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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Fan Art:
Even Now the Wind of Thy Hope Cheats Thee

WonderBroad
Lorien


Apr 7 2007, 6:37pm

Post #1 of 12 (398 views)
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Even Now the Wind of Thy Hope Cheats Thee Can't Post

"'Pride and despair!' he cried. 'Didst though think that the eyes of the White Tower were blind? Nay, I have seen more than thou knowest, Grey Fool. For thy hope is but ignorance. Go then and labour in healing! Go forth and fight! Vanity. For a little space you may triumph on the field, for a day. But against the Power that now arises there is no victory. To this City only the first finger of its hand has yet been stretched. All the East is moving. And even now the wind of thy hope cheats thee and wafts up Anduin a fleet with black sails. The West has failed.'"

--The Return of the King



An illustration for an issue of the journal Mythlore.

Denethor is such an interesting character. Interesting, arrogant and doomed. He should have listened to Gandalf!

Pen and ink.


Beren IV
Gondor


Apr 8 2007, 5:51am

Post #2 of 12 (213 views)
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Nice - well done [In reply to] Can't Post

Although this scene doesn't completely match the books, with Denethor physically looking into the Palantir while Gandalf is there to see, I like it! The ships are a nice touch - if only Denethor had looked closer to see who was on them! Well, I'm not sure he would have wanted to see who was on them, come to think of it... I really don't know what Denethor would have done had he known for an actual fact that Aragorn was coming. Smile

Technical comments - are the walls wooden? The door clearly is, but the walls look wooden also.

Nice stipple by the way - I know how long it must have taken to make Denethor's entire robe black with the stipple, and I appreciate the amount of time you clearly put into it!

Once a paleontologist, now a botanist, will be a paleobotanist


WonderBroad
Lorien


Apr 8 2007, 12:56pm

Post #3 of 12 (207 views)
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re: [In reply to] Can't Post

>>Although this scene doesn't completely match the books, with Denethor physically looking into the Palantir while Gandalf is there to see

It's called artistic license.

He's not looking into the Palantir. He's staring out somewhat to his left, very aware of the wizard behind him, even though he's descending deeper into madness.

The images of the ships are used as symbols, so the viewer can recall what he saw that caused him to finally lose all hope--and his mind.


Beren IV
Gondor


Apr 8 2007, 4:59pm

Post #4 of 12 (201 views)
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Yes, it is [In reply to] Can't Post

and I agree - it's nicely done!Smile

Once a paleontologist, now a botanist, will be a paleobotanist


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Apr 11 2007, 1:24am

Post #5 of 12 (207 views)
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Where is Denethor's Roman nose? [In reply to] Can't Post

No, just kidding, remembering squire's comments on Denethor's appearance from December 2005. And since you drew this for Mythlore, I'll note that on the Mythsoc mail list, Michael Martinez once claimed that Denethor had a long white beard. Actually, I'm not sure Denethor had a beard at all, but there's nothing to prove the case either way, I think.


Quote
Although this scene doesn't completely match the books, with Denethor physically looking into the Palantir while Gandalf is there to see. (Beren IV)

Well, that's one moment in the scene, just not the one you chose to illustrate; I'm not sure you even needed to use your license. On the other hand:


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The images of the ships are used as symbols, so the viewer can recall what he saw that caused him to finally lose all hope--and his mind. (WonderBroad)

As symbolism I find it a touch heavy. May I ignore the artist's intention and assume that Denethor merely has the palantír pointed in the right direction, and that we the viewers are looking through it down-river at Aragorn's fleet?

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Detail from earliest version of Thror's MapTolkien Illustrated! Jan. 29-May 20: Visit the Reading Room to discuss art by John Howe, Alan Lee, Ted Nasmith and others, including Tolkien himself.

Apr. 9-15: Anke-Katrin Eissmann.


WonderBroad
Lorien


Apr 11 2007, 2:12am

Post #6 of 12 (189 views)
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re: [In reply to] Can't Post

>>I'll note that on the Mythsoc mail list, Michael Martinez once claimed that Denethor had a long white beard.

I hadn't seen that on the list, but I tend to stay away, since it would be far too much fun, and I'd never get anything else done. I'd be hanging out on the internet all the time, and I already do entirely too much of that.

>>Actually, I'm not sure Denethor had a beard at all, but there's nothing to prove the case either way, I think.

Neither am I sure. But it seemed appropriate at the time. I'd like to think that, although the Dunedain are generally beardless, if they wanted to, they could grow facial hair. It would prove very helpful to Aragorn when he was going around the various lands and realms "in other guise." Otherwise, it's kind of hard to radically change your look just by cutting or growing your hair, and I don't think he had access to plastic surgery or botox! A beard or a nice moustache would help him "disappear" into another character, such as Thorongil.


WonderBroad
Lorien


Apr 11 2007, 2:13am

Post #7 of 12 (184 views)
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re: [In reply to] Can't Post

>>May I ignore the artist's intention and assume that Denethor merely has the palantír pointed in the right direction, and that we the viewers are looking through it down-river at Aragorn's fleet?

To quote the late Princess Diana, "Why ever not?"

Go for it (that's me, not Diana.)


N.E. Brigand
Half-elven


Apr 11 2007, 2:57am

Post #8 of 12 (182 views)
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Interesting theory. / [In reply to] Can't Post

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Detail from earliest version of Thror's MapTolkien Illustrated! Jan. 29-May 20: Visit the Reading Room to discuss art by John Howe, Alan Lee, Ted Nasmith and others, including Tolkien himself.

Apr. 9-15: Anke-Katrin Eissmann.


Aunt Dora Baggins
Immortal


Apr 11 2007, 4:11pm

Post #9 of 12 (333 views)
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That kind of ties in with the story of Luthien. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
I'd like to think that, although the Dunedain are generally beardless, if they wanted to, they could grow facial hair. It would prove very helpful to Aragorn when he was going around the various lands and realms "in other guise." Otherwise, it's kind of hard to radically change your look just by cutting or growing your hair, and I don't think he had access to plastic surgery or botox! A beard or a nice moustache would help him "disappear" into another character, such as Thorongil.



It reminds me of how she was able to grow her hair long at will to escape from the tower. Maybe as Luthien's descendent Aragorn had the same power. Nice idea!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
"For DORA BAGGINS in memory of a LONG correspondence, with love from Bilbo; on a large wastebasket. Dora was Drogo's sister, and the eldest surviving female relative of Bilbo and Frodo; she was ninety-nine, and had written reams of good advice for more than half a century."
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Chance Meeting at Rivendell: a Tolkien Fanfic
and some other stuff I wrote...
leleni at hotmail dot com

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


GaladrielTX
Tol Eressea


Apr 11 2007, 5:43pm

Post #10 of 12 (198 views)
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I can't imagine how weird that must feel. [In reply to] Can't Post


In Reply To
It reminds me of how she was able to grow her hair long at will to escape from the tower.


~~~~~~~~

I used to be GaladrielTX, but it's springtime and I'm shedding.



Kimi
Forum Admin / Moderator

Apr 18 2007, 8:31am

Post #11 of 12 (187 views)
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Shedding would be a real issue [In reply to] Can't Post

Footer, juxtaposition: you know how it is.




Promises to Keep: a novel set in 19th Century New Zealand.

The Passing of Mistress Rose

Do we find happiness so often that we should turn it off the box when it happens to sit there?

- A Room With a View


Curious
Half-elven


Oct 18 2007, 8:25pm

Post #12 of 12 (165 views)
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Perhaps Martinez based that argument [In reply to] Can't Post

on the fact that Pippin notes a likeness between Denethor and Gandalf, although I always thought the likeness was more spiritual than physical:


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He turned his dark eyes on Gandalf, and now Pippin saw a likeness between the two, and he felt the strain between them, almost as if he saw a line of smouldering fire, drawn from eye to eye, that might suddenly burst into flame.

Denethor looked indeed much more like a great wizard than Gandalf did, more kingly, beautiful, and powerful; and older.


But that's the first time I heard about Nerdanel's father's remarkable beard. I like Martinez's method of reconciling everything Tolkien said by theorizing that only old Numenoreans or Dunedain grow beards, just as only old elves grow beards. But another alternative is to simply ignore notes that were not a part of LotR, and assume that both elves and kings grew beards, as shown in LotR (i.e. the statue at the crossroads and Cirdan).

 
 

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