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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
TheOneRing.net Exclusive: Behold! Thorin Oakenshield and Orcrist!
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R11
Lorien

Jul 18 2011, 8:37pm

Post #351 of 401 (7291 views)
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You said it brother [In reply to] Can't Post

And it's not just LOTR either. The Dwarves in LOTR were simply a very good rendition of the historical convention of what dwarves look like. Having just watched the extended blu-ray versions of the trilogy over again I can say it's why Gimli was one of my favorite characters in PJ's series, since he so well encapsulated that dwarven look. It's quite unfortunate that the powers that be felt that they needed to make most of the 13 in The Hobbit look very little to nothing like dwarves at all. What? No men main characters? Heh, we'll fix that! We'll just make several of them look dwarfish and pretend the rest do... Crazy

It's anti dwarf racism I'm telling you Shocked


ron


Bran
Lorien


Jul 18 2011, 8:39pm

Post #352 of 401 (7238 views)
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Generally very happy [In reply to] Can't Post

but......

I never really bought into the theory that Thorin would be too young. As others have said, it worked well with Frodo. I had no issue with that. I have to say though, I did imagine Thorin as a lot older, and I must admit to being a little concerned.

But Nori's hair really irks me. All the (TORN) staff seemed to talk about it, and when the hair is the main talking point in a character, it's very worrying.

I've never been one for 'cool'. I didn't like Legolas' snowboarding exploits - it took me out of the film, and I feel Nori does the same. I see the dwarves and they look great, but I lose the magic, and the immersion in the world when I see a designer haircut.

It's an annoying negative in what I see otherwise are some very, very good dwarves indeed.

Mawr yw ein braint i berthyn i'r gwm Llynfi


Rufus
Bree

Jul 18 2011, 8:39pm

Post #353 of 401 (7294 views)
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Are you being sarcastic? [In reply to] Can't Post

UnsureI'm not sure if you are being sarcastic it is very difficult to tell. I posted the links just to show how much older they had made him look as Thorin


Ececheira
Bree


Jul 18 2011, 8:43pm

Post #354 of 401 (7248 views)
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Indeed! [In reply to] Can't Post

You may be right - I'm not well known for my subtlety LOL


marillaraina
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 8:50pm

Post #355 of 401 (7180 views)
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This is true [In reply to] Can't Post


Quote
Te age and worldly weariness. He does not have to look like a seventy year ol to show how troubled he is by all that he as lost.


This is a concern I've really never gotten. World weariness has nothing to do with age. Nor do you need to be old to show how loss has haunted you. In fact I'd even go so far to say that it can be more effective in a slightly younger character, because it's less expected. And it isn't like they didn't age RA up at all, he looks a good ten or more years older than he looks in real life.


Rufus
Bree

Jul 18 2011, 8:53pm

Post #356 of 401 (7247 views)
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I have to say that [In reply to] Can't Post

It is how I think of Thorin. If I recall it doesn't say in The Hobbit that he is the oldest it simply says he is the most important. Now I know that in other publications Tolkein said more than that but the image is there in my mind.

I wasn't a fan of Gimli's look it was a little to dough boy for me and I found it distracting. It was as if they were trying to hard.


Garfeimao
Rohan


Jul 18 2011, 9:05pm

Post #357 of 401 (7275 views)
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NO, I was being serious [In reply to] Can't Post

Actors are chameleons, some moreso than others. That was clear from the links that even in his normal guise he has different looks.

The thanks was for the rather handsome images in the fashion spread, again, not sarcastic, just happy.

Peace, Love and Rock & Roll,


Garfeimao
The orange stripey One



Cruise to Middle-earth


Garfeimao
Rohan


Jul 18 2011, 9:09pm

Post #358 of 401 (7249 views)
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Here comes the full body and full Complement of Dwarves [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.theonering.net/...full-body-rendering/

I guessed right, his tunic does appear to be a bit shorter than the others.

Peace, Love and Rock & Roll,


Garfeimao
The orange stripey One



Cruise to Middle-earth

(This post was edited by Garfeimao on Jul 18 2011, 9:09pm)


Rufus
Bree

Jul 18 2011, 9:10pm

Post #359 of 401 (7230 views)
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thanks [In reply to] Can't Post

Laugh For clearing that up. And your welcome though the pics don't do a lot for meWink


Rosebud
The Shire

Jul 18 2011, 9:15pm

Post #360 of 401 (7204 views)
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Isn't it a photoshop job? [In reply to] Can't Post

Looks like Gloin's body mirrored (and desaturated) and with Oin's belt thrown in.

The proportions are a bit odd - the legs look too short for the arms and shoulders but otherwise a good job.


marillaraina
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 9:22pm

Post #361 of 401 (7186 views)
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Me too [In reply to] Can't Post

That is pretty much how I imagined Thorin. I didn't imagine some lumpy ancient dude with white hair. I imagined a dark haired dwarf with some grey, more than they have on Armitage but not completely grey and I imagined the dwarves in general as more sharp featured, more like little stocky people but to be honest with Fili and Kili being the youngest, in my head, while they were both blond and bearded, I did tend to imagine them as being less stocky or "solid" looking than the older dwarves.

So in my case the changes to these characters really aren't a huge deal because I never imagined them looking like what we ended up with Gimli(who's great I have nothing against Gimli but IMO he actually does look older than I'd think he'd need to being a dwarf in the slightly lower end of middle age). I never imagined Thorin as being ancient and white or grey and I never imagined Fili and Kili as being carbon copies of the older dwarves, in my head they were always thinner for lack of a better word.

Yes they all look different than they did in my head but I still think they look great and have no problem with any of them really. I really think everything that looks in a still picture with no context like "Oh my god they've gone Hollywood!" is going to have a reasonable "in film" explanation which might possibly even heighten the emotion of what is going on.


mykonos
Bree


Jul 18 2011, 9:59pm

Post #362 of 401 (7138 views)
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I understand [In reply to] Can't Post

But what you see as criticizing can just be defending their belief in PJ's Thorin. And vise versa. Laugh


Gandalf'sMother
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 10:23pm

Post #363 of 401 (7136 views)
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Looks like... [In reply to] Can't Post

He didn't find the entire beard... Wink

Perhaps McShane has got the other half?


(This post was edited by Gandalf'sMother on Jul 18 2011, 10:23pm)


Gandalf'sMother
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 10:25pm

Post #364 of 401 (7146 views)
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Ha... [In reply to] Can't Post

He actually looks significantly BETTER in the flet scene. Far more natural and less pizza-faced. Not sure why they didn't go with this version...


Gandalf'sMother
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 10:30pm

Post #365 of 401 (7149 views)
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I also... [In reply to] Can't Post

Think the proportions of the new dwarves are just fine, and are not inconsistent with the books. The lack of proper beards on some, however, are a different story. Tolkien made it rather clear that dwarves have long beards...


Phibbus
Rohan


Jul 18 2011, 11:06pm

Post #366 of 401 (7087 views)
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There could be a problem, though... [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I see what you're saying about Dwalin and Balin's 'specific' looks, though, but I was talking about proportions and general facial characteristics. Smoother, non-lumpy latex faces, with generally normal body proportions, but longer beards than Dwalin's (and 'not bald), are what I was looking for.

The "Gimli dwarf" looks supremely awkward, is very unnatural, and is just plain difficult to watch. Not to mention the even more bloated LOTR film dwarves linked to somewhere else in this thread.


I can see your point, somewhat, however...

I think the buildup of prosthetics did serve a function beyond just giving the characters a "look." Namely, they served to build the actor's heads up so that they would appear as large as a normal human head when the character was scaled against human-height ones. I think this is rather important...

Take a look at the composite made by chrismortega posted earlier in this thread which includes Gandalf for scale (And please, this is absolutely nothing against the wonderful job you've done, Chris.) You can see that the dwarves which retain more human proportions such as Dori, Fili, Kili, and Dwalin, when scaled to close to the proper height, do in fact look somewhat disconcertingly like merely miniature humans—kind of like the Lilliputian effect, or George Lucas' brownies but at not the same degree of miniaturization. Thorin, on the other hand, does look correct—his head is the same size as Gandalf's—however, the correctness is due to most of his body being hidden. If it were fully revealed, we would find that he is standing on his knees and is in fact the same size as Gandalf.

I'm sure Jackson's effects team must have this whole thing worked out, however the publicity photos do seem to present some problems which indicate to me what we've seen might not be exactly what we get on-screen.

Man is but an ass if he go about to expound this dream.


kiwifan
Rohan

Jul 18 2011, 11:23pm

Post #367 of 401 (7105 views)
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why aren't we worthy? [In reply to] Can't Post

They (TIME) and etc. may be giants as far as printed copies/other forms of news circulation go
but they write for money
we write for loveHeart

(and Mr Crere writes for both, I hope Wink)

I'm beginning to feel like some sort of renegade --- someone get me some Longbottom Leaf, I need relax a bit Tongue

'Goodness gracious, you really are a messie!' 'Oh no, I'm not, these are all just mathoms...'


Richie Rich
Rivendell


Jul 19 2011, 12:27am

Post #368 of 401 (7175 views)
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Thorin and Company Wallpaper (my version) [In reply to] Can't Post

I really like the wallpaper y'all put together for us, but I couldn't resist coming up with my own version: http://img824.imageshack.us/.../thorinwallpaper.jpg (the size is my desktop, 1680 x 1050). It's obviously quite similar to what you guys provided for us, but I didn't have much of a choice with good ole' Thorin having all sorts of bits and pieces chopped off in the official photo release! Tongue



(This post was edited by Richie Rich on Jul 19 2011, 12:29am)


mulubinba
Rivendell

Jul 19 2011, 12:32am

Post #369 of 401 (7107 views)
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Great attempt [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks Smile


Ataahua
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 19 2011, 12:33am

Post #370 of 401 (7027 views)
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Wow. [In reply to] Can't Post

If I had socks, they would be knocked off.

Superb work, RR!

Celebrimbor: "Pretty rings..."
Dwarves: "Pretty rings..."
Men: "Pretty rings..."
Sauron: "Mine's better."

"Ah, how ironic, the addictive qualities of Sauron’s master weapon led to its own destruction. Which just goes to show, kids - if you want two small and noble souls to succeed on a mission of dire importance... send an evil-minded b*****d with them too." - Gandalf's Diaries, final par, by Ufthak.


Ataahua's stories


Vellamo
Rivendell


Jul 19 2011, 12:43am

Post #371 of 401 (7037 views)
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Me too [In reply to] Can't Post

TORn deserved this final revelation hands down. Congrats!


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Jul 19 2011, 12:47am

Post #372 of 401 (7065 views)
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I like your version. Very nice. It looks official. [In reply to] Can't Post

Keep up the good work! KS

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
Life is an adventure, not a contest.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.
Photobucket



Captain Salt
Tol Eressea


Jul 19 2011, 12:49am

Post #373 of 401 (7087 views)
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Probably should know this... [In reply to] Can't Post

but what's "flet", again? Angelic

I would rather be watching Peter Jackson's "The Hobbit" and Ridley Scott's "Prometheus"...it's going to be a long few years.


Phibbus
Rohan


Jul 19 2011, 12:51am

Post #374 of 401 (7045 views)
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Excellent work [In reply to] Can't Post

Very polished composition.

Man is but an ass if he go about to expound this dream.


Altaira
Superuser / Moderator


Jul 19 2011, 1:03am

Post #375 of 401 (7063 views)
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Bravo! That was priceless [In reply to] Can't Post

*wipes away tears of laughter* Best laugh I've had in a while. Thanks RR! Laugh


Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.



"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower

"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase



TORn Calendar

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