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telain
Rohan
Jan 30 2013, 7:09pm
Views: 2989
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still not sure about the palantir...
[In reply to]
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Can't Post
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I don't think Sauron corrupted either Saruman's or Denethor's palantirs themselves, but the palantir as a means of communication was able certainly to transmit Sauron's evilness. The difference here (and with the Ring, I think) is the character of the person receiving the message. Saruman -- a great a powerful wizard (oh, wait, wrong story!) -- was first using the palantir to "check up" on Sauron, but his great and powerfulness was corrupted by the constant exposure to Sauron's influence. Since Denethor was never as powerful as Saruman, and his goals were always to rule Gondor, Sauron's influence instead drove him mad.
So, if someone else took the same palantir Denethor or Saruman possessed and used it to communicate with Elrond (if Elrond indeed had access to another one), I do not think the previous communications with Sauron would be still be in effect. Again, this is just a completely off-the-top-of-my-head-unsubstantiated hypothesis, so do what you will!
I also think there is a difference between suggesting Sauron can turn (some inanimate object) into an evil object (like a palantir) and suggesting he can use (some inanimate object) for evil. This is where the Ring may be different. Sauron did pour his hatred into it, so in my opinion the Ring itself is imbued with an evilness. In that way I don't think the Ring is wholly inanimate, but I don't think it is quite as sentient as others might believe. In some ways, as a literary and filmic device, it is necessary to turn inanimate objects into characters. For me, I never know how much of that is 'real' in the minds of the creator (hence, Tolkien.) So is the Ring partially sentient? Or, I wonder, does Bilbo, Frodo, Gollum, et al, refer to the Ring in such a way as it appears sentient -- to build up the problem of feeling drawn to evil deeds, but knowing that those impulses do not come within oneself?
just my thoughts for now .. wait a few days and they'll probably change!
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Subject
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Time
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How The Ring tempts
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noWizardme
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Jan 27 2013, 5:02pm
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Get thee behind me, Ring!
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CuriousG
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Jan 28 2013, 12:36am
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Loyal evil
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Mim
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Jan 28 2013, 1:54pm
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I like your conclusion
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CuriousG
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Jan 28 2013, 4:45pm
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How "intelligent" is the Ring?
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noWizardme
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Jan 28 2013, 5:07pm
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The power of the ring...
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elevorn
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Jan 28 2013, 6:06pm
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There was only One Ring, but
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CuriousG
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Jan 28 2013, 6:50pm
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Not so sure about the Palantir.
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Elizabeth
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Jan 28 2013, 10:42pm
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Corrupted palantirs, an insight into Sauron's powers and methods?
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noWizardme
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Jan 29 2013, 1:05pm
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still not sure about the palantir...
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telain
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Jan 30 2013, 7:09pm
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Imbued vs contaminated?
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CuriousG
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Jan 30 2013, 9:11pm
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"When can an object be evil?" May be a promising question
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noWizardme
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Jan 31 2013, 11:05am
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Some objects are "evil" in Tolkien's world, but he explains what that means in terms of his story.
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squire
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Jan 31 2013, 2:37pm
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Very interesting answer: thanks! //
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noWizardme
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Jan 31 2013, 2:40pm
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Very well said! //
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Voronwë_the_Faithful
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Jan 31 2013, 2:52pm
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The One Ring's motivation, as voiced by Rick Astley
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noWizardme
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Nov 21 2020, 12:39pm
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*Old Denethor raises eyebrows*
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CuriousG
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Nov 21 2020, 2:16pm
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And ther ewas me thinking "They're never goinna click that link'...
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noWizardme
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Nov 21 2020, 6:38pm
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A hobbit wearing a Ring? Who? Where? I don't see him!
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dernwyn
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Nov 22 2020, 3:35am
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