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Cetautomatix
Nevrast
Jun 18 2008, 4:06pm
Post #1 of 26
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Jackson or Del Toro
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I'm just wondering.
I just read some articles (on wikipedia among other sources) referring to feelings Mr Del Toro once had about "little guys and dragons"; not very flattering.
I'm wondering if there's any truth to what I read. I hope not.
I mean, if someone who once had these feelings about a story was to make it into a movie...mmmmh.
I don't know. It just looks to me that Peter, Fran and Philippa put of a lot of love and dedication into the making of the trilogy and to me it showed. I'm just concerned about somebody coming and make a movie for the sake of...what exactly? If this article about Mr Del toro's feeling about little guys and dragons is true what would his motivations now be for directing The Hobbit? What could have made him change his mind?
I'm really concerned.
Cet
(This post was edited by Ataahua on Jun 18 2008, 7:35pm)
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Rosie-with-the-ribbons
Forum Admin
/ Moderator
Jun 18 2008, 4:19pm
Post #2 of 26
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of the live chat from a few weeks ago:
http://www.wetanz.com/...emid=695&catid=2
Guillermo del Toro explains some of his former remarks. And as I read his words, I can feel his enthusiasm and strive to make a great movie.
And besides that, Peter, Phillipa and Fran will be writing the script together with GdT, so the storyline at least will continue.
I have faith that everything will be wonderful (again).
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Altaira
Superuser
Jun 18 2008, 4:23pm
Post #3 of 26
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Yay! An opportunity to point you to the new Hobbit Movie FAQ
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First of all, welcome, Cetautomatix! (My husband loves the Asterix books and movies, so I'm a big fan too and love your nick  ).
Anyway, as you might imagine, this isn't the first time someone has brought up those, or similar, quotes by Del Toro here at TORn, and it was also a question Del Toro answered in the recent "Unexpected Party" chat with him and PJ. I recommend you read through his comments (It's a long answer about 3/4 of the way down the transcript of the chat). Hopefully they'll calm your fears. We'd like to hear more either way.
From the Hobbit Movie FAQ (also see my post about unveiling it a few threads down the board):
2.3. Does GDT even know/like/understand Tolkien and Fantasy?
Guillermo read The Hobbit when he was 11 years old and loved it. However, he couldn’t make it through the Lord of the Rings at that time (not the first 11 year-old to have that happen): “I purchased it [The Hobbit] at age 11 and it struck a chord with me but, back then, I failed to connect with the Trilogy, and the Silmarillion (which now I find delectable) eluded me. I found them –unlike the HOBBIT- to be “too dense” for my young mind”. Recently though, he has been enthusiastically ‘devouring’ the trilogy and other Tolkien books and loves them too.
As for fantasy: “I dedicated the last 6 years of my career (between PL and HBII) to create Fantastical worlds inhabited by Fairies, Fauns, Ogres, Trolls, Elves, etc…In that respect- I guess I am a Fantasy guy when the particular world appeals to me… I do the tales I love (regardless of what shelf Barnes & Noble classifies the book under) and I love the HOBBIT. I love it enough to give it half a decade of my life and move half a world away to do it.”
Koru: Maori symbol representing a fern frond as it opens. The koru reaches towards the light, striving for perfection, encouraging new, positive beginnings.
"Life can't be all work and no TORn" -- jflower
"I take a moment to fervently hope that the camaradarie and just plain old fun I found at TORn will never end" -- LOTR_nutcase
TORn Calendar
(This post was edited by Altaira on Jun 18 2008, 4:25pm)
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Cetautomatix
Nevrast
Jun 18 2008, 4:36pm
Post #4 of 26
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I read the transcript! Thanks!
I guess at that point it's just "wait and see".
I really hope the same kind of magic can transpire through the movies as it did in the trilogy.
Cet
p.s. my nick comes from the fact that I had to find one for another board (chain mail) and I wanted to have something related to what I was doing for a hobby so I chose him because he's a blacksmith.
:-)
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SirDennisC
Gondolin
Jun 18 2008, 9:03pm
Post #5 of 26
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GDT will approach the material with deep respect
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... that much is certain. GDT's interest and remarks about theme's in the Hobbit were very encouraging. I listened to GDT's commentary on the Pan's Laybrinth DVD -- he insisted that Pan was a companion movie to the Devil's Backbone but in my estimation the only real links (a very important link to an artist such as GDT) are theme and pallet. After that the two movies are "as disimilar as two dissimilar peas in a pod" (Rowan Atkinson's Black Adder). It is wonderful when "sequals" are made to be stand alone films in their own right.
Regarding PJ and GDT's counterpoints, I have yet to see anything glaring. GDT did make quite a bit of his dislike for horses (and cows but not sheep!) on the commentary... and there was some obvious disdain for actors looking at the camera. I take this point as underlining how sensitive he is about the audience's right to get lost in the film. I would count this as a similarity between the two directors though.
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Huan71
Menegroth
Jun 18 2008, 10:48pm
Post #6 of 26
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They'll do a great job. It will be fantastic!
"Only the guilty dream"... oh dear, i'm DOOMED!!
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Guillermo
Ossiriand
Jun 19 2008, 3:05pm
Post #7 of 26
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-we're stuck with each other for the time being, Cet. Many chances to agree and disagree are forthcoming.
All the Best
GDT
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Cetautomatix
Nevrast
Jun 19 2008, 4:25pm
Post #8 of 26
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Awwww! I didn't mean to be rude Guillermo, I was just a little bit concerned; that was all.
But I guess we should give the runner his chance, right?
I mean I love your work. Conceptually it's very much to my taste so... like I've said, let's just wait and see.
I read the transcript of the chat session and it answered a lot of my questions and you know what? It even reassured me (no kidding).
There must be a lot of pressure upon your shoulders right now and I don't want to add any more so please accept my apologies if my comments were hurtful to you.
I'm a creature of habit so....
Cet
p.s. Glad to have you on board man!
(This post was edited by Cetautomatix on Jun 19 2008, 4:31pm)
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Marionette
Nargothrond
Jun 19 2008, 6:34pm
Post #9 of 26
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It doesn´t mean. Anywayz it didnt helped...
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Probably Peter Jackson and company loved LOTR, but that love didn´t help some of the poor butchered characters, great characters, of the LOTR books...
It doens´t matter at all if Guillermo hates or not hates or likes or dislike (Whats wrong with that anywayz) hobbits, dwarves and dragons. That doesn´t mean his personal feeling has to be in the movie.
Unfortunately Peter Jackon and Fran Walsh are there in the screen writting... so who knows who will change the poor characters this time XD
"Dear friend good bye, no tears in my eyes. So sad it ends, as it began"
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Sunflower
Doriath
Jun 20 2008, 12:47am
Post #10 of 26
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Ugh. That Salon.com article, I'll bet.
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With the story on Gullermo's Cannes interview from a couple yrs back.
I wish that article could be wiped off the Net....Del Toro is stuck with it now. That interview has become infamous. Not that he minds at this point....He's lived with worse, and anyway, he's all set to prove the doubters wrong!
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mwirkk
Nargothrond
Jun 20 2008, 1:32am
Post #11 of 26
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...whassname-of-questionable-parentage! [Can't use the B*****d word, since that's lovingly applied to PJ already (TBHL).] Yuh got a direct response! That's like getting an eagle on a par 3. If I were you, I wouldn't wash the three fingers that typed that message with for weeks... ;P
Anywayz, one request (this is for our fellow TORNies generally, not just to you specifically, Cet), when asking questions about or referencing specific data, such as a quote in this case, please don't leave the sources a matter of discovery for the rest of us. A little disambiguation would be a thoughtful gesture. Not a big deal, really, but it saves everyone time.
Btw- congrats for doing some research. Most folks don't even bother. (That's not meant as sarcasm.)
Otherwise, ibid. #108670, 108672. :)
The Black Knight Always Triumphs!!
-mwirkk :)
(This post was edited by mwirkk on Jun 20 2008, 1:38am)
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Cetautomatix
Nevrast
Jun 20 2008, 1:45pm
Post #12 of 26
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Hi Mwirkk!
The worst thing is I really wasn't looking for a direct response from Guillermo. Actually I didn't even think that he'd bother replying anything to me; normally these guys they never do (I guess they're just too busy). I really was looking for comments from fellow board members.
And about your request, you're right. I'll give my source the next time.
Slainte!
Cet
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mwirkk
Nargothrond
Jun 20 2008, 4:30pm
Post #13 of 26
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At my work I sometimes have opportunities for what we call a "brush with greatness." That's one of the cool things about TORn too. You never know when something cool like that might happen.
I think you're doing fine, Cet! Don't let anything curb your enthusiasm or passion! I think G was probably amused rather than annoyed. :)
(There's no intent of putting words in anyone's mouth - it's just SWAG.)
I like your current avatar!
(SWAG = Scientific Wild-A***d Guess)
The Black Knight Always Triumphs!!
-mwirkk :)
(This post was edited by mwirkk on Jun 20 2008, 4:31pm)
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Laerasëa
Dor-Lomin
Jun 20 2008, 6:07pm
Post #14 of 26
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Yes, I'm sure amused is an excellent word; I don't think you become famous without encountering any not-100%-positive remarks. I have to admit, though, I kind of snickered when I read GDT's response....as legit as your comment was (and really, don't worry about it), I still would have loved to see the look on your face while reading his reply!!
btw- Welcome to the boards, Cet! 
(yay! I haven't read an Asterix and Obelix in a while!!)
********************************
I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying. - Oscar Wilde
This is a work of fiction. All the characters in it, human and otherwise, are imaginary, excepting only certain of the fairy folk, whom it might be unwise to offend by casting doubts on their existence. Or lack thereof. -Neil Gaiman
Age is an issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter. - Mark Twain
You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway. - Walt Disney
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. - Louis Hector Berlioz
Don't use words too big for the subject. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. -C.S. Lewis
(This post was edited by laerasea on Jun 20 2008, 6:09pm)
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Cetautomatix
Nevrast
Jun 20 2008, 6:40pm
Post #15 of 26
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Well it sure was nice to get a reply from him but (and here I'm pretty sure I'll get stones thrown at me for what I'm about to say) to me a human being is just that: a human being. I elevate no one to a demi-god status just because he's famous. Although this doesn't mean I don't respect and admire some people more than others (among other people nurses and people that helps other people in general and are kind of being a little bit exploited at the same time); I'm very grateful to the guys that are picking up my trash every week. That musn't be a very pleasant job and they avoid us epidemics.They're relatively unknown joes. Anyway, you get my meanings.
Thanks for the greetings and the comment on my avatar. I think it's rather cool as well.
Cet
(This post was edited by Cetautomatix on Jun 20 2008, 6:44pm)
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Laerasëa
Dor-Lomin
Jun 20 2008, 7:50pm
Post #16 of 26
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Well said!
Personally, I just enjoy the hype, if that makes sense. It's fun to have someone to get excited about (and I'll be the first to admit- I mostly like having GDT here because it makes everyone else happy- it is pretty much a 294% mob psychology thing), and if one of those people happens to post on a movie board of yours- well, great!
That does not change the fact that I have the utmost respect for other people, other professions. On my end, I tend to elevate teachers, all kinds, more than any other profession, I think. I really respect people who, as you say, work to help other people, really wanting to benefit them. That idea makes me really happy, and that's also kind of what inspires me a lot (if you want a cliche).
Anyway, to sum it up, what makes me really glad is seeing other people happy, or really excited about something. I'm grateful to anyone who can make someone else happy. It is one of the coolest things in the world to watch a teacher teach something they really love, just as it's really cool to see the director of The Hobbit posting on a major site dedicated to Tolkien- does that kind of make sense? Yes, he's kind of a celebrity (and yes, I wrote that previous post reply kind of quickly, so my point is not totally relevant to what I had written before)- but he's also actively and intentionally in the right environment to make people happy, and that's good, I think.
But yes, I also totally understand your meaning, and agree with it 345%.
********************************
I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying. - Oscar Wilde
This is a work of fiction. All the characters in it, human and otherwise, are imaginary, excepting only certain of the fairy folk, whom it might be unwise to offend by casting doubts on their existence. Or lack thereof. -Neil Gaiman
Age is an issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter. - Mark Twain
You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway. - Walt Disney
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. - Louis Hector Berlioz
Don't use words too big for the subject. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. -C.S. Lewis
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Darkstone
Elvenhome
Jun 20 2008, 8:03pm
Post #18 of 26
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Speaking as someone whose public service occasionally puts me in harm's way (and has spectacularly put me in the hospital a couple of times in the past two and a half years), I have the utmost respect for artistical types. In the end I only have physical training and a technical education. But artistic talent is a rare gift from God. Art is what makes the human race, well, human.
******************************************
The audacious proposal stirred his heart. And the stirring became a song, and it mingled with the songs of Gil-galad and Celebrian, and with those of Feanor and Fingon. The song-weaving created a larger song, and then another, until suddenly it was as if a long forgotten memory woke and for one breathtaking moment the Music of the Ainur revealed itself in all glory. He opened his lips to sing and share this song. Then he realized that the others would not understand. Not even Mithrandir given his current state of mind. So he smiled and simply said "A diversion.”
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Guillermo
Ossiriand
Jun 21 2008, 2:51pm
Post #19 of 26
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Everybody's comments are exceedingly interesting and quite valid. Look- I've been doing films for over 25 years and directing features for over 15. I'm very comfortable with other people's opinions and skepticism. Some people like what I do, others dislike it. I'm fine with both points of view. I believe that respect cannot be demanded ever-
It must be earned.
You may disagree with PJ's choices or my choices down the road but I think that respect must be given to the volume and dedication of the filmmaking effort.
It is my hope to earn your respect even if I eventually earn your disagreement. Feel free to continue voicing your doubts and fears, they will keep our toes flexed-
Until soon-
Guillermo
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Peredhil lover
Doriath
Jun 21 2008, 6:10pm
Post #20 of 26
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that have earned you my respect already. Your respect and care for the fans and that you don't dismiss their worries at once, but are so understanding has impressed me very much. The more I read from or about you, the more content I am with the choice to have you directing The Hobbit and the sprequel/Film 2.
And speaking of volume and dedication of the filmmaking effort - that is exactly what I admired so much about LotR. The love for detail in costumes, props and everything was amazing. To me, it felt like a movie made by fans for fans, not like something to make money, and that made more than up for the few things I didn't like so much. If the new movies are anywhere near that, I am more than happy. And to know the same crew is making them gives me such a safe feeling. It may be that in the end I'm not agreeing with every little detail, but I am sure on the whole I will get a great movie.
I do not suffer from LotR obsession - I enjoy every minute of it.
(This post was edited by Altaira on Jun 21 2008, 6:21pm)
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Starling
Gondolin
Jun 21 2008, 10:12pm
Post #21 of 26
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of two bearded film-makers sitting on a couch flexing their toes whilst discussing the finer points of Tolkien and enjoying second breakfast.
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ringbearer9
Menegroth
Jun 22 2008, 1:29am
Post #22 of 26
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I agree with Peredhil lover, I think you've
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already earned most of our respect if not all at least for me! It's great that you're taking the time to interact with us, answer questions and read our posts! That alone, not to mention some great ideas and plans you have for the Hobbit has made me feel comfortable that you have the position/responsibilities that you do. It's wonderful to agree to disagree, not all people feel comfortable with that... I'm glad you are because I'm sure in the future I'll disagree with you on something or the other! No, but really, thanks, it's great to have you here!
-RB9
*Living Is Easy With Eyes Closed*
(This post was edited by ringbearer9 on Jun 22 2008, 1:31am)
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mwirkk
Nargothrond
Jun 22 2008, 5:50am
Post #23 of 26
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Well-intentioned criticism is more valuable...
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...than ill-considered praise. That's what Life's taught me, and it's the lesson I advocate to co-workers. It makes the end product better. And hopefully results in happier customers. :)
I suspect you know that very well Guillermo. It's very much appreciated that there are those like yourself who take the time to guage the input of the humble fan and give it its due consideration.
Gracias!
The Black Knight Always Triumphs!!
-mwirkk :)
(This post was edited by mwirkk on Jun 22 2008, 5:52am)
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grammaboodawg
Elvenhome
Jun 22 2008, 1:25pm
Post #24 of 26
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to make everyone happy no matter how you try.
I have confidence that you will be as sincere and honourable to Tolkien's story as Peter, Philippa and Fran have been with their approach to The Lord of the Rings. I'm so excited to see your Middle-earth and telling of Bilbo's tale (and what comes after). I will admit that my confidence is stronger because of your collaboration with Peter. I'd have more concerns if they weren't involved with ANY Tolkien adaptations since their amazing films; but after listening to your commentaries in Pan's Labyrinth and Hellboy, I'm delighted that you're joining OUR family of fans! I can't WAIT to see what happens next!! *geek-o-meter spikes*
Have fun! :D
"Barney Snow was here." ~Hug like a hobbit!~ "In my heaven..."
TORn's Observations Lists
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Laerasëa
Dor-Lomin
Jun 22 2008, 4:36pm
Post #25 of 26
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(and congratulations; you got her geek-o-meter to spike!!)
Anyway, I *do* have the utmost respect for you, and I apologize profusely if my post made it seem otherwise. (If it did sound like that, then it was bad wording on my part)
Thanks you so much for posting on here!
********************************
I am so clever that sometimes I don't understand a single word of what I am saying. - Oscar Wilde
This is a work of fiction. All the characters in it, human and otherwise, are imaginary, excepting only certain of the fairy folk, whom it might be unwise to offend by casting doubts on their existence. Or lack thereof. -Neil Gaiman
Age is an issue of mind over matter. If you don't mind, it doesn't matter. - Mark Twain
You're dead if you aim only for kids. Adults are only kids grown up, anyway. - Walt Disney
Time is a great teacher, but unfortunately it kills all its pupils. - Louis Hector Berlioz
Don't use words too big for the subject. Don't say "infinitely" when you mean "very"; otherwise you'll have no word left when you want to talk about something really infinite. -C.S. Lewis
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