Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Analysing Billy Connolly's Dain Ironfoot
First page Previous page 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 Next page Last page  View All

News from Bree
spymaster@theonering.net

Jun 18 2012, 7:58am

Post #1 of 242 (11916 views)
Shortcut
Analysing Billy Connolly's Dain Ironfoot Can't Post

Billy Connolly, The Big Yin, loves a big laugh. So is that all that's behind the strange tidbits about Dáin Ironfoot that's emerging from the interviews that Connolly's been doing for Brave recently?

It could be. But what if it isn't? Let's summarise what's trickled out over the last few days, and see what we can conclude. Needless to say, this analysis involves spoilers.

Story:MSN.co.nz

Quotable quote:

Connolly is back in the country to do more work on The Hobbit as dwarf warrior Dáin Ironfoot. "I have a war to fight. Elves to kill. Orcs to maim," he says.

Elves to kill!

We know that in the book that Thorin summons his kin from the Iron Hills initially to deal with the army of unwanted humans and elves camped in front of the ruined front gate of Erebor after the demise of Smaug.

When Dáin's dwarves finally arrive, there are some tense moments where it looks as though a bloody and ruinous battle between dwarves and elves will ensue before Gandalf intervenes and warns of the approach of the armies of Bolg, son of Azog.

"But he reckoned without the dwarves. The knowledge that the Arkenstone was in the hands of the besiegers burned in their thoughts; also they guessed the hesitation of Bard and his friends, and resolved to strike while they debated.

Suddenly without a signal they sprang silently forward to attack. Bows twanged and arrows whistled; battle was about to be joined." The Hobbit, Chapter 17.

It seems fair to conclude from Connolly's comment that the Battle of the Five Armies will significantly mirror events described by Tolkien. Expect the tension of the historic enmity between elves and dwarves to drive them to the point of battle, before Gandalf intervenes dramatically.

Story: Yahoo Australia

Quotable quote:

"They're basically broadening me, making me wider," he explains, adding that the technology being used on the film is making for long, hard working days. "But let me say, this guy will terrify the life out of you. I have a Mohawk and tattoos on my head. You've got to see it."

It seems doubtful that Jackson would make Dáin as wide as, say, Bombur. But we know dwarves are naturally stocky. No cause for alarm.

A mohawk, though? Skull tattoos? Are these "proper" for a dwarven lord?

Well, fact is that the Hobbit doesn't even contain a description of Dáin -- his appearance is left wholly to the imagination of the reader. The best we get is a description of Dáin's folk that says in part: "Their beards were forked and plaited and thrust into their belts."

We do, however, know Dáin Ironfoot was one of the fiercest warriors of his age. At the youthful (for dwarves) age of 32, he slew the orc Azog before the west-gate of Moria during the Battle of Azanulbizar -- a mighty feat for one then regarded by his folk as a mere "stripling".

The appendices of Lord of the Rings describe that "up the steps after [Azog] leaped a Dwarf with a red axe. It was Dáin Ironfoot, Náin's son. Right before the doors he caught Azog, and there he slew him, and hewed off his head."

And during the War of the Ring, Dáin fought to defend Erebor and his friend King Brand (grandson of Bard the Bowman). He was 252 years of age -- old even for a dwarf yet still mighty in battle.

This all speaks of a great warrior. Perhaps even some sort a beserker. Such a warrior might, perhaps, affect a fierce appearance to intimidate his foes.



One thing is certain if this is true: WETA has wholly discarded the concepts it used for the LOTR trading card game that was released several years ago.

Story: News.com.au

Quotable quote:

"But you don't feel like a little guy because you are doing big things like killing people and stuff. And you are wearing all that armour and make-up and everything. It was great fun. I arrive riding a wild pig."

The dwarves of the Iron Hills don't ride into battle. Not on ponies. Not on pigs.

Their endurance is so prodigious that they run all the damn way from their mountain fortress to The Lonely Mountain. In full battle gear. Burdened by great packs on their backs. And they accomplish this feat in a matter of days, and then fight a great battle when they get there. And win.

They're so hardcore they make special ops guys look wimpy.

So, why do we have a Dáin on a wild pig? Did someone think that they needed to get maximum use out of Leroy, the pig from the Hobbiton set that AICN's Quint so graphically revealed. Maybe someone's been reading Game of Thrones and has George RR Martin's Tyrion Lannister confused with Tolkien's Dáin Ironfoot?

Maybe it just looks cool.



One possible explanation some of our message board members have pointed out is that Norse mythology speaks of Hildisvíni, the boar "battle swine" that the goddess Freya rides when not using her cat-drawn chariot.

Perhaps only Dáin Ironfoot will ride one of these battle swine. It could be a highly effective way of making him stand out from his fellows on the battlefield.

And consider: Tolkien initially derived the names of his dwarves from the Norse Sagas. In attempting to create fill visual gaps, and making the key players stand out for key scenes, isn't taking inspiration from a common mythological source better than making stuff up willy-nilly?

There's a caveat, though.

Dáin also proves a wise leader of his people. And he has a generous heart. I hope that his wisdom shines through in Connolly's portrayal as much as his warrior side.


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 1:59pm

Post #2 of 242 (9628 views)
Shortcut
I was fine with the boar thing [In reply to] Can't Post

But now, mohawk? My enthusiasm for seeing Dain just plummeted...

Yes, I know there may have been some Pictish or British tribes that sported mohawks, but the modern association is punk rock.

Does Dain really need a boar-mount AND a mohawk to get across that he's a fierce warrior?

Sigh...


Carne
Tol Eressea

Jun 18 2012, 2:12pm

Post #3 of 242 (9577 views)
Shortcut
Well, mohawks can look really badass... [In reply to] Can't Post

I like it.


DanielLB
Immortal


Jun 18 2012, 2:16pm

Post #4 of 242 (9558 views)
Shortcut
Does seem excessive [In reply to] Can't Post

to have him riding a boar, a mohawk, and tattoos Crazy

But, you never know, works for Dwalin.


Carne
Tol Eressea

Jun 18 2012, 2:19pm

Post #5 of 242 (9565 views)
Shortcut
Dwalin [In reply to] Can't Post

Exactly. Just a look at him and you can tell he'll easily take down a dozen goblins by himself.


DanielLB
Immortal


Jun 18 2012, 2:22pm

Post #6 of 242 (9505 views)
Shortcut
I wouldn't like to meet him down a dark alley-way [In reply to] Can't Post

Question is, how did the dwarves tattoo themselves and why?

What tattoo did Gimli have?

Gimli 4 Galadriel?


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Jun 18 2012, 2:29pm

Post #7 of 242 (9545 views)
Shortcut
Brilliant post Dems...... all I can say, is that this all screams WARHAMMER to me! I don't mind it... [In reply to] Can't Post

.... But I used to be into the game and the universe so much, that if the artwork concepts for dwarves are similar, then I'll just be taken straight out of thefilm experience FrownCrazy
well I hope I won't be!...

It might turn out to look good, but then again, I DON'T want a Din like Gotrek from the Warhammer world! (not that I dislike it, but it'd zap me out of the experience):



Warhammer dwarf Boar rider:



so yeah.... the art team'll make them look fine.. .. .. .. I trust them, just I hope I don't get reminded of Warhammer... some of the Dwarven weapons seen in vlog 7 also reminded me strongly of Warhammer hehe.

Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!

________________________________________________

Laketown guy: What have the dwarves -ever- done for us?

Bard: The aqueduct!

Laketown guy: Piss off! We're not from Dale


DanielLB
Immortal


Jun 18 2012, 2:31pm

Post #8 of 242 (9463 views)
Shortcut
How funny! [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm looking at the very same pictures right now.

Although, I have no experience of warmhammer, I just googled mohawk dwarf Wink

The first picture isn't so bad - I just can't see Connolly pulling it off. Plus, it's another "out-there" dwarf design.


dave_lf
Gondor

Jun 18 2012, 2:35pm

Post #9 of 242 (9420 views)
Shortcut
And I was too! [In reply to] Can't Post

As in, the exact same ones Shocked. Great minds think alike, but what's our excuse?


Carne
Tol Eressea

Jun 18 2012, 2:39pm

Post #10 of 242 (9516 views)
Shortcut
And here's Dain fighting Bolg [In reply to] Can't Post

Wink




Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Jun 18 2012, 2:39pm

Post #11 of 242 (9437 views)
Shortcut
LOL, well I suppose it's a natural response by any forum poster to such descriptions from Billy hehe, [In reply to] Can't Post

I however already had those kinds of Warhammer images in my mind when reading it . . . . did you guys ever play it, or get into it?

Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!

________________________________________________

Laketown guy: What have the dwarves -ever- done for us?

Bard: The aqueduct!

Laketown guy: Piss off! We're not from Dale


(This post was edited by Xanaseb on Jun 18 2012, 2:41pm)


Xanaseb
Tol Eressea


Jun 18 2012, 2:40pm

Post #12 of 242 (9469 views)
Shortcut
precisely!, I hope PJ & Co. don't go -too- much down this kind of route lol. // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Join us over at Barliman's chat all day, any day!

________________________________________________

Laketown guy: What have the dwarves -ever- done for us?

Bard: The aqueduct!

Laketown guy: Piss off! We're not from Dale


dave_lf
Gondor

Jun 18 2012, 2:46pm

Post #13 of 242 (9470 views)
Shortcut
Not Warhammer precisely [In reply to] Can't Post

But I have a long, sordid history with the Warcraft universe, which is what these descriptions have been calling to my mind.


Voronw_the_Faithful
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 2:53pm

Post #14 of 242 (9438 views)
Shortcut
At least ... [In reply to] Can't Post

... he doesn't have an axe in his head.

I don't like the mohawk and tatoos thing either, but I'll reserve judgment until I see it. It might not be as bad as it sounds.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

The Hall of Fire


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 3:10pm

Post #15 of 242 (9455 views)
Shortcut
Dwalin's just bald [In reply to] Can't Post

No mohawk there.

I'm starting to think that World of Warcraft or Warhammer really was the inspiration here...


(This post was edited by Shelob'sAppetite on Jun 18 2012, 3:13pm)


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 3:12pm

Post #16 of 242 (9421 views)
Shortcut
Yes [In reply to] Can't Post

I was hoping we'd get a more traditional Tolkien dwarf with Dain, to balance out some of the loonier designs...


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 3:14pm

Post #17 of 242 (9409 views)
Shortcut
Sordid, eh? [In reply to] Can't Post

Do tell!


SkaldOfTheNorse
Bree


Jun 18 2012, 3:14pm

Post #18 of 242 (9419 views)
Shortcut
No Warhammer pollution to these movies (please) [In reply to] Can't Post

Please don't let the mythological style (ancient norse) be poluted by over the top pulp like Warhammer.
I always thought Middle Earth to be more low fantasy and steeped in Myth and Lore (class and style) almost historical.
If this is the path the art department chooses to go, before we know it we don't have subtle stylished weapons, but fluorescent red mega axes 10 feet long with what look like chainsaws.

Let Warhammer have it's own universe.

Sorry for the rant, but I truly hope the Iron Mountain dwarves design does not look like Warhammer dwarves. I hope the art department can think of something original more fitting to the middle earth universe portrayed in the movies than to cheeply borrow the repulsive 'art' of Warhammer.

What a contrast with the beautiful and subtle art of Howe and Lee.

Skald


dormouse
Half-elven


Jun 18 2012, 3:19pm

Post #19 of 242 (9467 views)
Shortcut
Wouldn't that involve.... [In reply to] Can't Post

... some sort of breach of copyright?

The mohawk sounds more Pictish to me than anything else. Don't much care for the idea as an idea, but I'll wait and see what it looks like in context, and what sort of character they've made of him.


BeornBerserker
Lorien

Jun 18 2012, 3:20pm

Post #20 of 242 (9413 views)
Shortcut
Comedian [In reply to] Can't Post

The guy is a natural comedian and makes a living with hyperbole. I feel his just playing himself, not Dain in the interviews.


dave_lf
Gondor

Jun 18 2012, 3:21pm

Post #21 of 242 (9364 views)
Shortcut
Well... [In reply to] Can't Post

They do call them role-playing games, and there's never been a good explanation for those half-orcs...


dave_lf
Gondor

Jun 18 2012, 3:23pm

Post #22 of 242 (9405 views)
Shortcut
Warhammer/craft visual hyperbole [In reply to] Can't Post

The team frequently expressed distaste for the "D&D style" during the LotR days, and that probably hasn't changed. I think they'll come up with their own, unique brand of over-the-top Angelic.


Shelob'sAppetite
Valinor

Jun 18 2012, 3:23pm

Post #23 of 242 (9408 views)
Shortcut
Prepare for some disappointment [In reply to] Can't Post

I think there will be a bit more flamboyance in the design this time around...


DanielLB
Immortal


Jun 18 2012, 3:25pm

Post #24 of 242 (9375 views)
Shortcut
I meant the tats / [In reply to] Can't Post

 


DanielLB
Immortal


Jun 18 2012, 3:27pm

Post #25 of 242 (9353 views)
Shortcut
No, never played it myself [In reply to] Can't Post

I did imagine Dain Ironfoot a lot differently though.

There goes my theory of PJ going down the iron foot route.

First page Previous page 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8 9 10 Next page Last page  View All
 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.