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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
Very true, and well stated by you.

AinurOlorin
Half-elven


Dec 28 2012, 9:04pm


Views: 382
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Very true, and well stated by you. [In reply to] Can't Post

I might add to the underlined, it adds something new by completely changing what is written, and severly diminishing the story. There are some changes I was fine with. The cliff business, for example. . . many people complained, but I thought it made the scenario more plausible. We have seen, in the novels, that Gandalf is quite adept at both starting and enhancing fires, as well as at snuffing them out (all the torches and fires in The Goblin King's lair being silmutaneously snuffed. . . and torches don't snuff easily). Having the Wizard fighting gravity and trying to keep companions from falling to their dooms, makes a plausible excuse for why he would not lay an enchantment to do more with the fire below, including putting it out if necesarry, or at least shifting its direction so that it would fan out at his foes. Azog is not a helpful change. The alteration of the backstory greatly devalues a powerful tale.

In Reply To
I understand the comparisons between Azog and Lurtz, as they serve a similar role in each film. But for me the analogy doesn't work. Lurtz was simply giving a name to something that was already in the book -- the orcs who kill Boromir. For the sake of a cool visual and a dramatic fight scene, the movie gave the lead orc a name. As for "potato face," that was intended to be Gothmog, a character from the book. So again, it's adapting an existing aspect of Tolkien's story.

Azog is a different situation. He's taken from Tolkien lore, yes, but in way that contradicts what Tolkien wrote. His addition to the film doesn't expand on something that was already present. It adds a completely new element.

I think that's why I disliked Azog so much. His very presence is a reminder of my issues with an otherwise awesome movie. He contradicts Tolkien, he adds a new unnecessary element to the story, and he exists to give film 1 a strong villain, something that wouldn't have been needed if Jackson hadn't decided to do a trilogy.

To be honest, if they had left the Azog plotline the same but used Bolg as the lead antagonist, I probably would have been okay with it. I know that's nitpicky and silly but to me, it would have felt more organic to the Hobbit story. It would have expanded an aspect of the book, rather than insert a dead character from a completely different story.


"Hear me, hounds of Sauron, Gandalf is here! Fly if you value your foul skins, I will shrivel you from tail to snout if you step within this circle!"

"Do not be to eager to deal out death in judgement. Even the very wise cannot see all ends."

Subject User Time
I do not get the..... YaznegSouth40 Send a private message to YaznegSouth40 Dec 28 2012, 4:39pm
    So-tell us what you liked about Azog! Aragalen the Green Send a private message to Aragalen the Green Dec 28 2012, 4:43pm
        All I am saying.... YaznegSouth40 Send a private message to YaznegSouth40 Dec 28 2012, 4:54pm
            Welcome to the internet. sauget.diblosio Send a private message to sauget.diblosio Dec 28 2012, 4:58pm
            Azog badass Ęleniel Tindome Send a private message to Ęleniel Tindome Dec 28 2012, 5:02pm
            Bravo! painjoiker Send a private message to painjoiker Dec 28 2012, 5:05pm
            I like his design and ... DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Dec 28 2012, 5:09pm
            Sadly, that's the nature of a comment thread. Aragalen the Green Send a private message to Aragalen the Green Dec 28 2012, 6:50pm
    If this were the case DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Dec 28 2012, 4:43pm
        I can suggest it Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë Dec 28 2012, 5:06pm
    EY! painjoiker Send a private message to painjoiker Dec 28 2012, 4:47pm
    i sorta get it unexpectedvisitor Send a private message to unexpectedvisitor Dec 28 2012, 4:48pm
        Not quite the same as Lurtz Fredeghar Wayfarer Send a private message to Fredeghar Wayfarer Dec 28 2012, 8:38pm
            Very true, and well stated by you. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Dec 28 2012, 9:04pm
                Azog and Arwen Mahtion Send a private message to Mahtion Dec 28 2012, 10:12pm
                    Personally GothmogTheBalrog Send a private message to GothmogTheBalrog Dec 28 2012, 11:07pm
    In general Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Dec 28 2012, 5:02pm
        Exactly...Lindele... YaznegSouth40 Send a private message to YaznegSouth40 Dec 28 2012, 6:56pm
        Or it could be... Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë Dec 28 2012, 6:58pm
            Well if you are going to make the argument Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Dec 28 2012, 7:08pm
                He looks worse than all of those Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë Dec 28 2012, 7:09pm
                    I'm saying Lindele Send a private message to Lindele Dec 28 2012, 7:16pm
                    Perhaps it's.... YaznegSouth40 Send a private message to YaznegSouth40 Dec 28 2012, 8:16pm
    Well, that's the nature of the world Eledhwen Send a private message to Eledhwen Dec 28 2012, 5:03pm
        Oh that is perfect. Ataahua Send a private message to Ataahua Dec 28 2012, 8:12pm
    No one says they hate him like Hitler... Kassandros Send a private message to Kassandros Dec 28 2012, 5:22pm
        Kassandros I understand that.... YaznegSouth40 Send a private message to YaznegSouth40 Dec 28 2012, 7:07pm
            "The Warrior's of Nain, Gror's son, drove through the orcs. . . all the while they cried 'Azog! Azog!" AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Dec 28 2012, 7:59pm
                On The Dwarves having Azog's name on their axes. . . I attempted editing this post AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Dec 28 2012, 8:18pm
    Azog work for me Simon Send a private message to Simon Dec 28 2012, 5:22pm
    I don't hate him, sauget.diblosio Send a private message to sauget.diblosio Dec 28 2012, 5:25pm
    I will say again, the character is fine, as I see him. His placement is horrendous, and is part of a larger flaw. AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Dec 28 2012, 6:12pm
        I highly agree!. I just can't tear myself away from that canon which is ingrained in my head :(. -that's- exactly what I've found wrong Xanaseb Send a private message to Xanaseb Dec 28 2012, 6:35pm
            Not a purist either. sauget.diblosio Send a private message to sauget.diblosio Dec 28 2012, 6:53pm
    I think one can sum up the Azog-hate quite easily: Iowaboy Send a private message to Iowaboy Dec 28 2012, 6:44pm
        Couldn't have said it better Iowaboy IDLookout Send a private message to IDLookout Dec 28 2012, 8:25pm
        I agree with you Iowaboy Elenorflower Send a private message to Elenorflower Dec 28 2012, 9:20pm
            edit: this comment had small beginnings unexpectedvisitor Send a private message to unexpectedvisitor Dec 28 2012, 10:29pm
                Thank you for being so wonderfully insightful & optimistic! // RhodeCamelot Send a private message to RhodeCamelot Jan 1 2013, 11:58am
    How about Jar Jar Binks? Ardamírë Send a private message to Ardamírë Dec 28 2012, 6:56pm
    I liked Azog - wayyy more than Gothmog from ROTK morgul lord Send a private message to morgul lord Dec 28 2012, 11:04pm
    I loved the film Rostron2 Send a private message to Rostron2 Dec 29 2012, 12:35am
    I too loved the movies and thought Azog was cool Ziggy Stardust Send a private message to Ziggy Stardust Dec 29 2012, 1:37am

 
 
 

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