utilized as the name of the third film.


(This post was edited by Stupid Fat Hobbitses on Jul 30 2012, 5:52pm)


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:49pm

Post #169 of 378 (1783 views)
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I don't think so... [In reply to] Can't Post

Well, I've already proposed that most of the Dol Guldur story would be finished by this point (perhaps the Council is still mopping up after the assault and securing the fortress). Even adding some background history, I don't think that the Bot5A has enough material, by itself, to sustain an entire feature film. I think that we need to include the events leading immediately to the death of Smaug to justify a third film.

"Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house." - Aragorn


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 30 2012, 5:56pm

Post #170 of 378 (1787 views)
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I think they're is plenty [In reply to] Can't Post

If both Smaug and the Necromancer are defeated in film 2, then the cliffhanger can be "what happens to all the gold?"

That leaves film 3 for the dwarves securing Erebor, the marching of all the armies and the subsequent build-up of tension, the Arkenstone, the return of Gandalf, the battle, funeral scenes, the return journey (White Council wrap-up), and any other loose ends PJ wants to clean up.

That can justify another film.


Mooseboy018
Gondor


Jul 30 2012, 5:56pm

Post #171 of 378 (1727 views)
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I agree. [In reply to] Can't Post

Changing the name this late wouldn't make sense, and especially because the title itself wouldn't really make sense...

It would be like changing the name of the Fellowship of the Ring to The Bridge of Khazad Dum.


Otaku-sempai
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:56pm

Post #172 of 378 (1723 views)
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I'm presuming that this is only the conflict referred to in 'The Hobbit' [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
- so it looks there is going to be a big fight at the Necromancer's fortress.

But I'm a little confused. Are they referring to the White Council's original attack or the battle that took place during the War of the Ring?



Jackson could have the fortress destroyed during the timeline of The Hobbit, but I don't think that the story is going to be expanded through the War of the Ring (unless the third film is a 'bridge' film after all).

"Good and ill have not changed since yesteryear; nor are they one thing among Elves and Dwarves and another among Men. It is a man's part to discern them, as much in the Golden Wood as in his own house." - Aragorn


Flagg
Tol Eressea


Jul 30 2012, 5:57pm

Post #173 of 378 (1748 views)
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Look at it this way [In reply to] Can't Post

Regardless of how the filmmakers' additions turn out, we'll still get to see each scene from Tolkien's book given the rendition it deserves. I'd rather they shoot an overabundance of footage than leave good material unfilmed.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 30 2012, 5:58pm

Post #174 of 378 (1930 views)
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Here is how they will split the story [In reply to] Can't Post

#1. Ends at Beorn's Lodge. Includes White Council at Rivendell.

#2. Mirkwood and the "battle" of Dol Guldur. Ends with The escape of The Dwarves from The Woodland Realm and a cliff hanger at Dol Gulder.

#3. The Rest of the story. Lake Town, The Smaug stuff & The Battle of Five Armies. This will end with the return to Hobbiton and perhaps a final visit from Balin.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



(This post was edited by Kangi Ska on Jul 30 2012, 6:02pm)


Aragorn the Elfstone
Grey Havens


Jul 30 2012, 5:58pm

Post #175 of 378 (1792 views)
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Ridiculous. Simply ridiculous. [In reply to] Can't Post

PJ's 'Lord of the Rings' Trilogy stands as my favorite film(s) of all time, no question. My faith in him has never faltered. I wholeheartedly supported his turning 'The Hobbit' into two films based on the fact that he was going to draw on additional material to expand the story.

But this is insane. THREE films? Three films to tell the story of The Hobbit? That's the same number of films that he made to tell the grand epic tale of 'The Lord of the Rings', which itself usually comprises 3 individual books. He excelled in his filmmaking craft 10 years ago by making 3 lean, exhilarating epic films for a massive book of over 1,000 pages. Now, he's going to make 3 bloated, overindulgent movies stretching out the material of a small children's story, and I honestly don't see how material from the appendices could demand such stretching.

I'm extremely disappointed. Unsure

Come to think of it, I've been more disappointed with the development of these films than I ever thought I'd be. Shot digitally? Shot in 3D? Used as a guinea pig for 48fps? Dwarves that look like humans? Three films to tell this extremely lean tale?

As much as I hate to say it, I don't think I can fall back on the 'ole "Trust PJ". I'm afraid my expectations have been severely lowered. Frown




"All men dream; but not equally. Those who dream by night in the dusty recesses of their minds awake to find that it was vanity; But the dreamers of day are dangerous men. That they may act their dreams with open eyes to make it possible."
- T.E. Lawrence

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