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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Lord of the Rings:
HELP! "If by life or death" scene is changed from theater to DVD!
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GreySaber
The Shire

Sep 12 2007, 11:34pm

Post #1 of 51 (1142 views)
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HELP! "If by life or death" scene is changed from theater to DVD! Can't Post

Help! I just watched the DVD of Jackson's Fellowship.... and it's not the same cut I saw in the theater. (And I don't mean it was extended, I mean stuff was missing from the theater version.)

This is important, as I'm a film student with a presentation to give on the characterization worked by the dialogue, and the dialogue changed since I saw it in theaters.

Basically, I'm comparing how this line was delievered in the book, Jackson movie, and cartoon. In the book and cartoon, it was at the Prancing Pony Inn in Bree. In the Jackson movie... It was at Rivendell.

In the theater version, when Viggo Mortenson deleivered the line: "If by life or death I can save you........ I WILLLLLLLLLL" he was swinging around a column, acting like a total fruit, and was way too happy, since Liv Tyler had talked to him, or given him her pendant or something like that.

In the DVD I just saw, This didn't happen. The line is delievered at the coucil of the ring, when Aragorn offically joins the fellowship. The part where he acts like a love stuck teenage girl is gone.

Does anyone else remember this? Does anyone know where it went.. when it got cut,.and most importantly... where I can find a copy of the column swinging scene?

I really need this scene for my presentation.


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Sep 13 2007, 1:57am

Post #2 of 51 (700 views)
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*jaw drops, is speechless* // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Only I hear the stones lament them: deep they delved us, fair they wrought us, high they builded us; but they are gone. They are gone. They sought the Havens long ago."
(Avatar pic: The Calanais stones, Isle of Lewis)

"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915


diedye
Grey Havens


Sep 13 2007, 2:12am

Post #3 of 51 (740 views)
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Whatever it was that you were... [In reply to] Can't Post

... drinking when you saw that in the theater, I want some! Crazy



GreySaber
The Shire

Sep 13 2007, 2:28am

Post #4 of 51 (705 views)
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argh! [In reply to] Can't Post

No, seriously, this happened. And now it's gone!!!


weaver
Half-elven

Sep 13 2007, 3:40am

Post #5 of 51 (688 views)
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sounds more like a POTC scene... [In reply to] Can't Post

I could see Jack Sparrow swinging from a pole -- in fact, he does that a lot -- and would probably do it even at a Council meeting. But not Aragorn anytime or anywhere....

Could you be thinking of one of the unused film scenes that was in a trailer -- one that was a flashback to when Aragorn and Arwen first met? It's a very happy, "head over heels" in love scene, IIRC. But it was not a Council scene and it was never used in the TE or EE.

Weaver



GreySaber
The Shire

Sep 13 2007, 4:27am

Post #6 of 51 (664 views)
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. [In reply to] Can't Post

It was in that room/area where they were keeping the shards of narsil, not at the meeting. I don't recall if it was one of the columns with the fence, or one of the freestanding ones.


weaver
Half-elven

Sep 13 2007, 4:33am

Post #7 of 51 (698 views)
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Here's a link to an image from the scene I'm thinking of... [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.framecaplib.com/...s/unused/unuse06.htm

I can't tell what the setting is -- I had assumed Lorien -- but I guess it could be the Rivendell museum place where Narsil is kept. But I don't see any swinging poles!

Weaver



GreySaber
The Shire

Sep 13 2007, 4:57am

Post #8 of 51 (669 views)
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. [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.framecaplib.com/...es/fotr/fotr0711.htm

IT would have been set in this room.

The more I try to remember, the more I remember him jumping up on that little fence between those poles.


(This post was edited by GreySaber on Sep 13 2007, 4:58am)


weaver
Half-elven

Sep 13 2007, 9:43am

Post #9 of 51 (659 views)
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well, I give up on that one! [In reply to] Can't Post

Though now I dearly wish I had Photoshop skills -- just to see how Aragorn might look jumping around on a little fence...

Weaver



FarFromHome
Valinor


Sep 13 2007, 10:54am

Post #10 of 51 (690 views)
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Hmmm... [In reply to] Can't Post

I have to wonder if maybe you were misled by your preconceptions on your original viewing. Aragorn has just been shown talking Arwen, of course, as you say, and receiving the gift of the Evenstar. And in the Council scene he appears to have the library, where the shrine is, directly behind him (it looks as if the Council is held on the terrace of the library, and in the open architecture of Rivendell, that means that you can see right into the library behind Aragorn). If you were still processing the change in Aragorn that the movies make, in the scenes in the library and on the bridge with Arwen, perhaps a trick of memory made you impose things into the Council scene that aren't really there.

So if I'm understanding you correctly, and what you are remembering is from seeing the film in the movie theatre (presumably almost 6 years ago now), I wonder if you are simply misremembering? There are people on these boards who saw the movie in the theatre dozens of times, and then bought the DVD as soon as it came out. If there was a discrepancy, they would certainly have noticed!

...and the sails were drawn up, and the wind blew,
and slowly the ship slipped away down the long grey firth;
and the light of the glass of Galadriel that Frodo bore
glimmered and was lost.


Elizabeth
Half-elven


Sep 13 2007, 10:03pm

Post #11 of 51 (634 views)
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For sure, someone would have noticed.... [In reply to] Can't Post

...a change so significant.


In Reply To
I have to wonder if maybe you were misled by your preconceptions on your original viewing.
...

There are people on these boards who saw the movie in the theatre dozens of times, and then bought the DVD as soon as it came out. If there was a discrepancy, they would certainly have noticed!


Exactly. And grammaboodawg has maintained TORn's Observations Lists, a meticulous collection of all coincidences, changes, and noteworthy observations reported by folks on this site ever since FotR was released. And it's not there. Instead, there's an item:


Quote
457. Aragorn's decision to join the Fellowship marks the end of his self-imposed exile.


... appearing at exactly the appropriate point in the Council.




Son of Elizabeth in Frodo's tree
March, 2007


Elizabeth is the TORnsib formerly known as 'erather'


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Sep 13 2007, 10:37pm

Post #12 of 51 (639 views)
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No problem in your presentation plans [In reply to] Can't Post

The moment in the Council scene when Aragorn pledges his life (or death) to protect Frodo is the exact same shown at the theatre and the subsequent extended and theatrical versions of the film on vhs and dvd. I don't know where you could have picked up the version you're describing, but I've never seen anything like that. It's either a blooper or a joke of some sort.

I saw Fellowship of the Ring at the theatre over 55 times, so rest assured it's the only version that is legally offered or has ever been shown at the movies.

Good luck on your presentation! It sounds fascinating! Please consider sharing it with us when you're done. I'd love to see what you found :)

Cheers.


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


Silverlode
Forum Admin / Moderator


Sep 14 2007, 1:33am

Post #13 of 51 (625 views)
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Sorry. [In reply to] Can't Post

That absolutely never happened. Maybe you had a very vivid dream in which you saw that scene? I am being serious, because I know there have been times I was sure I remembered something a particular way and then when I checked it out, I found that my memory was nothing like the reality and I concluded that I must have dreamed it or combined it in my mind with something else.

But I can guarantee you with 100% certainty that Aragorn never swung around pillars or climbed on anything in that room in any version of the film made available to the public. I don't remember hearing any rumours about such a scene ever being shot, and believe me, LOTR rumors always find their way here. If Aragorn had been swinging on pillars, it's almost certain we'd have had a few flame wa....er, argu....er, "intense discussions" about it! Wink

Silverlode

Between the acting of a dreadful thing
And the first motion, all the interim is
Like a phantasma, or a hideous dream:
The genius and the plan thus inspired
Depart me and I, entering a room,
Find myself on the threshold, stand still
And wonder what I came to do there.


(This post was edited by Silverlode on Sep 14 2007, 1:35am)


Dawn
Bree


Sep 14 2007, 1:37am

Post #14 of 51 (617 views)
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*ahem* [In reply to] Can't Post

I myself have been known to swing around on pillars, but
it dosen't seem like something he would do.

Another fine product
of a dysfunctional family.


Timbo_mbadil
Rivendell


Sep 14 2007, 6:17am

Post #15 of 51 (632 views)
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I don't recall fruity Aragorn [In reply to] Can't Post

from my viewings in a cinema, but I do have a bootleg copy of the Theatrical Version from China (dating from February 2002; immoral, I know, but being a media scientist, too, I needed to get my hands on the first version available … and of course dutifully bought the official versions when they came out) – it has the same scenes as the "official" version.
But he does wag his head (in both versions), so maybe that's what you remember seeing?


Otherness represents that which bourgeois ideology cannot recognize or accept but must deal with (…)
Robin Wood 2003, p. 49. "Hollywood from Vietnam to Reagan – and beyond". Columbia University Press, New York, Chichester, West Sussex.


greendragon
Sr. Staff


Sep 14 2007, 2:46pm

Post #16 of 51 (590 views)
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agreed - memory can play tricks on you... [In reply to] Can't Post

Definitely that scene wasn't in the theatrical versions - I didn't see it as many times as gramma(!) but I did see it over 20 times in the cinema and Aragorn never swung on any pillars! But you know, every time I see the 'I have no memory of this place' scene in FotR, and Pippin says, 'I'm hungry,' I always expect Merry to reply, 'You're always hungry!' My mind tells me I once saw a version where he said that - but of course he never did... It's funny how things get stuck in the mind even if they didn't actually happen...

'There are older and fouler things than orcs in the deep places of my fridge...'


Rabittooth
Bree


Sep 14 2007, 4:44pm

Post #17 of 51 (581 views)
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Well... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think this guy is just pulling everyone's prospective chains by talking about the fruity pole swinging Aragorn. Tongue
You folks are just too nice to suggest it to him, or maybe for it to occur to you.
I smell a troll.
But that's just my opinion. Cool I could be wrong.

-Rabittooth

www.rabittooth.com


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Sep 14 2007, 5:31pm

Post #18 of 51 (572 views)
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oh no... [In reply to] Can't Post

I figured I was standing downwind of something... ;)


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


squire
Half-elven


Sep 14 2007, 9:24pm

Post #19 of 51 (631 views)
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Here it is. [In reply to] Can't Post


It was a brilliant homage to another auteur in another genre altogether. It showed Jackson's remarkable depth as a director, not to mention Mortensen's little-known singin' and dancin' skills. It was cut after the first week in the theatres because "it changed Aragorn's character too much", according to the commentary by screenwriter Philippa Boyens.

Sean Bean's follow-up number, "Make 'em cry!", at the end of the movie was cut during editing. Those who've seen it say it makes Boromir's well-received death scene look like slapstick.



squire online:
RR Discussions: The Valaquenta, A Shortcut to Mushrooms, and Of Herbs and Stewed Rabbit
Lights! Action! Discuss on the Movie board!: 'A Journey in the Dark'.
Footeramas: The 3rd TORn Reading Room LotR Discussion; and "Tolkien would have LOVED it!"
squiretalk introduces the J.R.R. Tolkien Encyclopedia: A Reader's Diary


entmaiden
Forum Admin / Moderator


Sep 14 2007, 9:55pm

Post #20 of 51 (586 views)
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Thank goodness you remembered. [In reply to] Can't Post

I thought it was just me.

Each cloak was fastened about the neck with a brooch like a green leaf veined with silver.
`Are these magic cloaks?' asked Pippin, looking at them with wonder.
`I do not know what you mean by that,' answered the leader of the Elves.


NARF since 1974.
Balin Bows


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Sep 14 2007, 9:56pm

Post #21 of 51 (562 views)
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The woses suppose their noses are roses? // [In reply to] Can't Post

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Discuss The Children of Húrin in the Reading Room, June 11-October 14.


Dawn
Bree


Sep 14 2007, 10:08pm

Post #22 of 51 (557 views)
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Oh-no [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm not the only one who swings on poles.
What is that smell??

Another fine product
of a dysfunctional family.


Ataahua
Superuser / Moderator


Sep 15 2007, 12:33am

Post #23 of 51 (561 views)
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Right, that's it: [In reply to] Can't Post

I'm going to petition for a modding function to be built into these boards - it's necessary for moments like this!

Meanwhile... *mods up*

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded b*****d with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Ataahua's stories


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Sep 15 2007, 1:09am

Post #24 of 51 (544 views)
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Definitely. [In reply to] Can't Post

That's the ONE thing the old boards had, that is sorely missed, especially at "moments" like this!

*closes jaw, speaks, and mods up also*


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"Only I hear the stones lament them: deep they delved us, fair they wrought us, high they builded us; but they are gone. They are gone. They sought the Havens long ago."
(Avatar pic: The Calanais stones, Isle of Lewis)

"It struck me last night that you might write a fearfully good romantic drama, with as much of the 'supernatural' as you cared to introduce. Have you ever thought of it?"
-Geoffrey B. Smith, letter to JRR Tolkien, 1915


Awië
The Shire


Sep 15 2007, 2:00am

Post #25 of 51 (539 views)
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Love it! [In reply to] Can't Post

This is so cool! Thanks for the laugh

'Elen síla lúmenn' omentielvo, a star shines on the hour of our meeting,'

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