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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
More '3rd Hobbit Film' Rumblings
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DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 25 2012, 12:10pm

Post #101 of 224 (1452 views)
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I quite like this idea Lissuin... [In reply to] Can't Post

They could easily have Old Bilbo (Ian Holm) in Rivendell beginning to right the Red Book of Westmarch. Cue several flashbacks detailing any number of events.

Mix with appearances from the Fellowship in Rivendell to keep in canon with FOTR (such as the 4 Hobbits listening in).

I love it!

On paper this sounds great, and would make for a fabulous DVD extra. As a film ... I'm not so sure. Crazy


TheHutt
Gondor


Jul 25 2012, 12:16pm

Post #102 of 224 (1504 views)
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Exactly... [In reply to] Can't Post

The Appendices is just not standalone movie material.


The Grey Elf
Grey Havens

Jul 25 2012, 12:23pm

Post #103 of 224 (1692 views)
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Ambivalence is Me [In reply to] Can't Post

Like many other posters, I have profound misgivings about the wisdom of doing this. On the other hand, I don't know my Tolkein appendices well enough to judge whether this additional story scape NEEDS to be told in order to do The Hobbit justice. If this is the last time PJ will be creating Middle Earth, which is highly likely, I would prefer they end on a high note rather than transmogrify into a bloated, over-produced monstrosity. Despite the best intentions and prodigious talents of Peter, Fran, Phillipa, and their motley crew, this is a formidable artistic risk. It all comes down to the story ....


imin
Valinor


Jul 25 2012, 12:34pm

Post #104 of 224 (1683 views)
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I am really undecided [In reply to] Can't Post

I want to think its a good idea and i did love the LOTR and i think i will love the hobbit from what i have seen so far. So i do trust PJ to an extent, like everyone else pretty much i would have done some things different in LOTR and already know i would have from what i have seen of the hobbit, but i can live with those.

For me your idea sounds pretty decent - better than any we as a group have come up with :)

But would those tales not involve many things which are located in The Silmarillion or Unfinished Tales? If so then they are out of bounds as we know.

Personally i think there are quite alot of scenes that can be made from the from the appendices - but enough for a film? I am doubtful, i am also doubtful how they could tie them all together without it being just a bunch of short - but excellent -short stories.

If they can find a way to make it decent then i wouldnt mind. But i dont think the bridge film or film from the appendices will be as good as the LOTR was or TH will hopefully be, thus leaving ME on a downer? I would rather them go out on a high so its remembered for all the right reasons.

But as you can see im really torn as i am doubtful they can do it, but if they can then im all for it?! haha.


DesiringDragons
Lorien


Jul 25 2012, 12:51pm

Post #105 of 224 (1797 views)
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I'm worried about the pacing [In reply to] Can't Post

...if TH is stretched into three films. The book story moves fairly quickly, the excitement is maintained, and there are new adventures around every corner.

Putting some backstory in from the appendices is a great idea and gives context. But I worry that too much might slow down the pacing of the main story and make the plot seem too muddled. TH should be fairly straightforward.

I know PJ wants to tie these films into the trilogy, and that's grand, but I'd rather see a bridge film (I think he could pull it off) than wait until 2014 for the conclusion of TH.

Also, I'm impaatient. :(


Foromir
Rivendell

Jul 25 2012, 12:56pm

Post #106 of 224 (1563 views)
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I hope PJ will come to his senses... [In reply to] Can't Post

The consideration of pulling out three movies out of a charmingly simple story, or of making another stand alone film with no base on an original story from Tolkien altogether, baffles me.

The power of the LotR films, and presumably the Hobbit films, does not only come from showing us splendid images and wonderful characters from Tolkien's Middle Earth. It's because they are based on truly great, carefully woven and dramatic fulfilling STORIES.

I'm sorry but I just don't see where any comparable narrative power could come from putting together interesting bits and pieces from the appendices... so this third film or bridge film would truly feel out of place compared to the other classic stories. I think this would even threaten to cheapen the film series as a whole.


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 25 2012, 12:56pm

Post #107 of 224 (1547 views)
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We need to move away from calling "3rd Hobbit film" [In reply to] Can't Post

A "3rd Hobbit film" has arisen and been coined from the media.

From what PJ has said (and that report on TORn homepage), it sounds more like filming "3rd film", and nothing about splitting The Hobbit in three.


(This post was edited by DanielLB on Jul 25 2012, 12:58pm)


DesiringDragons
Lorien


Jul 25 2012, 12:59pm

Post #108 of 224 (1415 views)
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Well said [In reply to] Can't Post

Putting "Hobbit" in there does seem to be what people (well, me at least) are reacting to most strongly.


(This post was edited by DesiringDragons on Jul 25 2012, 1:01pm)


Voronwë_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jul 25 2012, 12:59pm

Post #109 of 224 (1453 views)
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I hate both ideas [In reply to] Can't Post

I agree that 3 Hobbit films is ridiculously too much. But a "bridge film" type film would be an incoherent mess: a series of only loosely connected stories, with no central theme, and mostly made up by the filmmakers, since Tolkien only wrote bear outlines of most of the material.

I'm not sure which I think would be worse.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

The Hall of Fire


Istaris'staffs
Rivendell

Jul 25 2012, 1:04pm

Post #110 of 224 (1354 views)
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Giver PJ the benefit of the doubt [In reply to] Can't Post

Peter Jackson and company did a magnificent job with Lord of the Rings--I really think everyone should give him a chance in making this hypothetical third movie.

Any opportunity to see more of Middle Earth is magical; however, I agree with some of the earlier posts who said that it would be somewhat anticlimactic to do a movie after the Battle of the Five Armies, which could end up more epic than even Minas Tirith in the movies. That's why I think the second half will merely be lengthened with material from the appendices, especially considering that Gandalf will be gone for most of the second movie if there is no third movie and the second movie stays true to book cannon. Yet if PJ does this, it will not be chronilogically correct, but does that matter? Much of the chronological aspects of LOTR was changed in the movies, or at least meshed together...hmm... Hopefully PJ is reading these posts so he can announce something soon to end this speculation!

One more thing--I don't think the first movie could be changed. We're five months away from the movie in theaters, practically four months from the world premiere. Changing that movie to me seems chaotic at best and irresponsible at worst, even catastrophic.

I do agree with some of the earlier posts as well; whenever PJ departed from Tolkien, it was noticeably weaker. This spells ill news for the second half of The Hobbit if it becomes inundated with PJ and not Tolkien.


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 25 2012, 1:10pm

Post #111 of 224 (1344 views)
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Yes, that is the problem [In reply to] Can't Post

If the media had used "bridge film" straight away, and not just jumped on to "3rd Hobbit film", less people would be concerned.

I don't want the Hobbit split in 3, but would be open to a "3rd bridge film".


makonix
The Shire

Jul 25 2012, 1:11pm

Post #112 of 224 (1419 views)
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I trust PJ to do a good third film [In reply to] Can't Post

If the movie Hobbit gets expanded, I can see Smaug, the history of dragons and dwarves as the main story, with the death of Smaug as the climax. The third movie will deal with the politics of the nations, the history of the ME races (dwarves, elves and orcs), BoFA as climax, and afterwards as Bilbo goes back to Shire. The story continues with Aragorn and Gandalf and Gollum, Gondor taking control of Osgiliath, and Mirkwood aliances fighting Sauron forces.


dave_lf
Gondor

Jul 25 2012, 1:29pm

Post #113 of 224 (1326 views)
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Appendix [In reply to] Can't Post

They're the pros, but I can't imagine how a film based on the LOTR appendices could be anything other than an appendix itself. Unstructured, incomplete, and skipped by almost everyone.

I would watch it though. Smile I've often said I'd like to see a film of the Silmarillion or appendices done entirely in the style of the LotR prologue. But I don't think that sort of thing would have mass-market appeal.


(This post was edited by dave_lf on Jul 25 2012, 1:34pm)


dormouse
Half-elven


Jul 25 2012, 1:34pm

Post #114 of 224 (1364 views)
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Well... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think the problem there is that none of us has a clue what Peter Jackson's talking about and we're all reacting against things which he may have no intention of doing anyway.

There are good stories in the Appendices, some of which might work on film. For me, for now, I'm content to forget both the idea of a third Hobbit film and of the much discussed 'bridge film' and wait and see. I think his enthusiasm is enough for now. If he can see something in Tolkien's LotR Appendices which he believes can be made to work, and which he really wants to film, then I hope he gets the go-ahead and I'll be interested to see the result. I may like it, I may not, but I can't possibly dismiss it without having the faintest idea of what it is!


The Grey Elf
Grey Havens

Jul 25 2012, 1:36pm

Post #115 of 224 (1370 views)
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Momentum ? [In reply to] Can't Post

My concern about your possible third movie is that once Smaug is snuffed out, the treasure is won, the 5 armies do battle, etc., the whole impetus of the story is resolved and anything after will feel tacked on, maybe diminishing what came before it in the process.


guitarzankansasfan
Lorien


Jul 25 2012, 1:40pm

Post #116 of 224 (1353 views)
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I'm worried about a 3rd film failing financially. [In reply to] Can't Post

I don't mind milking a franchise a little but the most unpalatable thing to me is milk with water added to it.

One more film in the series is just too much, even of a good thing. Even the hugely successful Star Wars prequel franchise had a flop when they tried to milk it too far with one last film to "tell more of the story" (Clone Wars)

If PJ and New Line put out an overstretched Hobbit or "Appendices- The Movie" with a lot of fanfare and expectations and it becomes a financial flop it will leave a blemish on the whole franchise that may overshadow all the great accomplishments that have been made so far.

Maybe a direct to video or TV miniseries would be better if they feel like they can't quit making these things.


The Grey Elf
Grey Havens

Jul 25 2012, 1:40pm

Post #117 of 224 (1316 views)
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Very Well Put, Dormouse [In reply to] Can't Post

I think your sage attitude has pushed me off the fence and now I am glad (for the most part ;-) Thank You!


dave_lf
Gondor

Jul 25 2012, 1:48pm

Post #118 of 224 (1366 views)
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Hypothetical Hobbit Trilogy [In reply to] Can't Post

That (end #2 with Smaug's defeat, make the aftermath the focus of #3) seems plausible if they're going to do it at all, especially since we're told the battle has not been fully filmed yet. They'd have to invent a lot about the politics of Laketown to fill up film 2, and a lot about the politics of the North to fill up film 3.


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 25 2012, 2:18pm

Post #119 of 224 (1325 views)
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Well, if it's something entirely separate from The Hobbit. [In reply to] Can't Post

Then I can skip it, and those of you who want it can have it. And we'll both be happy. Tongue



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


DesiringDragons
Lorien


Jul 25 2012, 2:19pm

Post #120 of 224 (1311 views)
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Cats of Queen Beruthiel: The Movie [In reply to] Can't Post

Clearly that's what it's going to be about.

(Sorry, your "Appendices: The Movie" made me think of it - and I believe that the cats story was mostly in Unfinished Tales anyway, so there goes that idea.)

...this has not been a serious post.


JWPlatt
Grey Havens


Jul 25 2012, 2:26pm

Post #121 of 224 (1556 views)
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Facts [In reply to] Can't Post

I usually drop tracking a thread when it begins to spoil the movie for me. But this thread is at the other end of the spectrum and I'm still going to drop it. Fears built upon speculation in a feedback loop of noise is is just too much of a waste of time. I'll pick it back up when more facts are known about a third film and there can be a better discussion about it.


RosieLass
Valinor


Jul 25 2012, 2:29pm

Post #122 of 224 (1413 views)
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Actually, that would have bothered me more. [In reply to] Can't Post

At least with talk of a 3rd Hobbit film, you can dismiss the idea because they're just months away from releasing the first one, so overhauling the whole project now would be impractical.

But a bridge film gives them scope to do whatever they want, and that's what I particularly don't want to see.



It is always those with the fewest sensible things to say who make the loudest noise in saying them. --Precious Ramotswe (Alexander McCall Smith)


DanielLB
Immortal


Jul 25 2012, 2:35pm

Post #123 of 224 (1942 views)
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Can we slip the Blue Wizards in somewhere? [In reply to] Can't Post

Xanaseb would be happy!


MartyB
Rivendell


Jul 25 2012, 2:38pm

Post #124 of 224 (1733 views)
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My Opinion... [In reply to] Can't Post

The thing that worries me is they are not going to film a bridge film in 2 months next summer. Alot of already shot footage would have to be used to make the shooting next summer into a 2-3 hour film. This suggests to me The Hobbit will be split over 3 films.

The Hobbit story and Necromancer sub-plu should all be tied up in film 2. Moving any of this into film 3 would be a bad idea. I'd love a bridge film however. What a bonus.


Kendalf
Rohan

Jul 25 2012, 2:55pm

Post #125 of 224 (1384 views)
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Phew! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I agree that 3 Hobbit films is ridiculously too much. But a "bridge film" type film would be an incoherent mess: a series of only loosely connected stories, with no central theme, and mostly made up by the filmmakers, since Tolkien only wrote bear outlines of most of the material.

I'm not sure which I think would be worse.



There I was, enjoying reading all 124 prior posts, formulating my own contribution in my head...when Voronwe said it for me!

Much as I admire and indeed love the LotR trilogy, it's an unavoidable truth that its handful of weakest points are all when Jackson deviates from the text and gives us events, characters and dialogue that he, Walsh and Boyens have fabricated. I'm not sure I trust them to be able to forge a convincing narrative with a convincing script from the scraps they have at their disposal in the Appendices.

Three Hobbits? No, thank you. A bridge film? No, thank you. Instead, give me two mega-hefty Extended Editions with flashbacks and exposition galore and I'll be happy.

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