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sador
Half-elven
Apr 24 2013, 7:17am
Views: 746
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(http://newboards.theonering.net/...sb=post_time;so=DESC;) This is actually a rewrite of the first form of the Oath, from the hardly-begun lay The Flight of the Noldoli. In it, Feanor names only Varda, which I interpret both as acknowledging her part in the Silmarils, and as stating that he is defying only Manwe, not her (compare to the Lament of Galadriel in Farewell to Lorien). I guess the adding of Manwe and Eru Himself to the Oath in its later versions were "editorial embellishments" by Tolkien, to enhance the blasphemous nature of the Oath (as he called it in the Waldmann letter nowizardme cited in the OP), and to explain how Maedhros and Maglor felt beholden to it even after the War of Wrath. As originally written, the Oath itself was not quite blasphemous - its execution was.
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User
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Time
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Rivendell 0 secs ago **Silmarillion Discussion 2013, Part 3 of Chapter 9: Of The Flight of the Noldor
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 9:52am
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"Rivendell 0 secs ago ?"
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 10:48am
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LOL!
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dernwyn
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Apr 19 2013, 5:02pm
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Coming to you Live from the House of Elrond! //
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 5:10pm
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Yes, Keep it! I Love the **LIVE** Rivendell broadcasts!!!!
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Brethil
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Apr 19 2013, 5:20pm
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But, Dernwyn, I think you should at least give noWiz points for effort. Promote him to Valinor! :) //
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CuriousG
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Apr 19 2013, 11:46pm
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I can't send him to Valinor...
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dernwyn
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Apr 20 2013, 12:45am
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Cookies. Yum. This is a website cookie policy I can relate to!//
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noWizardme
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Apr 20 2013, 6:50am
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I wondered if you were trying to link to the movie "Zero Dark Thirty" //
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CuriousG
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Apr 19 2013, 10:51pm
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Feanor Vs The Valar, and Flying Elves (not the circus act....)
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Brethil
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Apr 19 2013, 5:15pm
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Feanor's fallacious demagoguery
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 5:54pm
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So true, and timeless vs allergorical
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Brethil
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Apr 19 2013, 7:58pm
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timeless behaviors which translated and could be reverse-engineered into mythos
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 8:17pm
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Look out, honey, the kids have grown up
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CuriousG
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Apr 20 2013, 2:54am
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Nice take on the Oath! And about those craftsmen types...
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Brethil
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Apr 20 2013, 4:02am
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A King Henry VIII moment?
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noWizardme
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Apr 20 2013, 7:26am
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Hijacking the public mood
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CuriousG
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Apr 20 2013, 5:21pm
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Nice historical reference NoWiz
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Brethil
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Apr 20 2013, 10:31pm
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Drumroll please
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Finwe
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Apr 19 2013, 5:52pm
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Great analysis Finwe!
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Brethil
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Apr 19 2013, 5:58pm
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I agree- entirely convincing that Manwe sees Feanor as one bad apple, and is completely behind on Elven politics. //
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noWizardme
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Apr 19 2013, 7:35pm
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some objections to the criticism against the Valar and Manwë
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elostirion74
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Apr 22 2013, 6:56pm
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You make some eloquent points here Elostirion; some thoughts in return
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Brethil
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Apr 23 2013, 1:25am
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In the end, it all happens too fast...to manage "hasty" we need Treebeard, not Feanor...
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noWizardme
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Apr 23 2013, 9:24am
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some answers
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elostirion74
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Apr 23 2013, 11:37pm
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So true Elostirion - a fascinating study in the brothers
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Brethil
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Apr 23 2013, 11:58pm
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drum roll well deserved (followed by cymbal crash!)
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telain
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Apr 19 2013, 11:26pm
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Great job with Manwe
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CuriousG
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Apr 20 2013, 3:21am
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Haha. Manwe does make me rub my temples some times...
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Brethil
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Apr 20 2013, 10:23pm
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Great finale, noWiz.
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CuriousG
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Apr 20 2013, 2:33am
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Feanor, monkey paw, Macbeth
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noWizardme
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Apr 21 2013, 10:24am
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What if's for this chapter
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CuriousG
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Apr 21 2013, 6:50pm
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What if Feanor and sons set out as knights errant on a quest to revenge Finwe, not dragging their whole people along? //
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noWizardme
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Apr 21 2013, 7:27pm
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Feanor and sons as knights...
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Brethil
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Apr 21 2013, 8:05pm
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Oathless knights... Much nicer
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noWizardme
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Apr 21 2013, 8:11pm
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Nicer but dead much sooner, if it was just 8 of them vs. Morgoth. //
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CuriousG
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Apr 21 2013, 9:42pm
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**rubbing hands** meaty questions.....!
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Brethil
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Apr 21 2013, 8:02pm
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Yes, Feanor seems doomed no matter what the what if is
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CuriousG
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Apr 21 2013, 9:56pm
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I originally suggested an "any other business" thread - do we need it?
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noWizardme
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Apr 21 2013, 8:02pm
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The Oath in full
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CuriousG
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Apr 21 2013, 10:56pm
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Feanor's Oath
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Brethil
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Apr 22 2013, 12:13am
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Aha
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CuriousG
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Apr 22 2013, 12:25am
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As I've posted below
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sador
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Apr 24 2013, 7:17am
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Thnak you for clarifying Sador!
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Brethil
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Apr 24 2013, 2:19pm
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Woah! That's proper swearing - do we know why it was cut? //
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noWizardme
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Apr 22 2013, 1:49pm
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Voronwe raised this question on the last time we've discussed this chapter.
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sador
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Apr 22 2013, 3:58pm
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What I keep meaning to do....
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noWizardme
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Apr 22 2013, 4:11pm
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Manwe's leadership
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elostirion74
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Apr 22 2013, 6:04am
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Chapter 10 is up
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Finwe
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Apr 22 2013, 2:20pm
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Answers - part 1
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sador
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Apr 23 2013, 2:20pm
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Answers - part 2
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sador
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Apr 24 2013, 8:00am
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maciliel-thoughts
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Maciliel
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Apr 28 2013, 4:00pm
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Not answers - but more questions!
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sador
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Apr 29 2013, 9:09am
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to be fair, i +did+ posit some answers
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Maciliel
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Apr 29 2013, 11:51am
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Involving the gods in dark deeds
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noWizardme
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Apr 29 2013, 2:30pm
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a girl is still patrolling
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Maciliel
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Apr 29 2013, 4:23pm
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if a man wishes
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Maciliel
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May 1 2013, 11:29am
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It is good to know these things
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noWizardme
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May 2 2013, 3:30pm
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Oaths - on endless repeat?
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Brethil
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Apr 30 2013, 8:56pm
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