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Brethil
Half-elven
Aug 3 2013, 10:35pm
Views: 440
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Great points on the Elf strongholds CG
[In reply to]
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Can't Post
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But to contradict myself on that point (something I excel at; it's my Feanor-like gift), Gondolin only got better in hiding from the world, and Nargothrond did too under Finrod. So, what are Tolkien's criteria for when hiding from the world is good and when it's bad? I think it goes back to your sleep/wakening theme. Gondolin remained a vital society in its isolation. No idea about Nargothrond. Doriath had its initial burst of wonder with the creation of Menegroth, then seemed to slumber. Yet Gondolin and Nargothrond originated with the inspiration of Ulmo while their rulers slept. And had they remained alert/awake, those rulers would have heeded his warning to escape while they still could. And I think that's the difference - the word came from Ulmo to build them and hide away, with a his long vision of the future; unlike Melian and Thingol who seem to simply want to be alone in their own kingdom. And absolutely true, they could have potentially escaped - Ulmo does warn them very early and then closer to the end - but that I think was secondary importance. Not that Ulmo is disregarding them all, but the real purpose was achieved. That desire to 'have' though (lie we are discussing in the Saruman Ringmaker thread up there) hampers their ability to make the right choice, at the cost of their lives. I wonder though, if there *was* some intention of how things go down - if Nargothrond still stood, Idril and Tuor might have fled there perhaps (?), and Earandil would not have been at the Sea; so the best outcome for ME and Ulmo's vision was of them having to flee to Sirion instead. So maybe that 'awakening' was one that was just how it should have been.
Is there a Tolkien topic that you have wanted to look into more deeply, and write about your thoughts on it? If so, we'd like to hear from you for the next TORn Amateur Symposium- coming in November. Happy writing!
(This post was edited by Brethil on Aug 3 2013, 10:35pm)
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Subject
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User
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Time
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TORn AMATEUR SYMPOSIUM Day Six- The Silmarillion topics
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TORn Amateur Symposium
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Jul 26 2013, 7:06am
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Subthread for "Who was the original owner of Orcrist?" by Dark Jackal
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TORn Amateur Symposium
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Jul 26 2013, 7:07am
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Really nice reasoning DJ!
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elaen32
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Jul 26 2013, 10:09am
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I agree - good bit of deduction! //
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noWizardme
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Jul 26 2013, 12:13pm
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I would love to find out how the swords got from Gondolin to the Trolls hoard
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DanielLB
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Jul 26 2013, 5:42pm
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UUT - mithril shirt
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Ardamírë
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Jul 26 2013, 7:01pm
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Thanks for the link Ardamire!
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 7:58pm
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Another one
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Ardamírë
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Jul 26 2013, 8:19pm
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I love this theory!
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Riven Delve
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Jul 26 2013, 8:30pm
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Isn't it great?
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Ardamírë
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Jul 26 2013, 8:39pm
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Commonality in surviving Beleriand
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 8:47pm
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Sounds like that could make for a nice speculative essay next time round, Brethil
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DanielLB
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Jul 27 2013, 3:15pm
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Its a dangerous business, posting on this forum...
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Brethil
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Jul 27 2013, 3:36pm
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Another cool idea ..
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 8:35pm
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Intriguing
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Ardamírë
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Jul 26 2013, 8:45pm
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It not only adds to the mystery
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Riven Delve
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Jul 26 2013, 10:13pm
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That's the one, thank you Ardamírë.
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DanielLB
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Jul 26 2013, 8:10pm
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Agreed
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Ardamírë
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Jul 26 2013, 8:21pm
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I wonder about this too, elaen and Daniel
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Riven Delve
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Jul 26 2013, 7:58pm
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Love the logic of your construct DarkJackal!
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:17pm
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A short but sweet paper
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Rembrethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:29pm
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Beautiful! But -
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sador
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Aug 4 2013, 10:39am
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Subthread for "The Silmarillion as Awakening to the Real World and Adulthood" by Telain
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TORn Amateur Symposium
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Jul 26 2013, 7:08am
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Loved reading this Telain
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elaen32
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Jul 26 2013, 11:01am
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Re waking & sleeping when the hobbits return to the Shire
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noWizardme
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Jul 26 2013, 12:12pm
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bring forth the "beautiful harmonic"!
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telain
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Jul 26 2013, 2:12pm
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regressing and proud of it //
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noWizardme
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Jul 26 2013, 2:51pm
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I shall regress as one of you! //
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:52pm
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Frodo's falling asleep
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:44pm
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Melian as a sleeper
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noWizardme
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Jul 26 2013, 12:18pm
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Absolutely!
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telain
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Jul 26 2013, 3:26pm
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Melian and Thingol
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:51pm
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Asleep in one's lingerie
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CuriousG
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Aug 3 2013, 9:50pm
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about Melian and the silmaril
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elostirion74
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Aug 7 2013, 7:53pm
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So many great examples in the literature
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 3:39pm
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Hanseol and Aretel?
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telain
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Jul 26 2013, 4:29pm
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Sleeping through the ages
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Brethil
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Jul 26 2013, 6:28pm
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Great essay, thank you telain :-)
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DanielLB
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Jul 26 2013, 6:04pm
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I thank you! Ents and morning people...
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telain
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Jul 27 2013, 10:06pm
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Evolution of the Ents
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Brethil
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Jul 30 2013, 4:34pm
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that works for me
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telain
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Jul 30 2013, 10:53pm
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Ents and Entwives
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Brethil
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Aug 3 2013, 3:44pm
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ents, elves and eriador
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telain
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Aug 7 2013, 1:27pm
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Absolutely relevant (and thanks again for that recc!)
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Brethil
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Aug 7 2013, 5:17pm
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Of hiding
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CuriousG
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Aug 3 2013, 9:42pm
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Great points on the Elf strongholds CG
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Brethil
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Aug 3 2013, 10:35pm
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"Dead they looked, and yet it was not so ... Asleep they were."
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squire
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Aug 4 2013, 2:49am
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Another Tolkien theme coming into view?
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noWizardme
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Aug 4 2013, 9:03pm
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Oog
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squire
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Aug 5 2013, 12:13am
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I agree - caution needed about Good and Evil (with caps)
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noWizardme
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Aug 5 2013, 6:47am
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Haemorrheges shrinking without surgery, and the like. //
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sador
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Aug 5 2013, 7:53am
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not hiding, just on the road...
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telain
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Aug 7 2013, 1:40pm
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I finally got to read this.
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sador
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Aug 4 2013, 10:30am
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and I am finally getting to answer!
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telain
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Aug 7 2013, 9:40pm
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One of my favorite Tolkien lines, on this
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squire
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Aug 8 2013, 1:09am
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oh, nice quote
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telain
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Aug 9 2013, 10:00pm
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