Our Sponsor Sideshow Collectibles Send us News
Lord of the Rings Tolkien
Search Tolkien
Lord of The RingsTheOneRing.net - Forged By And For Fans Of JRR Tolkien
Lord of The Rings Serving Middle-Earth Since The First Age

Lord of the Rings Movie News - J.R.R. Tolkien
Do you enjoy the 100% volunteer, not for profit services of TheOneRing.net?
Consider a donation!

  Main Index   Search Posts   Who's Online   Log in
The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Main:
Somebody ought to post this before Easter is over

Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 9 2007, 1:08am

Post #1 of 24 (268 views)
Shortcut
Somebody ought to post this before Easter is over Can't Post

But Sam lay back, and stared with open mouth, and for a moment, between bewilderment and great joy, he could not answer. At last he gasped: ‘Gandalf! I thought you were dead! But then I thought I was dead myself. Is everything sad going to come untrue? What’s happened to the world?’
‘A great Shadow has departed,’ said Gandalf, and then he laughed and the sound was like music, or like water in a parched land; and as he listened the thought came to Sam that he had not heard laughter, the pure sound of merriment, for days upon days without count. It fell upon his ears like the echo of all the joys he had ever known. But he himself burst into tears. Then, as a sweet rain will pass down a wind of spring and the sun will shine out the clearer, his tears ceased, and his laughter welled up, and laughing he sprang from his bed.
‘How do I feel?’ he cried. ‘Well, I don’t know how to say it. I feel, I feel’—he waved his arms in the air—‘I feel like spring after winter, and sun on the leaves; and like trumpets and harps and all the songs I have ever heard!’

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Finding Frodo
Tol Eressea


Apr 9 2007, 2:44am

Post #2 of 24 (121 views)
Shortcut
Is everything sad going to come untrue? [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for posting that, Aunt Dora. Perfect.

Where's Frodo?


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 9 2007, 6:56am

Post #3 of 24 (117 views)
Shortcut
Well, this is what I chose as my footer/signature, [In reply to] Can't Post

so it tells you how much I love those words by Sam, this wonderful question he asks, about what would be indeed the most eucatastrophic moment imaginable for the Story, that Story which is still going on in our times too...
Yes, this is the Moment which I am counting on and waiting for myself, just like Sam!... Heart

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 9 2007, 7:10am

Post #4 of 24 (114 views)
Shortcut
Isn't our dear JRRT a most incredible, extraordinary being, a great soul, [In reply to] Can't Post

for having had such joyful and beautiful feelings himself, and for having managed to express them with such exquisite simplicity and beauty???...
Not being especially a christian, I don't link all this especially to Easter, but I don't mind if you do, as it prompted you to post this, possibly my top favorite lines by Tolkien!...
Thank you then, Aunt Dora Baggins! Heart

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 9 2007, 12:34pm

Post #5 of 24 (105 views)
Shortcut
*smiles* [In reply to] Can't Post

Y'know, when you think about it, Easter is never "over"... Smile


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And when Sam heard that he laughed aloud for shear delight, and he stood up and cried: 'O great glory and splendour! And all my wishes have come true!'"


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 9 2007, 2:06pm

Post #6 of 24 (89 views)
Shortcut
*high five* Abso-freakin-lutely!!!! :D // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 9 2007, 2:43pm

Post #7 of 24 (116 views)
Shortcut
Well, [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
Not being especially a christian, I don't link all this especially to Easter, but I don't mind if you do,


I'm not a Christian either, but I was when I first read LotR back in 1970. When I stopped being a Christian I didn't go away mad, and I still love the story of Jesus as a story. As I get older, I'm discovering that what I believe isn't as important as what I love.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


silneldor
Half-elven


Apr 10 2007, 12:14am

Post #8 of 24 (94 views)
Shortcut
Well said, sweet Auntie:). [In reply to] Can't Post

 

"Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez



A little bit of Rivendell to warm the home



silneldor
Half-elven


Apr 10 2007, 2:03am

Post #9 of 24 (99 views)
Shortcut
I wrote something recently [In reply to] Can't Post

and i could not decide to post it. I thought it may be a little too leaning but now i think maybe it is worded well enough to have all of the 'spiritual disciplines' of Love relate to it. So if i may, i would like to humbly offer this.

I can see how Tolkien was overwhelmed with the living transcendency that came from or through him. From the beginning his love opened a window to a Light. It all started with the humblest simplicity of a thought, likened to a bit of 'soft, fine dust and seed'. It flowered then with a life of it's own in a profusion of growth. It was able from there to carry him and ultimately us to fruition with help from the sublime; serene elements from the natural world, to a Joy beyond description. A Light then found entrance to us and was able to fill us with the essence of knowing, of who we are as human spirits, loving human spirits. That knowing of it All can only be expressed in overflow as tears.

To quote someone with hairy toes, 'Geez, I love this story.' :)

"Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez



A little bit of Rivendell to warm the home



Finding Frodo
Tol Eressea


Apr 10 2007, 3:46am

Post #10 of 24 (88 views)
Shortcut
I just noticed that yesterday! [In reply to] Can't Post

One of my favorite quotes from the book. Great choice, and I'm glad Aunt Dora posted it on Easter, the ultimate eucatastrophe.

Where's Frodo?


Finding Frodo
Tol Eressea


Apr 10 2007, 3:49am

Post #11 of 24 (87 views)
Shortcut
oops [In reply to] Can't Post

I just read your other post below. I didn't mean to proselytize!

Where's Frodo?


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 10 2007, 6:57am

Post #12 of 24 (80 views)
Shortcut
LOL!... No problem with me. / [In reply to] Can't Post

 

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 10 2007, 7:16am

Post #13 of 24 (83 views)
Shortcut
I stopped [In reply to] Can't Post

being a christian in 1970 too, and didn't go away mad either, but read LOTR only in 1975, when all those mental associations and automatic references to christian special dates had already gone from my mind - I guess the fact that I was living from 1972 on in a country where christian holy days aren't widely celebrated (except Christmas, but not really with the true christian significance either), while you still live in a predominantly and culturally christian country, where no one can possibly forget about Easter, strongly contributes to this different result in both our minds!
In our hearts, it seems to be the same result, though, for I could say the same as what you say so nicely! Smile

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


mae govannen
Tol Eressea

Apr 10 2007, 7:26am

Post #14 of 24 (75 views)
Shortcut
Thank you for sharing this beautiful piece, [In reply to] Can't Post

where you do manage to express a lot of the central reason why I love Tolkien so much too... Heart

'Is everything sad going to come untrue?'
(Sam, 'The Field of Cormallen', in 'The Return of the King'.)


dernwyn
Forum Admin / Moderator


Apr 10 2007, 11:04am

Post #15 of 24 (136 views)
Shortcut
"It had begun [In reply to] Can't Post

with a leaf caught in the wind, and it became a tree; and the tree grew, sending out innumerable branches, and thrusting out the most fantastic roots."

And beyond - far, far beyond: "until their hearts, wounded with sweet words, overflowed, and their joy was like swords, and they passed in thought out to regions where pain and delight flow together and tears are the very wine of blessedness."

Yes. Smile


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"And when Sam heard that he laughed aloud for shear delight, and he stood up and cried: 'O great glory and splendour! And all my wishes have come true!'"


grammaboodawg
Immortal


Apr 10 2007, 2:10pm

Post #16 of 24 (66 views)
Shortcut
*applause & smiles* That was wonderful! :) Thank you! // [In reply to] Can't Post

 


sample sample
Trust him... The Hobbit is coming!

"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."


TORn's Observations Lists


Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 10 2007, 2:46pm

Post #17 of 24 (80 views)
Shortcut
Have you read the Essay on Fairy Stories? [In reply to] Can't Post

Tolkien mentions Easter as the great eucastrophe in incredibly eloquent and moving language in that essay. You can hear the golden trumpets blowing.


And even though I no longer 'believe', I still find the Easter story moves me to the core.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 10 2007, 4:05pm

Post #18 of 24 (67 views)
Shortcut
A beautiful tribute to the Professor. Thanks for sharing it!// [In reply to] Can't Post

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


Ginger
Lorien

Apr 10 2007, 5:03pm

Post #19 of 24 (69 views)
Shortcut
Beautiful, sil. [In reply to] Can't Post

Thanks for sharing this.

*note to self*
Learn new boards. "Sticky" is not an admonishment to a tornsib named Sticky.


silneldor
Half-elven


Apr 11 2007, 3:10am

Post #20 of 24 (73 views)
Shortcut
I feel i must add [In reply to] Can't Post

that the Christian element has still, for me, real substance but it is through (finally) finding someone who is willing and capable to delve strongly and deeply with abandon and without any agenda to envision who Jesus REALLY was and what were the real elements of his ministry before the 'elaboration' through time took place. I am reading John Shelby Spong.
Nothing is beyond testing in the search for truth. If something cannot stand testing, it is not worthy. I feel it is our right and obligation through Conscience.
What i wrote below, i feel is by no means outside that element.
The only thing else to say here is, i love you guys:).

The commonality of all religions or spiritual aspirations has to be Love. If it is not, human kind is nothing more than another amoral virus.

Please forgive me for carrying on so. I just see so much pain and death justified in the name of religion, or in the end, lack thereof.

"Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez



A little bit of Rivendell to warm the home



Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 11 2007, 3:34pm

Post #21 of 24 (76 views)
Shortcut
Now I have to confess that I can't stand Spong. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I am reading John Shelby Spong.
Nothing is beyond testing in the search for truth. If something cannot stand testing, it is not worthy. I feel it is our right and obligation through Conscience.


I agree 100% with what you said about truth. I've read everything I could find by Spong, and Crossan, and other writers like them. He strikes me as intellectually dishonest, because he seems to come to the evidence with his own agenda. I get a feeling of arrogance from him, that he, of course, understands Jesus and all those other people don't, when IMHO the truth is that the historical Jesus is pretty much shrouded in the mists of myth and antiquity and is probably beyond discovery. But maybe I'm misreading Spong. I'm certainly no scholar myself.

I'm curious about the historical Jesus, but it's not particularly important to me. Because for me the story is the important thing. If there were a historical Gandalf who was different than the Gandalf in LotR, I would still love LotR.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


silneldor
Half-elven


Apr 12 2007, 12:58am

Post #22 of 24 (67 views)
Shortcut
I feel the original Jesus [In reply to] Can't Post

and his teachings mean everything. I feel if i can understand that, everything else in the 'story' line and how i have always suspected over time, has changed does not matter.
I feel he is concise and takes steps slowly and logically and supports everything he brings up. I like the way he writes, straight forward without a lot of waggling and i feel no arrogance.
I wish you would tell me Auntie what you think his agenda is. I know he wants a Christianity that is truly personal and not removed by the intermediarary of organized part of religion and other dependencies. That spirituality is not about pain and guilt but love, in accepting ourselves , and everyone else with the realization that we are always growing. Such ideas do not reflect arrogance. There is the matter of ego and our place in the world with other spiritualities.
I do not get the feeling that he is a know-it-all. I feel he is respectful. He is just delving into the matter as his logic and conscience dictates. He just calls it the way he sees it and writes accordingly. :)Sort of reminds me of Tolkien.
"We Christians are pilgrims walking into the mystery of God, not soldiers marching off to war. There is a great difference."

Good night Auntie:)

"Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez



A little bit of Rivendell to warm the home



Aunt Dora Baggins
Half-elven


Apr 12 2007, 2:19pm

Post #23 of 24 (63 views)
Shortcut
Spong [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I wish you would tell me Auntie what you think his agenda is. I know he wants a Christianity that is truly personal and not removed by the intermediarary of organized part of religion and other dependencies. That spirituality is not about pain and guilt but love, in accepting ourselves , and everyone else with the realization that we are always growing.


Well, it's been a while since I read Spong so all I mostly remember is a gut feeling, not specifics. I guess I feel that Jesus is a mirror and that we tend to see in him what we value, whether or not that has anything to do with who the historical man is. Spong values the same things I do, so that's not my issue with him. It's hard to put my finger on. I think it just bothers me as much when people I agree with start with what looks to me like preconceived notions and then selectively choose biblical passages as it does when people I don't agree with do the same thing. My guess is that the historical Jesus was a very Jewish rabbi with a world view that was steeped in the thinking of his time, as radical as it may have been. And trying to make him into a modern liberal bothers me, even though I'm a modern liberal myself. On the other hand, I'm comfortable doing that with the mythological Jesus, because I'm not trying to rewrite history when I do that.

Don't know if any of that makes sense, and I'm kind of sorry I ever replied to your first post, because you apparently are getting a lot of good from Spong, and I really don't want to mess that up. I have a bad habit of shooting off my mouth online when a little reflection and silence might be better. Well, I guess I chose my nickname accurately.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


silneldor
Half-elven


Apr 13 2007, 1:06am

Post #24 of 24 (62 views)
Shortcut
I really do appreciate your input. [In reply to] Can't Post

Yes, he was and the gospels were very Jewish also. That is something not highlighted in regards to history.

Viewing Jesus as a modern liberal (regarding everyone with acceptance though love is the main theme i feel) is not that farfetched an idea. There were good solid reasons he drew thousands and lasted thousands of years. It had to be quite a bit of difference from the orthodox view. In thinking that, i think it is not rewriting history. I feel comfortable it is close to true history.
As he says, things get misconstrued because the gentile interpretation of Jewish writings caused misconceptions which mistakenly lead to literalism.

I did enjoy you speaking your mind. Good testing going on:). Problems only arise in the end when fear or the ego take on the belligerent mode.
Please do not hesitate if something interesting is in your thought comes up. You can't mess up anything . In truth finding and soul searching, truth can't be found until you mess up the messed up stuff:D.

"Tolkien, like Lewis, believed that, through story, the real world would become a more magical place, full of meaning. We see its patterns and colors in a fresh way. The recovery of a true view of the world applies both to individual things, like hills and stones, and to the cosmic - the depths of space and time itself. For in sub-creation, in Tolkien's view, there is a "survey" of space and time. Reality is captured on a miniature scale. Through stories like The Lord of the Rings, a renewed view of things is given, illuminating the homely, the spiritial, the physical, and the moral dimensions of the world."

Tolkien and C.S. Lewis- The Gift of Friendship -Duriez



A little bit of Rivendell to warm the home


 
 

Search for (options) Powered by Gossamer Forum v.1.2.3

home | advertising | contact us | back to top | search news | join list | Content Rating

This site is maintained and updated by fans of The Lord of the Rings, and is in no way affiliated with Tolkien Enterprises or the Tolkien Estate. We in no way claim the artwork displayed to be our own. Copyrights and trademarks for the books, films, articles, and other promotional materials are held by their respective owners and their use is allowed under the fair use clause of the Copyright Law. Design and original photography however are copyright © 1999-2012 TheOneRing.net. Binary hosting provided by Nexcess.net

Do not follow this link, or your host will be blocked from this site. This is a spider trap.