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The One Ring Forums: Tolkien Topics: Movie Discussion: The Hobbit:
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Lurker in the Dark
The Shire

Aug 5 2012, 7:20am


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Welcome to TORn Lurker!
Thank you.

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Or, do you think the film makers will somehow make the case that the Ring drew Bilbo into the adventure as a harmless courier in order to deliver itself to Sauron (who it seems will be at the Bo5A)?
I'll confess it's been a while since I read "The Hobbit", and I always found it rather disappointing compared with LotR etc.

If PJ's Hobbit is, like Theoden, going to be able to stand proudly alongside its predecessors I think it can't have any loose ends - and to me the biggest loose end has always been why Gandalf selects Bilbo, a Hobbit, to go on Thorin's quest. I mean, why? Bilbo isn't a burglar and Hobbits, as we know, aren't adventurous. And as I've argued, it's obvious Gandalf didn't know that Bilbo was going to find the One Ring on the way yet without it the expedition would have ended in disaster in the Goblin tunnels, pretty near the beginning of the book as I remember!

If I were writing it the one screamingly obvious factor is that both Bilbo and Frodo allow Gollum to live when surely anyone else - elf, dwarf or man let alone orc etc. - would have killed him at the first opportunity almost without thought. It is that act of forebearance, of compassion, that is ultimately the Ring's downfall for had either Bilbo or Frodo killed Gollum Frodo would at Mt. Doom have claimed the Ring for himself and Sauron would have won.

So it only makes sense to me that some 'force for good' trying to counter Sauron is aware that only through the hands of a Hobbit is there any hope that the One Ring can be destroyed, so must bring a Hobbit to where it is. Yet whatever that force is it cannot act directly, so gives some sort of 'hint' (I'm guessing to Galadriel) that it's important for a hobbit to go on Thorin's quest which she and Gandalf choose to act on.

I suggest it's only at the time of Bilbo's party, when Gandalf first suspects what Bilbo's ring really is, that he fully realises the import of Galadriel's 'prophecy'. And why he later tells Frodo that he was 'meant' to have the Ring which gives him hope.

To satisfy me I need more than 'a hunch' on Gandalf's part that sends Bilbo on the quest. I think Gandalf needs to know that Bilbo must go or the world will fall, even if he has no idea why Bilbo must go and so must trust to luck that Bilbo will do whatever it's necessary that he does do.

I don't regard the One Ring as having any sentience of its own, and thus it doesn't make plans or try to influence events directly. Evil can sense it and be drawn to it - eg the Black Riders - but although corrupting it is essentially passive and so cannot look to 'use' Bilbo as you suggest.

Subject User Time
Greenbooks guest post: in defense of a Hobbit trilogy News from Bree Send a private message to News from Bree Aug 3 2012, 9:33pm
    Excellent write-up... Maiarmike Send a private message to Maiarmike Aug 4 2012, 4:29am
        Seems perfect JayFank Send a private message to JayFank Aug 4 2012, 4:06pm
    EXCELLENT Buchanicus Send a private message to Buchanicus Aug 4 2012, 5:32am
    Excellent Article! Istaris'staffs Send a private message to Istaris'staffs Aug 4 2012, 5:58am
    The is great! DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 8:21am
    Wow! TheBeerBaron Send a private message to TheBeerBaron Aug 4 2012, 9:03am
    Jackson should hire this guy guitarzankansasfan Send a private message to guitarzankansasfan Aug 4 2012, 9:48am
    Where can I find more TheBeerBaron Send a private message to TheBeerBaron Aug 4 2012, 10:27am
    Congratulations! This is by far the best post/article I've ever read on TORn kiwifan Send a private message to kiwifan Aug 4 2012, 11:23am
    I have to disagree... Spaldron Send a private message to Spaldron Aug 4 2012, 12:53pm
        But LOTR movie Bilbo has no connection with dwarves at all. Plurmo Send a private message to Plurmo Aug 5 2012, 4:21am
    This is amazing. DesiringDragons Send a private message to DesiringDragons Aug 4 2012, 1:04pm
    If they include the events of the War in the North - Hanzkaz Aug 4 2012, 1:06pm
        No ... just no ... ;-) DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 1:09pm
        I agree that there is enough for 4 movies. Escapist Send a private message to Escapist Aug 4 2012, 2:08pm
            Sorry - this article was so exciting Escapist Send a private message to Escapist Aug 4 2012, 2:13pm
        I do believe that Warner Brothers only has the rights to make three movies. Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Aug 4 2012, 2:29pm
            Not so Voronwë_the_Faithful Send a private message to Voronwë_the_Faithful Aug 4 2012, 2:50pm
                Thanks VF Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Aug 4 2012, 3:09pm
                    He said that about The Hobbit DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 3:11pm
                    I would be shocked if Jackson directed any further Middle-earth films after this Voronwë_the_Faithful Send a private message to Voronwë_the_Faithful Aug 4 2012, 3:12pm
                        I can't imagine more films after this either. DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 3:22pm
                        I wonder what other work of Tolkien's could successfully be adapted to film...? Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 4:18pm
                            Going by the Appendices - Hanzkaz Aug 4 2012, 4:51pm
                                Would love to see a story dealing with the explored regions of ME... Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 5:11pm
                                    I'd prefer a brief reference to the war in the north be included in the existing films than that a stand-alone film be made Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 5:23pm
                            Wasn't me (assuming you mean me, and not another Daniel). DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 5:45pm
                Certain Amount Of Tme JWPlatt Aug 4 2012, 5:10pm
                    Answer and perhaps another conspiracy theory SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 4 2012, 5:30pm
                        Ack! That's twice today I've spelled "rationale" as "rational" SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 4 2012, 5:47pm
                    A good question Voronwë_the_Faithful Send a private message to Voronwë_the_Faithful Aug 4 2012, 6:02pm
                        LOL. Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 4 2012, 6:06pm
                        Doesn't it strictly forbid the use of the character Glorfindel Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Aug 4 2012, 6:43pm
                        LOL II JWPlatt Aug 4 2012, 6:56pm
                            At your own risk Voronwë_the_Faithful Send a private message to Voronwë_the_Faithful Aug 4 2012, 6:59pm
                        Desolation of Smaug Sunflower Send a private message to Sunflower Aug 5 2012, 4:56am
    Bravo! I'm sold! Let me count the ways. Ruxendil_Thoorg Send a private message to Ruxendil_Thoorg Aug 4 2012, 1:47pm
        I hope it convinces others as well DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 2:04pm
    Um.... What? GoodGuyA Send a private message to GoodGuyA Aug 4 2012, 2:03pm
        See this thread DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 2:09pm
            I still doubt it's Gimli. Love his voice though! GoodGuyA Send a private message to GoodGuyA Aug 4 2012, 2:11pm
                Whether it is a physical role or just a voice cameo DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 2:12pm
    As a matter of preference, Escapist Send a private message to Escapist Aug 4 2012, 2:20pm
    Brilliant speculation! I hope the actual films are close to this as it Eruonen Send a private message to Eruonen Aug 4 2012, 2:57pm
    Well done Black Breathalizer Send a private message to Black Breathalizer Aug 4 2012, 3:20pm
    In all of this I hope that "The Hobbit" does not get lost. Kangi Ska Send a private message to Kangi Ska Aug 4 2012, 3:45pm
        It could, or it could enhance both trilogies into one continuous story. Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 4 2012, 7:09pm
            Agree completely with this Silverlode DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 7:22pm
                Looking at it... Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 4 2012, 7:41pm
            I thought it might be interesting - Hanzkaz Aug 4 2012, 7:26pm
            This is brilliant speculation Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 4 2012, 7:47pm
                The "quiet bits" Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 4 2012, 8:26pm
    Again well-written article, however Captain Salt Send a private message to Captain Salt Aug 4 2012, 3:50pm
        Since it's been described as a third Hobbit film DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 4 2012, 4:14pm
    The strength of the proposal SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 4 2012, 4:50pm
        "Killed by pirates is good" ;) DesiringDragons Send a private message to DesiringDragons Aug 4 2012, 5:19pm
            That was the same point I was making in a previous post.... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 5:34pm
                Apologies for having missed that. DesiringDragons Send a private message to DesiringDragons Aug 4 2012, 5:38pm
                Well if film 2 is to focus on Smaug SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 4 2012, 5:42pm
            Only if they're "man-in-suit" -- SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 4 2012, 7:52pm
    Two Disagreements.... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 4:50pm
        I don't want Sauron to be at the Battle of Five Armies Hanzkaz Aug 4 2012, 4:57pm
            I'd prefer that the killings of the Azog, the Great Goblin, and Smaug would be enough motivation for teh Goblins and Wargs.... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 5:13pm
                I wouldn't be surprised if Azog and his crew - Hanzkaz Aug 4 2012, 5:18pm
        Back when Benedict Cumberbatch Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 4 2012, 5:39pm
            I like that approach also... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 5:57pm
    A third film's impact on Film 2 Black Breathalizer Send a private message to Black Breathalizer Aug 4 2012, 5:19pm
    That third film still seems like a drag HiddenSpring Send a private message to HiddenSpring Aug 4 2012, 8:24pm
        Film 3 will likely include more than BOFA, IMO Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 4 2012, 8:31pm
            Film 3 has other key events.... Bladerunner Send a private message to Bladerunner Aug 4 2012, 10:21pm
                Good article Yngwulff Send a private message to Yngwulff Aug 4 2012, 10:25pm
    Contents Lurker in the Dark Send a private message to Lurker in the Dark Aug 5 2012, 3:06am
        Film 2 Yngwulff Send a private message to Yngwulff Aug 5 2012, 3:22am
        Interesting theory about Bard and Tauriel... SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 3:24am
            Isn't Bard married? Yngwulff Send a private message to Yngwulff Aug 5 2012, 3:30am
                Ah yes, but no (living) wife as far as I've heard SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 3:35am
                    Could imply Yngwulff Send a private message to Yngwulff Aug 5 2012, 3:40am
            Contents Lurker in the Dark Send a private message to Lurker in the Dark Aug 5 2012, 7:20am
                Why Gandalf chose Bilbo *SPOILER - COMIC CON FOOTAGE* Kassandros Send a private message to Kassandros Aug 6 2012, 4:35pm
        Frodo being meant to have the Ring.. Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 5 2012, 4:04am
            Unless Kili is revealed to be half-elven... SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 4:24am
                *snort* Well at least... Silverlode Send a private message to Silverlode Aug 5 2012, 4:33am
                    I just had a terrible thought... TheBeerBaron Send a private message to TheBeerBaron Aug 6 2012, 6:51am
                        Tauriel and Kili DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 6 2012, 7:14am
                            I thought we figured that was in jest TheBeerBaron Send a private message to TheBeerBaron Aug 6 2012, 7:19am
                                It's more real DanielLB Send a private message to DanielLB Aug 6 2012, 7:32am
                                    Thanks DLB TheBeerBaron Send a private message to TheBeerBaron Aug 6 2012, 7:35am
                                Highly improbable Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 6 2012, 3:27pm
        Prophecy and Tauriel Phibbus Send a private message to Phibbus Aug 5 2012, 4:05am
            Tauriel Lurker in the Dark Send a private message to Lurker in the Dark Aug 5 2012, 7:45am
        Gandalf picking Bilbo BeornBerserker Send a private message to BeornBerserker Aug 5 2012, 4:29am
        Nonsense Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 5 2012, 5:36am
        Tauriel and Bard innoce77 Send a private message to innoce77 Aug 6 2012, 8:33am
            Welcome out of lurkerdom innoce77 SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 6 2012, 5:16pm
                Divinely inspired Black Breathalizer Send a private message to Black Breathalizer Aug 6 2012, 8:24pm
                    Amen Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 6 2012, 11:11pm
                        yes Lusitano Send a private message to Lusitano Aug 7 2012, 1:24am
                        Love. lol AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 7 2012, 2:56am
        Prophecy appears in several places, most notably from Gandalf and Glorfindel, actually AinurOlorin Send a private message to AinurOlorin Aug 6 2012, 2:20pm
    Still not sure about that third film... Phibbus Send a private message to Phibbus Aug 5 2012, 3:17am
        Hee hee SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 3:32am
            Lucasian Structure JWPlatt Aug 5 2012, 4:39am
                *heh* I can't complain Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Aug 5 2012, 4:56am
                    Personal Canon JWPlatt Aug 5 2012, 5:11am
                Unconscious Bilbo Phibbus Send a private message to Phibbus Aug 5 2012, 5:06am
            But is it a good idea Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 5 2012, 5:42am
                The structure yes SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 7:06am
                    Makes sense Shelob'sAppetite Send a private message to Shelob'sAppetite Aug 5 2012, 5:15pm
                        Are you messing with me? SirDennisC Send a private message to SirDennisC Aug 5 2012, 10:09pm
        I'll give you a big "Amen!" for that last paragraph. Eowyn of Penns Woods Send a private message to Eowyn of Penns Woods Aug 5 2012, 4:38am
    I feel like I'm the odd man out on this. redgiraffe Send a private message to redgiraffe Aug 13 2012, 11:16am

 
 
 

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