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Silvered-glass
Nargothrond
Fri, 6:16pm
Post #26 of 29
(114 views)
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Speculation is not what I would consider to be substantive evidence. All the substantive evidence points towards it being Peter's idea, and nothing of what you presented is good enough grounds to question his integrity, especially since it's something he's pulled again since with his Beatles documentary. The Dol Guldur scenes you dismiss as filler? Peter had talked about wanting to film those since 2003. Legolas? Jackson mentions he could have a role in the films during an interview from late 2006. As I said the production is very well-documented and we can trace how the idea came to pass and why. I went and dug out a link for you to demonstrate that non-disparagement clauses indeed are real and normal in Hollywood: https://beverlyboy.com/...isparagement-clause/ An excerpt (emphasis mine):
Non-disparagement provisions in production contracts typically define unacceptable behaviors and statements quite specifically. You will often find these clauses prohibiting any party from making negative or critical public statements about the project, direction, cast, or crew. Whether through interviews, social media, or informal public comments, the goal is to prevent harm to reputations that could affect both current and future projects. By outlining expectations in advance, you reduce the chance of unintentional breaches and minimize ambiguity in high-pressure environments. Contract language can vary but often targets direct and indirect remarks that may damage the partnership or public perception. This means that even if everyone in the production thought that ultra-extending The Hobbit was a bad idea artistically, they wouldn't have been allowed to say anything "negative or critical" about that in public. This must be kept in mind when interpreting the comments. In your earlier posts you mentioned that Guillermo del Toro before he quit was also going for an ultra-extended version of The Hobbit. You should consider this as evidence that Peter Jackson's ultra-extended vision wasn't truly original to him but dictated to him from above. It sounds highly unlikely that two different competent directors on the same production would both "lose the plot" in an identical way without it having a common cause. Guillermo del Toro's departure is a hint that maybe he didn't want his name attached to the product after the executive demands grew even more unhinged than they had previously been. The crew members talking about Peter Jackson's ideas would be referring to how even though Peter Jackson had orders to produce an excessive amount of cinematic minutes, he had a lot of freedom in how to produce those minutes. Peter Jackson gave use Azog and Tauriel, among other things. Another director could have taken a different route to get those minutes.
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Chen G.
Mithlond
Fri, 6:30pm
Post #27 of 29
(114 views)
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You are aware that Guillermo was filming PETER's script, yes?
[In reply to]
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Can't Post
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So small wonder that his version was looking in the same direction. It absolutely offers no evidence towards your argument. You HAVE no evidence: just a "Well, they must be lying." That's...just not an argument.
(This post was edited by Chen G. on Fri, 6:31pm)
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DGHCaretaker
Nargothrond
Fri, 11:04pm
Post #28 of 29
(103 views)
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You are aware that Guillermo was filming PETER's script, yes? Putting part of the body of your message in the subject heading makes it more difficult to quote. Can't we use traditional subject headings? Just sayin'. Rant over. So because of your objection to speculation, I thought I'd find a public fact to cite to corroborate your claim. But I'm also lazy so I just used Google AI. Not that I trust AI, but that's as much work as I'm willing to do for a five-minute post. So I asked, "Was Guillermo going to film Peter Jackson's hobbit script?" And sure enough:
Yes, Guillermo del Toro was originally hired to direct The Hobbit films and spent years in pre-production collaborating on a script with Peter Jackson, Fran Walsh, and Philippa Boyens. Del Toro's version was set to be a two-film adaptation, designed to be darker and more fairy-tale-like, but he left the project in 2010 due to prolonged production delays caused by MGM's financial troubles, after which Jackson took over as director. I would think everyone here already knows that well enough and no one would argue. though it could possibly be a Mandala Effect. So confirming facts is good. Good arguments need good citations, or it becomes opinion and speculation, which leads me to this: I don't much like speculation. Ninety-nine percent of news is talking heads offering opinion and speculation about what might happen. It's a freaking waste of my time. I watch, read, or listen to primary sources and form my own opinions. Everything else just relates to the complaint. But what if I lead off in a post with "In my opinion," doesn't that allow speculation and expression? It would be fair warning. It might be good form, but on forums everywhere, just about everything is opinion and speculation, so can probably be assumed. Wouldn't it be better to continue with a counterfactual argument than just marginalize opinion and speculation? It's what we do here. ;)
(This post was edited by DGHCaretaker on Fri, 11:07pm)
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Otaku-sempai
Elvenhome

Sat, 3:32am
Post #29 of 29
(98 views)
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It is true that enough of Guillermo del Toro's contributions remained to give him screen credit on the screenplays for all three films. We observed right here in these forums how the project evolved through development, pre-production, filming and post-production. It went from two films to a two-part adaptation during GdT's tenure as director to Peter Jackson taking over the director's chair. And we witnessed how that developed into the three-part adaptation that we finally got. That said, Jackson could not take the time (or the money) to scrap the original screenplays and start fresh even though the final films were doubtless significantly different from the films that detlToro would have made.
“Hell hath no fury like that of the uninvolved.” - Tony Isabella
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