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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Lord of the Rings:
Are you up for some GOLD Nuggets? (Geeky Observation List Discussions!)
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grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 9:44pm

Post #26 of 39 (262 views)
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I'm going to add this to the tidbits list. [In reply to] Can't Post

It's a great observation on the most significant journey for Aragorn... dealing with his fate and lineage. Thanks :)


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 15 2007, 9:47pm

Post #27 of 39 (286 views)
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Take a look at Frodo's hand [In reply to] Can't Post

as he lies on Weathertop just before being stabbed by the Witch-king. As he holds his hand up with the Ring on his finger... his hand looks distorted, too. ;)


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


stormcrow20
Gondor


Apr 16 2007, 1:46am

Post #28 of 39 (266 views)
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I believe that as well. Perhaps.... [In reply to] Can't Post

...it was a sudden surge of awareness, information and power that caused Galadriel's surprised expression. Maybe akin to the breaking of a dam. In that line of thinking, I can certainly understand how any Ring of power, not just the One, can become a major burden to its bearer.

What lead me to believe it was the realization of Nenya's power that surprised her, was the apparent physical affect; her hair. Wind is used several times as a demonstration of power, such as Gandalf and Galadriel's transformations, and Sauron's destruction.

Are there other similarly "windy" moments?

Expect me when you see me.

(This post was edited by stormcrow20 on Apr 16 2007, 1:47am)


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 16 2007, 10:21am

Post #29 of 39 (253 views)
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I know it was Sammath Naur [In reply to] Can't Post

but there was quite a wind getting kicked up as Frodo stood on the edge ;)

Saruman's hair was blowing around a lot at the storming of Isengard by the Ents (but he was outside, afterall ;)

When Frodo was on Amon Hen looking onto Barad-dur and the Eye, the effect was very windy-looking!

When Elrond talked about "there are those who dwell in the mountain" to Aragorn at Dwarrowdelf (just before bringing out Anduril) there's quite a windstorm in Theoden's tent!

When Sauron is destroyed and Barad-dur falls, the army of the West is blown about.

I'd really love to come up with an example of Frodo cause a bit of a stir, but other than the Sammath Naur... nothing.

It's quite peaceful around Aragorn, too... surprisingly.

The King of the Dead makes Aragorn's torch in the Paths of the Dead quite active (no wind in caves, usually).

any others?


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


FarFromHome
Valinor


Apr 16 2007, 6:28pm

Post #30 of 39 (275 views)
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When we see Arwen [In reply to] Can't Post

after Elrond shows her her future (including Aragorn's death) in TTT, the wind blows the curtains and her hair as we see her weeping face.

There seems to be quite a wind inside the entrance to the Paths of the Dead that blows Aragorn's and Legolas' cloaks as they go through the doorway.

When Sauron is destroyed the first time (after Isildur cuts the Ring off his finger) we see the hair of elvish soldiers blowing around.

There's a lot of wind at Edoras, of course, but that was just a fact of life there! There is the particular scene with the wind blowing the royal standard down from the flagpole, and it's especially windy when Theoden drives away Grima.


...and the sails were drawn up, and the wind blew,
and slowly the ship slipped away down the long grey firth;
and the light of the glass of Galadriel that Frodo bore
glimmered and was lost.


weaver
Half-elven

Apr 16 2007, 7:40pm

Post #31 of 39 (260 views)
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..the presence of wind.... [In reply to] Can't Post

...there are many scenes in the films where the wind is evident -- I have wondered when it's a practical choice and when it's an artistic decision by the film makers. In some scenes, it seems to be used to just add some sense of motion to otherwise static scenes. In others, it seems similar to the non-scripted aleotoric music (I learned that from Magpie!), in that it creates a sense of things being uncertain and unsettled. Often, there's just a quiet stirring of the air around a character (there are lots of Frodo and Aragorn shots like this, IIRC). And then there's those pretty strong gusty moments, like at Mt. Doom, where it seems to be used to underscore the big forces that are in play.

My favorite windy moment is the way the wind whips through Theoden's tent when Elrond and Aragorn are talking about calling on the Army of the Dead. When Elrond says, "there are those who dwell in the mountain..." that sort of evil draft comes in and you get that great "whooosh" sound, Theoden's armor rattles on the stand, the tent flaps get blown around, Aragorn's clothes and hair swirl around him -- and then we get that quick image of the King of the Dead's face. A classic moment in these films, and to me, comparable to the book moments where everyone's face goes dark and a shadow covers the sun whenever someone says "the Paths of the Dead."

Either way, you kind of expect people to start making out their wills....

Weaver



weaver
Half-elven

Apr 16 2007, 7:45pm

Post #32 of 39 (244 views)
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you're welcome... [In reply to] Can't Post

I think that's my first contribution to your lists -- I'm honored!

Thanks for the great gift of them to all of us -- what a resource! Lossefalme's GOLD discussion are going to be a lot of fun, and glad they will help to generate some new appreciation and attention on all that geeky research you compiled for us. Hats off to both of you!

Weaver



Rivendweller
Lorien


Apr 16 2007, 11:41pm

Post #33 of 39 (314 views)
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You're right!! [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
as he lies on Weathertop just before being stabbed by the Witch-king. As he holds his hand up with the Ring on his finger... his hand looks distorted, too. ;)



Another GOLD Nugget I have missed noticing on my umpteenth viewings!! It is just incredible to see so much book detail come to life. It never ceases to amaze and delight me each and every time.

I recently read on another thread posted by...was it Silverlode (?) on the finding of the LOTR book in the cafeteria portion of the warehouse they purchased for studios. I had to read it rather quickly as I was at work, but I felt a thrill of realization that these films were meant to be made. Tolkien was meant to write the books just as Peter was meant to film them!!


Whether because Frodo was so worn by his long pains, wound of knife, and venomous sting, and sorrow, fear, and homeless wandering, or because some gift of final strength was given to him, Sam lifted Frodo with no more difficulty than if he were carrying a hobbit child pig-a-back....
Frodo opened his eyes and drew a breath....'Thank you, Sam,' he said in a cracked whisper. 'How far is there to go?' --RotK, "Mount Doom"
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Formerly A'amel from days gone by.


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 17 2007, 4:57pm

Post #34 of 39 (244 views)
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That story STILL [In reply to] Can't Post

gives me chills! All of this via Peter and Tolkien... the gifts that just keep giving :)


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 17 2007, 5:02pm

Post #35 of 39 (240 views)
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Bwhahaha!!! [In reply to] Can't Post

Making out of the wills, fersher!!!! You got me there!

I love how Elrond says that line... with a hint of hesitation. These films are so rich with movements, moments, emotional environments... it's hard to sort it all out! We're so lucky!!!


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 17 2007, 5:02pm

Post #36 of 39 (263 views)
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Arwen and the curtains! YES! [In reply to] Can't Post

That's a perfect example! It's fun to try and find all of these :D


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 19 2007, 8:41am

Post #37 of 39 (302 views)
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To be 'meant' to play a certain role [In reply to] Can't Post

in the Story... Okay, the job to be done may give you hell to do while you're at it, just as it did for Frodo and certainly did in a way for JRRT, and later also for PJ; but then, look at the result: in each one of those two latter cases (to speak only of them), it has been the achievement of a lifetime, and one which reached millions of people almost everywhere, influencing most of them hopefully for the better!!!
For PJ, we may still hope that the opportunity to continue the same achievement with 'The Hobbit' will not pass him by in vain - we may even pray for that, you and me, and others who believe like we do that such opportunities are given indeed to those 'meant' for them... not in the dire 'predestination' Calvinist way of understanding such things (God forbid!!!), but on the contrary as the best way for each of us to gradually develop to our full inner potential, at the same time as giving to the world those outer 'gifts' gramma is so rightly talking about in her own answer to you... Heart
Perhaps we could pray - as I invite, by the way, everyone to do, in a new post here on Movie Discussion...
Pray that... (let's have some fun about it)... that PJ, Fran & Philippa go out and just start exploring the spots where they would like to shoot 'The Hobbit'... and check what books might be lying around there!!!Wink
Maybe at Weta they should start keeping a copy of 'The Hobbit' in each room... and to read aloud everyday a passage of it there! Laugh
I'm joking, but still, if it were done with the required love and real intention to help it happen, it certainly WOULD help, don't you think?!?... Smile

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


Loresilme
Valinor


Apr 22 2007, 12:04am

Post #38 of 39 (224 views)
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Digging for GOLD [In reply to] Can't Post

Finally got a chance to kick back and read through this list - what fun!


1. How many of these 29 observations did you notice on your own? Seriously. There are some pretty geeky observations in there. If you did notice most of them, how many times did you have to watch the movie to pick them up?
Well, I always have to start off my replies to Movie board question discussions by saying: I am a movie-firster Smile. So being a movie-firster, of course, I was aware of none of these at the time. But that didn't stop me from being totally carried away by the Prologue, right from the beginning.

2. How important are all of these details to the introduction? Does all of the attention to detail have more of a subconscious effect or an overt one? Either way, would this introduction be compelling enough that it would be just as effective without so much attention to detail? I mean, a lot of people seeing the movie had never read the books.
Yes, but it lent a tremendous amount of realism to these scenes. As others have stated, from almost the first scene of FOTR, between the visuals and the sound (that music and the Elven speech) you are presented with and immersed in a totally realistic world, complete with a history and all its historical (seemingly) factual detail.

You know how people use the word 'cheesy' to describe fantasy or science fiction movies that just don’t seem, … real? I think this type of 'attention to detail' is what made the PJ LOTR films so absolutely un-cheesy. It's simply, so 'real', it just captures and draws you in right away.

3. Do you think we read anything into some of these observations? Take #26 or #28, for example. These are really wonderful, symbolic observations, but were they intentional on the part of PJ, et al or were they just “happy accidents?” (If this is addressed in the Commentaries, I am woefully behind in watching them and I apologize.) Do we see connections because they are really there or because we want them to be there?
Maybe it's that right brain thing … the subconscious making visual connections where perhaps they were entirely coincidental. Unless of course (was it Jung?) who said there is no such thing as a coincidence?

4. I have to ask: what is your favorite geeky Prophecy observation and why?
That they included Cirdan in this scene. Because I really liked The Sil and I would love to have someone make a movie of one or more of those tales. Not only the 'big' stories from The Sil, but some of the smaller events that were just hinted at, for instance I would like to see the story of Celebrian. So I like anything that links back to the history of the Elves.

5. Just out of curiosity, how many of you knew or realized right away that it was Galadriel speaking during The Prophesy when you first saw the film? How did you know? (I’ll admit I didn’t figure it out immediately.)
I didn't know who she was supposed to be. I didn't even connect her to the "Elf woman" depicted in that scene. (It is so funny to remember how my brain was labeling and interpreting what was on screen, that first time or two I saw the movies, in comparison to how I describe them now. My noggin was working feverishly to try to assimilate everything that was happening, and piece together the story… and many things just didn't connect for a long time.

Thanks Lossefalme!



Lossefalme
Gondor


Apr 23 2007, 4:27pm

Post #39 of 39 (254 views)
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It's really hard for me to imagine what these movies would have been like [In reply to] Can't Post

if I hadn't read LotR so many times. I actually admire people for doing it because I would think that they would be incredibly confusing. Maybe you just don't get all the nuances so it isn't that bad. All I know is that they were so well done that people were inspired to read after seeing one or more of them and that is a rare gift, indeed. Thanks for taking the time to share, Loresilme. Btw, I'm not sure that I believe in coincidence, either...

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Join us every Thursday in the Movie Discussion Forum for GOLD Nuggets, an exploration of the Geeky Observation Lists maintained by our very own grammaboodawg.


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