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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
BIFUR - NORI - BALIN not yet cast
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carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 12:29am

Post #1 of 55 (801 views)
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BIFUR - NORI - BALIN not yet cast Can't Post

why no news on these three roles? (unless i've missed something).

I've said from the start BALIN is the lynchpin of the 5-film project, second only to Gollum, Bilbo, and Gandalf inthis role importance to bridging PJ:THE HOBBIT and PJ:LOTR. I've also said this role would be suitable for a old school star...the 'old man' on a last crusade type thing. The delay in announcing casting of this role could be an indication that it is being held back as "BIG NEWS" perhaps to coincide with the official announcement of McKellen's return as gandalf.

Okay, BALIN is my obsession, i've beat it to death, i know.

But here's the funny thing. If Balin has consistently been Topic One with me on these forums, the only other topic I've dedicated key strokes to on these forums is the topic of female dwarves and the wisdom/non wisdom of having Walsh/Boyens/Jackson 'go there' with one or more members of Thorin's Company. On at least two occasions over the last 2 years, without passing judgement on whether they OUGHT TO interpret any of the company as female, I've presented my reasons for thinking that IF they did that, the two most likely candidates would be BIFUR and NORI.....Shocked....the only dwarves, aside from Balin..for whom casting has not been revealed!!


(This post was edited by carrioncrow on Nov 21 2010, 12:30am)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 1:19am

Post #2 of 55 (391 views)
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I agree that "BALIN is the lynchpin" of the Hobbit. [In reply to] Can't Post

I do not agree with casting or writing any of Thorin & Company as a female Dwarf. They could include Dis in the background material, and though se is not in the Book, she is involved with the story.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


TheGoblinKing
Rohan

Nov 21 2010, 4:45am

Post #3 of 55 (353 views)
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Besides We Have A Female Elf [In reply to] Can't Post

That's should balance the female character situation for the Hobbit. And there's Galadrial maybe.


duats
Grey Havens

Nov 21 2010, 5:13am

Post #4 of 55 (359 views)
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I have a hunch [In reply to] Can't Post

That we'll see more casting either this week or next.


TheGoblinKing
Rohan

Nov 21 2010, 5:31am

Post #5 of 55 (371 views)
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I Still Think [In reply to] Can't Post

They are waiting for slower news for all movie news is on HP right now and also usually agreements are made for signing of cast members so they are likely casting many at once while still trying to broker McKellan deal. And other returning cast members

Still say Andy Serkis will likely voice Smaug or wear the motion capture suit for The Dragons face.


merlwynd
Rivendell


Nov 21 2010, 9:28am

Post #6 of 55 (338 views)
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my source [In reply to] Can't Post

is still in contention but not for any of these roles alas.....time will tell. Perhaps they will all be complete unknowns!

MERLWYND
Bard's case to Thorin


Welsh hero
Gondor

Nov 21 2010, 10:58am

Post #7 of 55 (316 views)
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just wait [In reply to] Can't Post

We got until filming begins

http://www.facebook.com/hobbitnz


carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 4:43pm

Post #8 of 55 (267 views)
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again. [In reply to] Can't Post

i'm not saying they should or should not do it. I'm just pointing out that the two memebrs of the company who are IMHO the 'best case' for being female: Nori and Bifur are two of the casting names being withheld. I found that a curious coincidence (?)

on a related note:

Yesterday i watched HOW TO TRAIN YOUR DRAGON. If you notice, among the adult vikings there are several female members of the group who fully participate in the raids on the dragons. This is just presented as 'the way things are' no plot point etc just gal vikings 'going abroad at great need' (the need in their case being a threat to the existence of their viking village. THE HOBBIT could chose this path (portraying a few of the company as female but basic removing sexuality from the equation) but the what would doing so accomplish?

In the case of HOW TO TRAIN YOUR DRAGON where the hero is being raised by a father...showing these female members of the raiding party was just a way of short-hand informing the audience that "Yes there are moms in the village and they are more or less co-equal" this message is reinforced by the Bifur/Bofur...er...i mean Rufnut/Tufnut brother/sister team


carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 4:44pm

Post #9 of 55 (270 views)
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do you think [In reply to] Can't Post

Serkis' audio work on the Screwtape Letters was a sort of warm up for Smaug? Wink


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 4:55pm

Post #10 of 55 (281 views)
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In my opinion casting any member of Thorin & Company as a femal Dwarf [In reply to] Can't Post

Would be a betrayal of the book. Dwarf women were rare and rarely traveled let alone go on some wild adventure to reclaim treasure from...you know the rest of the rant.
Again, I would say that a female Dwarf might appear in these two movies and she might be played by a male or female actor as the genders were indistinguishable to outsiders so if indeed there is a female dwarf the audience will have to be told or, in some manner, let in on the fact for it to be effective. So what would be the point in doing this?

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 4:56pm

Post #11 of 55 (279 views)
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i'm not interested [In reply to] Can't Post

in "balancing the female situation". whatever that means.

The only justification i would give for doing it would be to play out the possibility/joke set forward by Tolkien himself and mentioned by Gimli and Aragorn in Peter Jackson's films.

Dwarf women are few, more or less co-equal with dwarf men, go abroad only at great need (I think the Quest for Erebor qualfies).
I don't know if they'll incorporate this possibility. I'm perfectly happy if they don't. But trust Walsh/Boyens could pull it off satisfactorily and perhaps even brilliantly..


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 5:03pm

Post #12 of 55 (271 views)
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I think that Smaug will be voiced by two people (One male & one Female) [In reply to] Can't Post

These will be synchronized and enhanced. Andy could be the Male Voice. I would nominate Cate Blanchett for the female counterpart.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 5:03pm

Post #13 of 55 (261 views)
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link to Serkis as screwtape [In reply to] Can't Post

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FLfYd2nd5NI


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 5:07pm

Post #14 of 55 (274 views)
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The Quest for Erebor does not qualify. [In reply to] Can't Post

Dwarf women go abroad only at great need because they are being protected from danger. I think confronting a Dragon qualifies as dangerous.


Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


macfalk
Valinor


Nov 21 2010, 5:33pm

Post #15 of 55 (274 views)
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Voiced by two people [In reply to] Can't Post

Kangi I don't think that will work very well. Yes, Lee & McKellen did it on Gandalf the White's intro, but that was just a few lines. Smaug is going to have quite many lines. I'm not sure if it's possible to synch it very well (honestly I didnt think Gandalf/Saruman synch worked very well)



The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


Voronwë_the_Faithful
Valinor

Nov 21 2010, 5:40pm

Post #16 of 55 (279 views)
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McKellen claims that was all him [In reply to] Can't Post

Like most people, I thought that the scene contained a clever blending of Sir Christopher and Sir Ian's voices, but I've seen an interview in which he claims that that was all him, and that he was mimicking Chris Lee's voice in the part of it that sounds like Saruman.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

www.arda-reconstructed.com


macfalk
Valinor


Nov 21 2010, 5:49pm

Post #17 of 55 (272 views)
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Didnt PJ [In reply to] Can't Post

Say that he combined both actor's voices on the extended edition making of DVD somewhere. Might be something wrong with my memory



The greatest adventure is what lies ahead.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 5:51pm

Post #18 of 55 (245 views)
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It can be done and done well [In reply to] Can't Post

and since the listener is not intended to recognize the constituent voices they can be manipulated in any number of ways to blend. All it requires is a good state of the art recording studio.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


Voronwë_the_Faithful
Valinor

Nov 21 2010, 5:59pm

Post #19 of 55 (257 views)
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You may be right [In reply to] Can't Post

I vaguely remember something like that, too. But that's all the more why I was so surprised to see McKellen's comments.

'But very bright were the stars upon the margin of the world, when at times the clouds about the West were drawn aside.'

www.arda-reconstructed.com


Auraran
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 6:18pm

Post #20 of 55 (262 views)
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I agree with you on both points [In reply to] Can't Post

Balin is a key character, and a linch-pin to all the series.

Whether he does it or not, PJ and team have undoubtedly considered a female dwarf, for all the reasons you cited. And yes, they could pull it off if they do include one.

Bilbo: I'm glad I can't be mistaken for a Dwarf, as I have no beard. (Turning around) Say, why don't you have a beard?

Dwarf-maid: None of your business.


dormouse
Half-elven

Nov 21 2010, 6:38pm

Post #21 of 55 (237 views)
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I can't see any reason why they would introduce a female dwarf.... [In reply to] Can't Post

After all, it didn't seem to bother them that the nine members of the Fellowship were all male.

It's such an obvious and distracting deviation from the book as it would draw too much attention away from Bilbo, Thorin and Gandalf. But I'm sure Peter Jackson and co are wise enough not to even consider it.


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 6:38pm

Post #22 of 55 (232 views)
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Dwarf women have beards.// [In reply to] Can't Post

 

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


carrioncrow
Lorien

Nov 21 2010, 10:39pm

Post #23 of 55 (230 views)
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Deviathion from the book? [In reply to] Can't Post

Which book? THE HOBBIT?

are there any references in THE HOBBIT to Bifur having a beard, or any references at all to Bifur's gender, for that matter?

there are reasons not to cast Bifur as female, but fear of 'deviations' from the source text is not one of them.


(This post was edited by carrioncrow on Nov 21 2010, 10:46pm)


Kangi Ska
Half-elven


Nov 21 2010, 10:52pm

Post #24 of 55 (217 views)
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All adult Dwarves have beards. [In reply to] Can't Post

Check the appendix of LotR for the linage of the Dwarves in Thorin's group. They are all male.

Kangi Ska Resident Trickster & Wicked White Crebain
New Zealand is Middle-earth & today life is good.

At night you can not tell if crows are black or white.

Photobucket


dormouse
Half-elven

Nov 21 2010, 11:00pm

Post #25 of 55 (224 views)
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It's clear in the book [In reply to] Can't Post

... that Tolkien intended the dwarves to be male. So yes, I'd say that casting one of the dwarves as female would be a deviation from the book.

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